Fenge Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 1 hour ago, Shamansky said: we actually don't know too much. Core rules without matched play rules, only 1 "formation" per armie/ It's too early to come to conclusions really. I know that geedubs will mess up (in fact they've already done) and will turn the game in neverending powercreep instead of balance, patching for patches and wow-new rules for wow-new-shiny-toys. As i see it, on the start of the 10th there will be only a sceleton of rules. And new 'formations' will be issued much later. So i'd wait for a while before making conclusions. yes we can hope for better detachments later on, but these will propably only come in the codex. and that is at least a year away from the 10th release date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamansky Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 19 hours ago, Fenge said: yes we can hope for better detachments later on, but these will propably only come in the codex. and that is at least a year away from the 10th release date. So, is that a reason to be at each other's throat already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 It's a mixed bag right now, and that's the problem.  People are latching onto parts because they can't see the whole.  What we do know: Take Aim! gives +1 BS Battlecannon doesn't have HEAVY, but it BS4, so Take Aim! brings all guns to BS3 Chimera with 2 HBs, with 2xHB HWTs embarked all fire at BS3. Now I hope we can bring back the turret Autocannon on a chimera... We haven't seen any infantry heavy weapons yet, so we don't know if they get HEAVY or not Born Soldiers Detachment gives LETHAL HITS on ranged attacks made by units that remained stationary We can take a TON more officers, as we're now limited to 3 per unit type, not 3 period. So that's 3 commissars, 3 command squads, 3 TCs, 3 Castellans, 3 DkoK Marshals, plus EPIC HEROES out the whazoo Grouping up infantry squads means we might need less orders. What we don't know: Will we have enough orders via splashing, or thru having enough officers to give orders to everything. Yes we can take a ton of officers, but each one is a trade off for a regular unit. From the VoC, it looks like orders do not splash, but from the orders overwriting other orders implies that they do (otherwise you'd just change the original order) Random musings: There's an implication here that Take Aim! is supposed to replace HEAVY, but it's not definite. With the game being less lethal, BS4 might be OK. In 9th, anything that got exposed just got picked up, but also LRBTs for most of 9th was 20-30% over-costed. So regular LRBTs were over-costed, under-powered and then just got picked up. In 10th, supposedly they will live longer, so BS4 is fine, as long as the price reflects the capability. Vox-caster not extending the range of orders (officer MODELS have to be within 6") implies we'll have to have officers leading from the front. That implies (to me) we'll have to have a bunch of them, or we'll have leaderless units, which in guard are pretty much worthless. Looking at the previewed mission, Born Soldiers is a big problem if guard are the attacker. Basically we lose our detachment rule if we have to move, and being on the attack means we have to move. Take Cover! and benefits of cover stack... and Take Cover! works vs. melee Emperor Ming and duz_ 1 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Ming Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 The detachment rules triggering on remaining stationary is a major gripe  Staying still is generally never a good choice  No other detachment rules require such nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 hours ago, Emperor Ming said: The detachment rules triggering on remaining stationary is a major gripe  Staying still is generally never a good choice  No other detachment rules require such nonsense In general I agree. However, I think there are caveats, like 20-man blob squads are going to live longer (supposedly), so (supposedly) we should be able to remain stationary more often because it will take longer to blast units.  As for the detachment rule... try hitting up the SW forum on their detachment rules. SWs seriously got boned hard, probably 2nd only to DG.  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sairence Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 (edited) Wyvern has Blast, Indirect, Heavy, Ignore Cover and Twin-Linked. So not just Sisters getting to outright ignore the indirect penalty. There's hope for the artillery park. Â It also gets a supression rule, giving a target unit -1 to hit. Â Oh, and 2D6 shots at BS4+ base. Edited June 2, 2023 by sairence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Ming Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 Yeah I just saw the wyverns datasheet,  Reduced to 2d6 hits from 4....2d6 hits isn't going to kill anything   Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted June 2, 2023 Author Share Posted June 2, 2023 [Twin-linked] gave wounding rerolls, but wyvern once had built-in wounding rerolls.  8th: 4D6 attacks with reroll to wound. 9th: 4D6 attacks. 10th: 2D6 attacks with reroll to wound. 11th: ? Emperor Ming 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Ming Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 minutes ago, Tokugawa said: 11th: ? Legends duz_ and OldWherewolf 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Bastone Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 (edited) Quote Chimera with 2 HBs, with 2xHB HWTs embarked all fire at BS3. Could you explain how?  I'm thinking it must be either Take Aim affects embarked passengers or chimeras and HWTs both have BS4+ and heavy.  My thinking is that Take Cover is going to be our best order for infantry. Improving guardsmen shooting is always kind of meh, having 4+ or 3+ guardsmen makes them more effective screens for the killy things. Edited June 3, 2023 by Sergeant Bastone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Sergeant Bastone said: Could you explain how?  I'm thinking it must be either Take Aim affects embarked passengers or chimeras and HWTs both have BS4+ and heavy.  My thinking is that Take Cover is going to be our best order for infantry. Improving guardsmen shooting is always kind of meh, having 4+ or 3+ guardsmen makes them more effective screens for the killy things. Firing Deck 2 on the Chimera, and units firiring out of a vehicle count as if the vehicle itself is firing. So 2 HWTs firing out of the chimera, and you only have to give the Chimera 1 order.  On another note... Scout Sentinel datasheet!  They mentioned that you can take up to 3 in a unit/squadron. With Daring Recon and a wyvern, you can ignore the cover penalty, AND the hit roll penalty. Wyverns on 2s!!! edit: 2s, not 3s Edited June 3, 2023 by OldWherewolf duz_ and Sergeant Bastone 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted June 3, 2023 Author Share Posted June 3, 2023 Scout sentinel 3+? Then how would armored be? 2+? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Taurox: duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Basilisk duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Leontus duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted June 3, 2023 Author Share Posted June 3, 2023 22 minutes ago, OldWherewolf said: Leontus No longer the crazy reroll machine, and become a more tactical unit. He absorbed "grand strategist" and "master tactician". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 (edited) Ratlings are AP2 D2, while the Eldar Ranger sniper rifle is AP1 D2.  Both are HEAVY, so ratlings need Take Aim! to hit on 2s, and both units have PRECISION. Interesting difference. Edited June 3, 2023 by OldWherewolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Important: Things that set a value happen first. So setting OC to 0 for battle shock comes first, then you add 1 for additional OC! duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 (edited) And... attach a platoon command squad to a cadian squad infantry squad and give those models Duty and Honor, and they have OC4! (2 base, 1 DaH, 1 Regimental Standard)    edit: can't attach a platoon command squad to a Cadian Shock Trooper squad Edited June 3, 2023 by OldWherewolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 2 hours ago, Tokugawa said: Scout sentinel 3+? Then how would armored be? 2+? Probably going to be T8 or have a damage mitigation rule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 I’m a bit disappointed the earthshaker is only S8 9 seems like it should have been the minimum.  disappointed the platoon command squad can’t lead CSTs, but that’s probably for the Cadian command squad. Emperor Ming 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldWherewolf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 (edited) edit:Â wrong image Edited June 3, 2023 by OldWherewolf duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Where are all of these coming from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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