Horus Heresy Legiones Astartes Command Squad Upgrades

[Gamiel]

3 hours ago, Etruscan said:

older Praetors work better as generic Praetors

Which of the older Praetors are you thinking of?

[Sothalor]

 

These guys.

[Noserenda]

Probably the least interesting command squad GW has ever released, the banners are nice, the arms are useful (Mostly because of how woefully limited the modern 30k kits are)  and the rest is mediocre at best. You compare that to any other marine, or even guard command squad kit we have seen over the years and it come off extremely badly.

Like, i can definitely see the case for cheaper sprues when they werent certain 30k was going to pull its weight but surely we can justify full kits and some variety in leg/body poses by now? 

(And yeah the older Praetors are objectively better, and better scaled too but thats barely on topic? ) 

[Nephaston]

33 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

Like, i can definitely see the case for cheaper sprues when they werent certain 30k was going to pull its weight but surely we can justify full kits and some variety in leg/body poses by now? 

Do we have any numbers on 30k yet or do we have to wait for one of those investor pdf thingies?

[Marshal Rohr]

1 hour ago, Nephaston said:

Do we have any numbers on 30k yet or do we have to wait for one of those investor pdf thingies?

There’s no solid way to extrapolate the numbers. When it dropped it looked like it outsold Dominion, but then N1SB did some more magic and it didn’t sell as much as Dominion. Jordan Sorcery did an interview with one of the designers (Rick or Andy C I believe) where they said GWs guiding philosophy is always to underestimate interest and print more later because people always came back and bought later if something ran out. 

[Nephaston]

15 minutes ago, Marshal Rohr said:

There’s no solid way to extrapolate the numbers. When it dropped it looked like it outsold Dominion, but then N1SB did some more magic and it didn’t sell as much as Dominion. Jordan Sorcery did an interview with one of the designers (Rick or Andy C I believe) where they said GWs guiding philosophy is always to underestimate interest and print more later because people always came back and bought later if something ran out. 

Interesting, so it's probably safe to assume that the design philosophy of 5-man sprue per mark supplemented by Upgrades will stick around until we hit some form of threshold only known to GW.

Then again I do really like the approach so far, and it's not like we're not drowning in marine kits anyway.

[Noserenda]

I think the biggest sign really is them pulling the trigger on the plastic SA range, certainly at the scale we are seeing. 

If we had dropped to one plastic marine sprue per quarter things would be a lot less rosy i think.

[Nephaston]

Good point about SA. Now all that is left is mechanicum and after that we can start refocusing on even more marine kits. Perhaps once all the 5-man marks are done we'll see 5-man artificer marks, this upgrade pack rechristened to specifically company command with a big kahuna legion command upgrade for the artificer kits. But that's just me wishlisting.

[Etruscan]

6 hours ago, Nephaston said:

Good point about SA. Now all that is left is mechanicum and after that we can start refocusing on even more marine kits. 

Ahem, the Sisters of Silence would like a word…

[Cadmus Tyro]

38 minutes ago, Etruscan said:

Ahem, the Sisters of Silence would like a word…

Pun intended? 

[Robbienw]

6 hours ago, Nephaston said:

Good point about SA. Now all that is left is mechanicum and after that we can start refocusing on even more marine kits.

Nah dude, Custodes are next!

[KaosRaptor]

Not that I have a horse in the 30k race, but this isn't a command squad. There's nothing to help a commander, y'know, command. No veteran sergeant advisor, no champion to duel enemy champions to keep the commander free, no apothecary to identify and aid casualties. It's a 30k Bladeguard and banner upgrade set.

 

Maybe a command squad is a different concept in 30k? Seems boring to me.

[Gorgoff]

1 hour ago, KaosRaptor said:

Not that I have a horse in the 30k race, but this isn't a command squad. There's nothing to help a commander, y'know, command.

 

They are the drinking buddies/ bodyguards of the commander and his banner bearer.

1 hour ago, KaosRaptor said:

No veteran sergeant advisor,

 

They are all veterans basically.

1 hour ago, KaosRaptor said:

 

no champion to duel enemy champions

 

They are all Chosen Warriors which allows them to do just that. But you definitely can paint and build one of them to stand out as the champion if you like.

Another one can be a vox operator.

The squad also has a huge variety of load outs to give to each Legion Chosen ranging from guns to dueling blades.*

 

1 hour ago, KaosRaptor said:

Maybe a command squad is a different concept in 30k? Seems boring to me.

Jokes aside the specialists you obviously miss are a seperate HQ in 30k. The Forgelord, Master of the Signal, Primus Medicea etc. pp can all be taken and, if you want to, added to the command squad.

I on the other hand always found it rather strange in 40k that you have to have all these specialist in one squad instead of putting them where they can help best. A Techmarine near vehicles and such, an apothecary in an assault squad and so on. 

So in 30k you are free to do that if you really want to but you can also spread threm through your army as you which.

I think that is a way better way of handling this.

 

*And this very fact is why this Command Set is boring and dull because you find nothing of those options in there apart from the most useless ones naming Power Swords and Combat Shields.

I guess GW wants to force the players to buy their other upgrade and weapon kits to get these. 

They promised a close combat set as well. We will probably see a lot of their options in there.

 

Edited March 30 by Gorgoff

[lansalt]

Yeah, this "command squad" is more of a buddies/bodyguards unit. With those helmets they even look like historical roman praetorian guards:
 

[KaosRaptor]

I see. So if you can get all sorts of upgrades for a command squad, then this set is almost entirely redundant other than the banners? Unless you want to go entirely sword and board?

 

Just such an odd release to me. But yeah given I have no investment in 30k it's entirely possible I just don't get it.

[Etruscan]

3 hours ago, Cadmus Tyro said:

Pun intended? 

I couldn’t say 

[MaximusTL]

mixed thoughts on this one. the standout by far is the banner and it's top ornamentation - really good looking IMO. I just hope that the banner patterns on the HH transfer sheets are the right size. i like the look of those powerswords, even if i wish they were axes. the shields are a swing and a miss. their shape is fine, but they're too thick and look clunky on actual models.  helms are nice, more arms are always good.

[01RTB01]

5 hours ago, KaosRaptor said:

I see. So if you can get all sorts of upgrades for a command squad, then this set is almost entirely redundant other than the banners? Unless you want to go entirely sword and board?

 

Just such an odd release to me. But yeah given I have no investment in 30k it's entirely possible I just don't get it.

It'll mesh with the upcoming close combat sprue. 

 

The command squad in 30k is minimum 3 man inc. banner upto 10 man. Each comes with Bolter, bolt pistol and chainsword, artificer armour and they're all vets.

 

They have options for any cc weapons/ combat shields/ combi weapons/ jump packs.

 

It really doesn't resemble the 40k CMD squad and all. Totally different concept. 

 

As for the kit, if it came with the cc sprue I'd cope. As a standalone set it's disappointing.

 

 

 

 

[SkimaskMohawk]

The best way to explain it (or it was, back when betrayal came out), was that the 30k "command" squad was really more equivalent to the honour guard you could make in 5th with artificer armour and a set of more offensive weapons (compared to the actual command squad that had an apothecary and easy access to storm shields). Both the honour and command squads were quite customizable at the time, which is still fairly true of the 30k version and reflected the lore of the command squad being the entourage of the HQ choice and suiting their particularities (hence the customization).

 

Now it's like, every command squad has a gun guy, bigger gun guy, and champion. Gotta get some equitable representation for the different doctrines or whatever.

[Xenith]

On 3/28/2024 at 3:04 PM, lansalt said:

Sadly those are combat shields. Breacher shields are bigger and have a different shape, although I bet they'll be also an upgrade sprue for MKIII

 

They look larger than normal or previous combat shields, and a unit on foot with those shields and bolters will read as breacher marines. I'm also sure it would be possible to extend them by 5-10mm with plasticard to size them better. 

[The Scorpion]

On 3/29/2024 at 1:49 PM, Sothalor said:

 

These guys.

It irks me that we never got a generic Tartaros Praetor, even when the Night Lords and Blood Angels got legion-specific ones.

 

4 hours ago, Xenith said:

 

They look larger than normal or previous combat shields, and a unit on foot with those shields and bolters will read as breacher marines. I'm also sure it would be possible to extend them by 5-10mm with plasticard to size them better. 

Agree, the shields are big enough

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

On 3/30/2024 at 12:08 PM, Etruscan said:

I couldn’t say 

Then do a pantomime instead.

[Etruscan]

58 minutes ago, Deus_Ex_Machina said:

Then do a pantomime instead.

 Would pantomine through the medium of emojis be acceptable? Given that I can't portray physical acting here...

[Mandragola]

I also have mixed feelings about this set. On the plus side it all seems pretty nicely done, for what it is. They've clearly had a brief of making the set work with existing (and perhaps future) armour sets. It does that by being pretty sparing with the details and that's a bit jarring as we're used to very fancy armour on command squads. They seem generic.

 

It's also a real shame they've gone for just a bunch of power swords rather than other weapons. This is a missed opportunity to create a sergeant/character upgrade set with axes, paired lightning claws, volkite pistols and so on. Apparently they're happy to leave that to third parties.

 

Actually the result is that I might end up buying several of these sets. I'd like to do a Templar force for my Imperial Fists and I think I can use these as the basis for Templar Brethren. I do have some of the old resin ones but it's a bit of a pain to merge them with the new Mk3s. Between this set, a few Fist and BT accessories and maybe some greenstuff caparisons I think I could have some very good templars. And I'd have plenty of nice flags and helmets to accessorise other models or maybe stick on ebay.

[The Scorpion]

1 hour ago, Mandragola said:

I also have mixed feelings about this set. On the plus side it all seems pretty nicely done, for what it is. They've clearly had a brief of making the set work with existing (and perhaps future) armour sets. It does that by being pretty sparing with the details and that's a bit jarring as we're used to very fancy armour on command squads. They seem generic.

 

It's also a real shame they've gone for just a bunch of power swords rather than other weapons. This is a missed opportunity to create a sergeant/character upgrade set with axes, paired lightning claws, volkite pistols and so on. Apparently they're happy to leave that to third parties.

 

Actually the result is that I might end up buying several of these sets. I'd like to do a Templar force for my Imperial Fists and I think I can use these as the basis for Templar Brethren. I do have some of the old resin ones but it's a bit of a pain to merge them with the new Mk3s. Between this set, a few Fist and BT accessories and maybe some greenstuff caparisons I think I could have some very good templars. And I'd have plenty of nice flags and helmets to accessorise other models or maybe stick on ebay.

It is not the worst idea.
If you play two armies, you may want two of the big banners.
That gives you 10 of the fancy combat shields and fancy-pattern power swords
Those basically auto-build a unit of 10 templars with the IF Mk6 helmets. Plus people may not use all their sword & shields, which may result in bits being available for cheap.