Codex: Space Marines | Multi-Part Intercessor & Vanguard Vet Teaser | Legends Culling

[Karhedron]

3 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

My general opinion is we took a solid L with blood angels in this index. The rules are indeed updated in the app.

 

Yup, I think I will be playing Space Wolves for a bit to get my power armour fix. The sons of Russ have come out much better with solid detachments and some decent datasheets. Logan is solid for 150 points and I can see him cropping up in a lot of lists (maybe I should play him before his points get nerfed  ). Grey Hunters also look really good with Battleline utility but damage output that is getting close to elite territory. Headtakers have been affected by the same wet noodle syndrome as BGVs but at least their hunting wolves can now be made part of the same unit allowing for some ablative wound shenanigans.

[HeadlessCross]

6 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

My general opinion is we took a solid L with blood angels in this index. The rules are indeed updated in the app.

 

dante losing the +1 to hit unit effect, not having his damage output tweaked and in return getting the ability to always be in two doctrines getting effects we had easy access too anyway sucks.

 

Mephiston is slightly better but also had stuff that was just always on now require psychic checks and coats a bunch more. Sanguinor basically unchanged, them messing up death company gear and sanguinary guard losing strength and ap.

 

anemic and completely uninspiring. Unsurprising tbh

Dante losing the +1 to hit is inconsequential because Sanguinary Guard, ya know the unit you want to join him to, now hit on a 2+. Blood Angels really aren't a loser here like Deathwatch and Black Templars, it's just that they and Space Wolves look bad to Dark Angels. 

[Blindhamster]

1 hour ago, HeadlessCross said:

Dante losing the +1 to hit is inconsequential because Sanguinary Guard, ya know the unit you want to join him to, now hit on a 2+. Blood Angels really aren't a loser here like Deathwatch and Black Templars, it's just that they and Space Wolves look bad to Dark Angels. 

He made them effectively immune to the -1 to hit stuff. 

 

I agree on Deathwatch getting it worst. Not on Templars.

[Orange Knight]

Sanguinary Guard are still solid. They look expensive but they are basically flying Victrix with an invul and a Str6 weapon instead of Str5.

 

I don't know how else you would price them. I understand that Victrix can stack rules via detachments and characters better.

 

I think BA have some over-costed characters, not all mind. But this does need to be addressed. Mephiston being a chief example - one of his psychic powers is also a bit niche.

Edited yesterday at 05:58 AM by Orange Knight

[DemonGSides]

13 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

He made them effectively immune to the -1 to hit stuff. 

 

I agree on Deathwatch getting it worst. Not on Templars.

 

Templars got it worse, they lost even more identity with going back to Combat Doctrines. But it's not really a competition of who got it worse, that's crab bucket mentality that gets no one anywhere.

 

I think they'll do better with codex/supplements once they come out, but it's hard to not be jealous of DA and somewhat of SW.

[HeadlessCross]

15 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

He made them effectively immune to the -1 to hit stuff. 

 

I agree on Deathwatch getting it worst. Not on Templars.

The -1 to hit in melee is significantly less prevalent though, you agree right?

[jaxom]

I feel bad looking at Blood Angel options. I think Blood Angels play-style benefited a lot from the changes to core Space Marine rule, units and detachments; and their own units  and detachment haven't received the same level of attention. That makes it harder to field what has been a traditional Blood Angels army without feeling like a big nerf. I think the second problem is, if one adjusts to this new reality while waiting for Blood Angels to get the attention they need, then it's playing Red Ultramarines without the power of Ultramarine characters.

[Orange Knight]

17 hours ago, jaxom said:

I feel bad looking at Blood Angel options. I think Blood Angels play-style benefited a lot from the changes to core Space Marine rule, units and detachments; and their own units  and detachment haven't received the same level of attention. That makes it harder to field what has been a traditional Blood Angels army without feeling like a big nerf. I think the second problem is, if one adjusts to this new reality while waiting for Blood Angels to get the attention they need, then it's playing Red Ultramarines without the power of Ultramarine characters.

 

I agree. As it stands, they are perfectly playable as a Marine army and can make use of powerful detachments and abilities, however thematically they are more dilluted.
You can still run Dante with some Vanguard and a Jump Captain with Sanguinary Guard and have a unique, powerful and mobile units, but the rest of the army will have to make use of other codex options to round off it's capability.

 

One big change we've seen is that things like Lethal and Sustained can no longer be applied carte-blanche against any unit, so the Marine options become more focused on a particular role.

This means that BA, like other Chapters, will need to rely on powerful Tanks, Dreads, Eradicators or Chainfist Terminators in order to deal with tough monsters and vehicles.

[HeadlessCross]

10 hours ago, Orange Knight said:

Rest of the army will have to make use of other codex options to round off it's capability.

That's because they're MARINES. Blood Angels isn't Sanguinary Guard and Death Company.