Brovius Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Unit of Paladin with Swords2+/3++ It appears not to be so. Katie at HO says that they're actually 5++, but since they come with swords by default they're considered 4++. Suddenly Paladins look a lot less interesting. ...and you're complaining about this? It's beter than us only having a 5+. The guys already have 2 wounds eack for 55pts, and can have varying weaponry. TDA-nob bikers, here I come! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justcar Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I think she might be confusing normal termies with paladins. Normal termies come with swords just like paladins, so by that logic they would be listed as having a 4++ too. In addition, they wouldn't make their stats listed as 4++ when that is caused by a piece of optional wargear. Just saying.... Though I intend to use the initiative advantage to kill all befor my paladins befor they can fight back. By the way, do the GK special characters come with a psychic hood? And if so, does the effect of aegis combine with psychic hoods to give GKs an advantage with their hoods? That would make sense... If anyone would care to hypothesize/ leak these answers I would appreciate it!! :D GKs are looking good though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhalyar Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...and you're complaining about this?It's beter than us only having a 5+. The guys already have 2 wounds eack for 55pts, and can have varying weaponry. TDA-nob bikers, here I come! I'm just going by my gut feeling, I'll leave mathhammer to when I actually have the codex in my hands. This said... It's a 5++ on a T4 unit that costs 55 points; for 75 points you can get them FNP but that won't save them from being gibbed by S8 ranged weapons. S8 AP2 is their absolute bane. You pointed out nob bikers, but they really don't compare. Bikers are innately mobile and turbo, but these either deepstrike, slug it on foot or buy the extra landraider. Point costs still rising. If you decide to keep the 4++ in assault (Swords), that means you don't have access to wound allocation tricks, save for one Warding Stave if you take it. Start using different weapons and now you're back to 5++ in and out of assault. To me it just seems like putting all your eggs in one basket that can be broken so very easily. Also, Katie is pretty adamant about it; she sure doesn't think she confused the Paladin and terminator stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oiad Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Probably best to just sit back and chuckle at rumours until the certainty of the final version comes along in April. Quite a few rechanges have occurred since this batch of rumours started out and the consensus on the rules now seems to be getting blurred. It's just got to the point where anything I read feels liable to change again within a few days time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justcar Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 It doesn't matter how adamant she is.... It would not make sense to list paladins as 4++ b/c of the sword bonus. It is an optional piece of wargear and so can be removed, which would lead to confusion and mistakes. In addition, normal termies come with swords. If paladins were listed as 4++ b/c of swords then so would normal termies. (unless normal GK termie armor starts with a 6++ (which it shouldn't)) :pinch: Of course, she could be right, but logically, it doesn't seem to make sense or be consistent with the way they have been writing codices. :) Overall, I think that paladins will end up as 2+/4++ standard (without wargear). They are supposed to be more elite anyway. They would (in my opinion) be very flawed with only a 2+/5+, as a TH/SS termie unit would be able to beat them when a paladin unit would cost more! That 4+ makes a big difference and I think that it will be included. :yes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhalyar Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Probably best to just sit back and chuckle at rumours until the certainty of the final version comes along in April. Quite a few rechanges have occurred since this batch of rumours started out and the consensus on the rules now seems to be getting blurred. It's just got to the point where anything I read feels liable to change again within a few days time... I agree; I'm not going to work out army compositions or anything like that. At this point I'm just amused to see how these little addendum to previous rumours largely change things. Plus it;s pretty clear that the documents that these people have access to is not even the final playtest list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Too much silly wargear to circumvent game mechanics. I do not like how this is turning out. Its like sticking duct tape over a leaking pipe, rather than welding it. I am a bit worried. This was always hinted at when everyone suddenly got USRs to distinguish themselves as 'unique'. Eventually having USRs was no longer unique enough and now we are seeing all this wargear and extra rules coming in to force a difference, when not all of it is needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synack Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I don't know where this 4++ rumour for paladins came from. Everyone that had access to info that I read about said they have a 5++, so anyone saying they have a 4++ is wishlisting. Its the exact reason I asked Katie to confirm for me. I'll post what I did on other forums too for more info: Some new info for you guys regarding Draigo's sword from Katie over at Heresy: "The Titansword: The Titansword is a master-crafted force weapon with the Daemonbane rule. Additionally, any close combat attacks that Draigo directs against a unit that contains one or more Daemons or Psykers are resolved at Strength 10." So first off, it isn't a Nemesis sword, so no +1 to invun, he just has a normal 3++ from his storm shield. Next thing is that Draigo doesn't have to actually be attacking a psyker or daemon to get S10, there simply needs to be one in the squad he is attacking to get S10. It's also a force weapon, which we didn't know before. Draigo is also fearless, which we didn't know before, but it's pretty pointless, as nothing else in the army is fearless, so he'll run away with what ever squad he's with anyway. Next, I asked Katie is Paladins had a 4++, after people on Dakka said they did. 1) It's 5++. Paladins don't have Iron Halos or anything like that. Naturally they have the force swords so it'll be better in close combat assuming one decides not to swap them out for something else. Which is the same as I have read everywhere too, so I don't know where this 4++ for paladins comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I hate Matt Ward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synack Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I hate Matt Ward. Just be glad Cruddance isn't writing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defiance Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Just got ahold of the final playtest PDF or whatever thats been floating around, and it looks super legit. Hope it's not a fake, or that most of these rules made it to print because they look awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oiad Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Yeah, quite a number of gamers seem to be getting a hold of this. Still, anything you see that's different from this list here? Now on v1.4 for everyone else. I agree; I'm not going to work out army compositions or anything like that. At this point I'm just amused to see how these little addendum to previous rumours largely change things.Plus it;s pretty clear that the documents that these people have access to is not even the final playtest list. Hehehe, tis a shame. I was starting to think about a Purifier army with Crowe at lead. Maybe a GKT/Paladin backup squad, interchangeable with an ][ depending on the foe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defiance Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 mostly reading through it for the fluff blurbs it has on all units, but no i have not been able to spot anything different so far. I will keep looking and report if I see stuff out of place with what's been said. I will say this, you can tell it's a matt ward codex and it looks like from my limited intel of reading that these aint your Dad's grey knights! trafficking with xenos! say it aint so grand masters. Also they look to be about codex size now :tu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oiad Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Thank you, not that I feel it's great news either - if this is true it will again support my suspicions that Matt Ward (+ Alan Merrett & his younger team members in general) really disliked the old, mystical elite stance of the Grey Knights. If they wanted a codex chapter with a high percentage of psykers they should have put out Codex: Blood Ravens instead of potentially stuffing this up for those of us that liked the 3rd Ed' take on their fluff. -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ETP Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 could you perhaps give us a taste of what some of the henchmen are costed at? and im dying to know if the grand master and librarian are forced to be terminators or if artificer or even power armor are available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defiance Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Okay the fluff blurb for lord kaldor draigo is truly truly epic. Just to give a little hint, he fights the deamon primarch mortarion and carves his heart with his sword. And that's a throwaway piece in the whole fluff blurb. serioulsy this whole thing reeks of matt ward. Draigo fights the deamon prince M'kar and gets sucked into the warp with him when he banishes him, but is not corrupted and slaughters thousands (what????) of deamons and is still doing so. Crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defiance Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 all the hechman warband members seem t be around the 5-15 point mark. crusaders 15 deathcult15, warrior acoylte 4, deamonhost 10, banisher 5 before eviscerator. The jokearo is 35. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ETP Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 thank you for the fast reply. im insanely jealous that you have that to read through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gil galed Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 just finished reading the beta-codex, dear god some of the fluff is awful, specifically Immortal Justicar Thawn and imma kill everything Draigo (the mortarion bit seems like it must be a type, it makes little grammatical sense, I feel it should be the he vows to carve his name into mortarions heart or else mortarion carved his name into Draigo's predecessors heart) . At least the fluff for Crowe explains why he has the demon weapon. Mordrak is... interesting... and by interesting I mean rip off of LotD although the general theme of special characters seems to be: squad goes down to deamon planet, everyone dies but named character, named character kills everything. :/ Having read it i'm generally less excited because A) I really wanted to be able to use my IST squads B ) I wanted my grey knights to be able to teleport c) different weapons giving different things means i'll either have to remodel of else just rock whatever my models have ~Gil -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oiad Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Gil, you're not alone on your conclusions, having heard the fluff on Mordrack. ;) Okay the fluff blurb for lord kaldor draigo is truly truly epic. Just to give a little hint, he fights the deamon primarch mortarion and carves his heart with his sword. And that's a throwaway piece in the whole fluff blurb. serioulsy this whole thing reeks of matt ward. Draigo fights the deamon prince M'kar and gets sucked into the warp with him when he banishes him, but is not corrupted and slaughters thousands (what????) of deamons and is still doing so. Crazy. Talk about something being both awesome and ridiculously stupid at the same time. There was the post on B&C once about how if Matt Ward go his hand on the codex he'd have Grand Masters uppercutting Angron to death, while making Khrone cry. Or something similar. Based this rumour, that joke wasn't far from the truth after all... ...will have to try and find it again sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gil galed Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Talk about something being both awesome and ridiculously stupid at the same time. There was the post on B&C once about how if Matt Ward go his hand on the codex he'd have Grand Masters uppercutting Angron to death, while making Khrone cry. Or something similar. Based this rumour, that joke wasn't far from the truth after all... ...will have to try and find it again sometime. I kid you not, Draigo while in the warp: 1/ Kills a greater deamon with a broken sword 2/ Kills the chosen blood thirster of Khorne bare handed (I assume given his sword gets broken before he gets warped) before 'cleansing its axe' with holy flame and forging a new sword 3/ Kills the six chosen deamonettes of Slanesh 4/ Kills 'thousands of deamons 5/ Is permanently trapped in the warp and only sees the grey knights when they fight on worlds that have been sucked into the warp 6/ Everything is now so scared of him in the warp only the 'crazed minions' of khorne bother 7/ in his first ever battle as a battle brother he kills a deamon prince and prizes for 8/ He carves his predecessors name into the heart or mortarion .... seriously ;)? ~Gil ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oiad Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 EDIT - Silly me - acting without thinking. Taken the link down in order not to cause controversy with the mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vann Harl Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Do you think Warp Quake will be in effect if the GK's are in a vehicle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brovius Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Gil, you're not alone on your conclusions, having heard the fluff on Mordrack. :lol: Okay the fluff blurb for lord kaldor draigo is truly truly epic. Just to give a little hint, he fights the deamon primarch mortarion and carves his heart with his sword. And that's a throwaway piece in the whole fluff blurb. serioulsy this whole thing reeks of matt ward. Draigo fights the deamon prince M'kar and gets sucked into the warp with him when he banishes him, but is not corrupted and slaughters thousands (what????) of deamons and is still doing so. Crazy. Talk about something being both awesome and ridiculously stupid at the same time. There was the post on B&C once about how if Matt Ward go his hand on the codex he'd have Grand Masters uppercutting Angron to death, while making Khrone cry. Or something similar. Based this rumour, that joke wasn't far from the truth after all... ...will have to try and find it again sometime. I think at one point, Cannoness Celestia and I were joking about how the Grey Knights were secretly founded from the Ultramarines, plus a whole lot to do with Marneus Greygar and the Gauntlets of Titanmar being the only thing preventing the Daemonically-possessed Tyranid hive fleet from annihilating the Imperium. There's been quite a lot of those Ward Knights jokes on here in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Doctor Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 edit-QUOTE REMOVED UPON REQUEST Being a Grey Knight player whom was enticed into the hobby by these shiny guys (hey I was eleven, now im nineteen and not a lot has changed) and i must say i have tears welling in my eyes from only the first 3 pages of this pdf. enough said. though i retain the right to change my mind upon further investigation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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