[HH1.0] Iron Hands Tactics

[Terminus]

The Volkite one is not bad. That chassis of Knight is a bit more durable having a flare shield built into the ion shield.

 

The Magaera is awful because it objectively has the worst weapon option possible. The Styrix actually has a nice gun and a grav gun secondary is nice too. The weakness of both chassis is that despite being Questoris they apparently can't take carapace weapons. So while they may be a bit tougher to shoot, they are less scary in the shooting phase. The Styrix does alright though.

 

A secondary weapon would really help the Lancer and Castigator too. The former still makes for a great melee warlord in larger games where he has appropriate targets, but the latter just sucks in every way. I would pay 25 points for a laspistol option if it had it.

[Bmseifer]

Oh thats unfortunate since I recently bought the atropos because the model looked awesome.

[Charlo]

Just means you need to buy at least one more Knight and run them as an Allied Detachment of Questoris Knights!

[Flint13]

One key point to keep in mind for the two smaller Mechanicum Knights too (the Styrix and Maegara) is their Initiative 2.

 

Knights do the most damage in close combat, but non-Mech Knights get to swing first in knight on knight combat instead of the more common mutual destruction of both combatants.

 

That's why the lancer is so awesome. He's the only giant mech that can jump to ini5 to get those swings in before the compitition. Well him and leviathans :lol:

[Charlo]

Why the Ad Mech ones can't take two guns i'll never know then.

 

Double Choom Knight would have been the dreammm

[Bmseifer]

Can the 'regular' knights be used in a allied knight detachment? Like the paladin or crusader (have 4 of those)

 

And would that detachment count as a Low choice?

[Terminus]

Fret not, we will get that big Porphyrion mega blaster guy soon.

 

Oh thats unfortunate since I recently bought the atropos because the model looked awesome.

I was specifically talking about the Castigator who only has a single weapon, so must charge what he shoots, limiting his use. If he even had just a stubber, he could shoot up one unit (or a flyer or a vehicle), and then charge another unit to shred it with their sword.  As it is, he's either underwhelming, or overkill, so often inefficient.

 

The Lancer kind of has the same problem, but its melee buffs make it a great choice for charging into nasty melee blobs and characters. Scion upgrade almost mandatory for that, though.

 

The Acheron is AMAZING. It has the heavy bolter for secondary targets, it has a chainfist for obliterating the crap out of vehicles even more so than regular D. The template is enormous and with clever targeting you can tag multiple targets (and with S7 ordnance it's not too shabby against most AV either).

 

The Atropos is also super sweet, it has the lightsaber and the vortex cannon, most definitely the coolest Knight of them all.  Definitely no regrets in that purchase.

[Charlo]

Well it depends.

 

You can take two Knights as a LoW choice (excluding the Atropos).

 

OR you can use your allied detachment as Questoris Knights, so you take a HQ knight and a Troops knight (and some changes to Their stats and points values etc because of this). This could include an Atropos, but then you couldn't take any other allies.

[Teun135]

With Prospero coming out, we get a lot of new plastic toys we can use in the Iron 10th. That means I have questions... best Tartaros squad setups? Are they best used like regular termies, with chainfists for murdering big things?

[Emperors Teeth]

I think it's important that (almost) every squad include at least some contingency for encountering enemy units that aren't their preferred target. Such as always having a power fist or ideally melta bombs on a Tactical Sergeant. The same applies to Terminators. For the sake of 10 points, sticking a chainfist in a unit seems a no-brainer.

[Teun135]

I think it's important that (almost) every squad include at least some contingency for encountering enemy units that aren't their preferred target. Such as always having a power fist or ideally melta bombs on a Tactical Sergeant. The same applies to Terminators. For the sake of 10 points, sticking a chainfist in a unit seems a no-brainer.

 

I think some would argue that if you have a squad in a situation like that, then your enemy has already won by forcing a combat that isn't in your favor. But I am with you on that point, I am an old army grunt myself so contingency is a big deal to me.

 

My main point was what would be an effective load out for the squad? Should Tartaros even bother with the heavy weapons such as the autocannon? Should they go heavy on twin LCs? What plays to their strengths?

[Memento Of Prospero]

Lightning claws have no value when you have access to power fists/axes. Ap3 is the deabreaker here. They are so corner case in their application that they best asset is that they look so damn good.

 

The reason is simple. What will your toughest troops engage? Marines possibly, your opponent's toughest troops most definitely. You have to be able to deal with 2+ saves with that unit, otherwise you will just lose that match up.

 

Legion terminators unless deepstriking dont have good durability on the onset of a game. Their best offensive weapon is the plasma blaster, the autocannon cant scratch the paint off of most transports in the heresy. Their value increases as your opponent's means of dealing with them decrease. They are great clean up crews.

 

Which brings me to my next point. Tartaros are a GREAT base to convert into gorgons. Gorgons have a baked in Feel no Pain and a free thunder hammer for the sergeant plus that neat little rule that can sometimes throw a wrench in your opponent's plans.

 

The only downside to them is lack of squad wide combi weapons options. Which I still dont get.

Edited October 23, 2016 by Wolf_Pack

[Charlo]

Probably so Legion terms are still a valid option to IH etc. Plus you get relentless nifty grav guns.

 

But yeah, outside of a combi Salvo, gorgons > Tartaros

[Teun135]

That's a good idea, I can run them as Gorgons with a little bit of careful converting. Unfortunately I didn't see any Iron Hands specific Tartaros shoulder pads in the FW store, so I'll just have to be creative.

[Luna707]

For a ten man Gorgon meat grinder unit, would you guys reccomend all fists or have a couple axes in there? Also heavy flamers or grav?

[Memento Of Prospero]

Use the Cataphractii ones, it will make them imposing.

 

My two cents of Gorgons. Unless I know I'll have t stack chainfists, I go 1 chainfist per 3 models. Also, unless I know I'll be facing things that need to be flushed out of cover (read Solar Auxilia) Grav guns every day.

[Emperors Teeth]

I use cataphractii combibolters & axes. They look super-badass imo

 

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj311/Emperors_Teeth/th_20160410_181614_zpsgs5rrvxv.jpg http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj311/Emperors_Teeth/th_20160820_080932_zpsp9vypzmi.jpg

[Charlo]

You aren't wrong!

[Memento Of Prospero]

Yeah, mixing weapon kits is a great way to add a bit more customization to your models.

 

If you dont like the cataphractii shoulderpad idea, you can always use the brass etch for shoulder markings, they are great

[SkimaskMohawk]

Always go fists. For 5 points over an axe you get +3 strength, along with the threat instant killing most characters. A unit of 10 can threaten a ton of things, even with just glances; chainfists are a decent 1/3 in this case.

[Luna707]

So I have two Gorgon options to run with my praetor, could you all help me with deciding?

 

 

1. 445 point Gorgon Unit

 

- 9 termies, 1 Hammerbearer 

- 4 fists, 1 chainfist

- 2 graviton guns

- cyber familier 

 

 

OR

 

 

2. 480 point Gorgon Unit

 

- 9 termies, 1 Hammerbearer 

- 7 fists, 2 chainfist

- 2 graviton guns

- cyber familier 

 

 

 

Also is a grenade harness worth the points in this kind of squad? I really don't want to saturate the unit with fists if I don't have to, I love the look of the Gorgon axe, but is it necessary to run effective Gorgons?

[Memento Of Prospero]

In my experience, no. Not unless you are expexting really hard targets like fire drakes or big stompy robots. Wounding MEQs on 3s instead of 2s is not a deal breaker. Especial with the availability of rad grenades and Autek Mor.

 

Grenade harness is meh. Of you run them with a mix of axes and Chainfists, make sure you apply a healthy amount of fire power to their faces before sending in the sexiest janitorial force the imperium has every devised. That is what we do best. We are the original tank company.

 

The Flesh is weak, there is only the Machine.

Through the machine we gain Superiority.

Through Superiority we gain the power of Attrition.

Throught Attrition our Enemies are Broken.

 

The cold calculating arithmetic of War shall bring us Vengeance!

[Teun135]

Slightly different direction: Can we be effective in ZM without Breachers or Immortals or are those the name of the game in Zone Mortalis?

[Memento Of Prospero]

Gorgons do well in ZM with inbuilt feel no pain. Also you get more opportunity for their blind to make a difference as well. Our passive actually matters since we bring lots of troops. and there is more small arms fire involved. Purchase Void Hardened armour on legion heavy support squad and they get get pretty good.

Edited October 26, 2016 by Wolf_Pack

[RandomMarine]

Gonna pick up the baneblade kit on Wednesday I'm torn between the much dakka party bus (stormlord) or the D. What are peoples thoughts?

 

I see it like this the stormlord makes a brilliant mobile bunker loaded up how I'd do it comes in @ 1k ish thats a lot of points in one basket. Imagine outflanking with 20 heavy choom and 10 terminators

 

The shadowsword well its got the D I'd probably get a upgrade sprue for the extra sponsor.