MakoBoy88 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Well 2 Laser Vindis would obviously mean I ditch my Lascannon team No offence Slips but I'm not a fan of Missile Launchers, no idea why but can't see me making a unit of them. So maybe I need to drop them and save the points. But then I am missing large anti infantry blasts. So maybe Laser Vindi, plus Medusa? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 A Deredeo covers you for AA whilst also providing good firepower for knocking down light - medium tanks and harassing infantry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Well 2 Laser Vindis would obviously mean I ditch my Lascannon team No offence Slips but I'm not a fan of Missile Launchers, no idea why but can't see me making a unit of them. So maybe I need to drop them and save the points. But then I am missing large anti infantry blasts. So maybe Laser Vindi, plus Medusa? But , Bro , How you gonna turn down Dem Shark Launchers You can even make TEMPLAR SHARK LAUNCHERS LtDan 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Imperial Fists get Tank Hunters on their Heavy Support squads, correct? Surely one of the most point effective options are the Humble Auto-Cannons. 160 points for 10 Str7, Tank Hunting shots. This seems really great to me, I'm surprised people aren't considering it more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I too hate the appearance of the 30K Missile Launchers, the 40K ones are much more preferential for me, and one of the things which turns off the Scorpius as a model, so much that I use the Hunter model from 30K if I run one. What I don't like about Missiles either is that their Anti Infantry is rather desultory, (small blast, direct fire, no ignires cover) their Anti Tank lacks even AP2 so the best you can do is hope to Immbolise or Blow off a weapon, and Flakk is only S7 and you have to pay for the additional use, but don't get Interceptor (natively, anyway). If they gained AP2 or +1 to penetration a week, and Flakk Missiles for free, they'd be okay. The problem is, missiles, unlike back in 3rd-5th which could comfortably batter vehicles, and hordes were actually hordes. What I'm hoping is for Monster Hunter Missile Launchers for Dark Angels, that could be rather cool for taking on Daemon Princes and Castellax. On things like Siege Tyrants, it is different because you get a 2+/4++ Relentless Split Fire unit with Combi bolters and power fists. It is worth bearing in mind that Vindicator Squadrons are only rumoured, and there is a 30pt 'tax' to give them Machine Spirit to let them choose another target from the unit, so you are looking at around 165pts to take a Vindi TD with a Combi Bolter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakoBoy88 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 All very good points. But I have to agree with Hesh. And fundamentally, lasers are cooler than missiles. So. There's that. ;) 30 Breachers ordered today to replace my SA order and start a Fists army. Blame the lady in my town who just sold me some Phalanx Warders. And Slips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 If I was running fists I think my Heavy Supports would be made up of: 2 Vindi Laser Destroyers, 1 Deredeo, 1 unit of 5 - 10 Heavy Weapon Marines with Auto Cannons (So cheap for the firepower with TH). All bases covered, and making use of the unique rules the IF get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 (edited) you gotta think though , if your gonna take a heavy weapons team you need atleast a bunker Its just my own personal leaning but I prefer to run Sicaran Venator, Sicaran Battle Tank, Deredeo or Sicaran Venator, Sicaran Battle Tank , Sicaran Battle Tank but again thats because ive seen heavy weapons teams sorta get focus fired down due to how scary they are to the opponent That being Said Id prolly run 2 laser vindicators in that third slot if the rumor about squading them up is true Edited February 18, 2016 by Bladewolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 (edited) Well, they can be placed in a ruin for a 4+ save, and an independent character can be placed with the unit to buff them. A Master of Signal with a 2+ save for example? I just think that 160 points for 10 Str 7 Tank Hunting shots is better value than most things. It's even cheap to put this kind of unit together money wise lol. And hell, it seems a lot of people are stocking up on Grav... maybe vehicles aren't the only viable option :-P Edited February 18, 2016 by Ishagu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Grav is available in two, maybe 3 flavours. There are other options, but these are the best. First is Rapiers, which are static, but have 36" range, and big templates where you need to scatter quite badly to miss- on a Spartan (4" across?), if you scatter, you have 2d6-4-2.5-2, meaning that only a 1/3rd of all scatters, assuming the worst direction possible along the narrowest part, means that its like no more than 1/12 which actually miss their target. Next is maybe the Grav Speeders. They provide the cheapest access to Grav in the legions; 65pts for a shot, and can even Deep Strike and Jink. The problem with that is that they are 2HP AV10 open topped vehicles, equipped with a Blast Weapon. 20 Interceptor Bolters are risky; 13 hits, 2 Glances, while a Deredeo is possibly going to kill 3 or 4, or at least forcing a jink and stopping the unit shooting. The options are Grav Dreadnoughts in a Pod. In whatever combination you prefer. These guys carve up armour, and even more so now with the FAQ allowing Chainfists to no longer be specialist on a Dread, so they don't have to choose between AV or normal melee. With 18", relentless, and either a 5+ Cover or 5++ Invulnerable, they are likely to survive one turn of firepower, and they dishout 2 HP of damage a turn. Although smaller in size, they may have a BS5 chassis which helps. It is also available from turn 1. I like to take 2 such dreads, because that is usually not only 4 HP in the first turn, but allows me to gib the transport and assault the noobs who thought they were safe. It also helps to clear out back field units like Rapiers, Heavy Weapons squads, Medusa Vindi TD's or a Sicaran Venator, by being an AV12+ bully packing 5 at Initiative S10 attacks with 2D6 to pen on the charge. You can drop it to 8 shots and get interceptor (18") though. 160 Pts for 10 S7 AP4 Shots could be quite good if Interceptor, Skyfire or Haywire, but I don't think AV11 is popular enough to be used. That 160pts is going up against a Sicaran as well, which has similar chances of damaging things, ignores jink, is fast, and relentless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakoBoy88 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Auto canons look the part, by really all they are going to do is Glance AV13 down. Because there is usually 1 maybe 2 Rhinos on the board. Barely anyone locally runs speeders or Pods or even Flyers. But that may change with a lot more people surfacing. The more I look, 2 laser Vindis would be awesome, a Sicaran is never a bad thing. From a pain the Arse point of view, I have 2 Sicarans and Scorpius for my Iron Hands and didn't want to rely on tanks. Wanted a mix. Need things to reliably bring down Raiders, as my primary opponents tend to run Proteus' en mass. So either LadCannons, LaserVindi or something are mandatory. Leviathan is also non optional as it's too cool (Even if it did get 1 shotted last night) Maybe Autocannon dudes are the next thing. Could look sick on a table. A Bunker is a nice idea, I know Michael from EoH runs them with a Bunker but I can't see the benefit for points really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 That's a prime example of units dictated by Meta. In my local scene there's Raiders and Spartans of course, but mostly one per army. A lot more av 11 - 13 knocking on the tables, so the tank hunting auto-cannons would be very effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phalanx Warder Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Imperial Fists get Tank Hunters on their Heavy Support squads, correct? Surely one of the most point effective options are the Humble Auto-Cannons. 160 points for 10 Str7, Tank Hunting shots. This seems really great to me, I'm surprised people aren't considering it more. I run a 10 mn squad in most games and they always perform in the hull point stripping game... to the point people have stopped bringing land speeders against me Ishagu 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Include master of signal to add +1bs and Interceptor and that will be a fearsome unit. It's so simple and effective it makes me want to include them as an allied contingent... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) You can drop a Heavy weapon for An augury scanner anyway and save the inevitable 100+pts sank into him. And no MOS Allied as they are Support Officers Edited February 19, 2016 by Hesh Kadesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Yeah I know... I kinda want Sigismund too lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caillum Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Don't need to drop the heavy weapon for an augury scanner. On the Tactical Support Sergeant, he must swap, but not the Heavy Support Sergeant. I feel like going for gold with them is the best way to go. 8 models, lascannons, Bunker. Add a MoS if you want to. They'll be protected and punch through most armour with S9 and Tank Hunters. Hesh Kadesh 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TemujinZero Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) You don't drop anything for an augury scanner. Edit: way too slow Edited February 19, 2016 by TemujinZero MakoBoy88 and Hesh Kadesh 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakoBoy88 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 I'm actually thinking Autocannons are pretty sweet. Whether they perform or not they look sick. Phalanx Warder and Hesh Kadesh 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phalanx Warder Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 I'm actually thinking Autocannons are pretty sweet. Whether they perform or not they look sick. Yes they do! Hesh Kadesh 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 An autocannon in my head is like the equivalent of something like rapid firing 76mm shell. I'm assuming that there's a difference between what a Predator is packing, (outside of the fact it's Heavy 4; essentially as fast as an Assault Cannon XD, the equivalent of a something like a Vulcan 30mm Cannon), but that you've got a squad of 8ft tall Space Marines carrying 10 rapid firing firing tank guns between them. Basically, 10 of these firing something like 5-10 a second XD if what I've got in my head https://youtu.be/q7qm4jgqDxE?t=1m40s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakoBoy88 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Yes. Yes I should absolutely be buying these I think! Phalanx, your yellow is amazing. How?? Phalanx Warder 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 See Im still skeptical of running an autocannon team , I feel like for what they do you are better off with tanks then again , now that weve moved into the fact that grav can be spammed its all so difficult. I am inspired by Phalanx Warders Autocannon dudes tho .. so maybe I should just bite the bullet and make some. Phalanx Warder 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakoBoy88 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Haha let's all just do it ;) !! Iv also just noticed that Stone Gauntlet means that you cannot take more elites or troops. So I can't take my 3 elites and only two troops This is a sad day :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 Good thing Phalanx Warders are non-compulsory troops and Fast Attack too in this scenario :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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