[HH1.0] Emperor's Children Tactica

[Charlo]

 

I really don't understand the obsession with combat squads in pods. If you're dropping that close some form of good short ranged dakka wins - plas tac support/ seekers with combi delights and so on.

 

I think a dreadclaw would mitigate that problem to some extent. T1 drop, flat out (18"), jink, T2 move (6"), disembarking (6"), and then charge (up to 12"); it seems the unit doesn't need to be so close to the short-ranged strong dakka in T1.

 

Though I admit I may be wrong cause I haven't used a dreadclaw yet (it's still under construction in my room-forgeworld;)).

 

 

You have it right :)

 

Normal pods for dakka units, dreadclaws for Assault.

[Spangle]

I'm thinking about a dreadclaw myself, but wondering what unit to put inside it. I guess it's between Phoenix Guard, Palatine blades or some furious charge veterans, but I just can't put my finger on it - how do people run theirs? Or are they even worth it for the ECs? I feel our units hit hard, but don't really have any staying power, so I'm feeling the 'claw could be a cheap option to get them into combat.

[MorgothNL]

I'm thinking about a dreadclaw myself, but wondering what unit to put inside it. I guess it's between Phoenix Guard, Palatine blades or some furious charge veterans, but I just can't put my finger on it - how do people run theirs? Or are they even worth it for the ECs? I feel our units hit hard, but don't really have any staying power, so I'm feeling the 'claw could be a cheap option to get them into combat.

To me the claw proves it's worth every single game. I never really put Phoenix Guard inside cause I think Phoenix Guard need to be numbering more than 5 or have some type of HQ with them to give them more punch, flexibility and/or staying power. My Phoenix Guard always go in my Eagle.

 

In the dreadclaw you can put anything else really, whatever you need and like.

The passengers I give it:

1 Eidolon

8 Veterans (furious charge, meltabombs, few power weapons)

1 apothecary (artificer armour, power weapon)

 

or 

 

1 Eidolon

5 Command squad (weapons of choice, meltabombs)

1 Apothecary

 

or 

 

1 Edidolon

9 Palatine Blade squad (4-5 spears)

 

 

Most of the time I run option 1 or 2. I still use palatine models for all these options, and I am a bit short on anti-tank in my list. The meltabomb veterans or meltabomb command squad solve that problem. They have, so far, never failed to destroy the target they were after when assaulting from the pods with their meltabombs and Eidolons hammer. Option 1 and 2 also both allow for an apothecary, which increases staying power (and command squad are 2+ save already).

I'd say the command squad is my favourite choice, nice elite unit with a cool looking banner (though I use the same banner for the vexilla in a veteran squad). The main plus the veterans have is the fact that they are scoring. But since this unit never really ends up chasing objectives for me anyways, thats rarely a problem when taking the command squad).

 

Ps.

Yes I have seen the FAQ draf that says that only 1 grenade/meltabomb is allowed in close combat. but that's not official and I don't think it will be like that in the final version. Consensus in my meta is that that would be stupid and we'd only adhere to it in a tourney.

Edited July 2, 2016 by MorgothNL

[GriffonI92]

Can I attach an Apothecary to a Kakophani unit? 

 

I am thinking of dropping the Rhinos with my Kakophani in favor of Apothecarys as the Kakophani already have Relentless and the Apothecarys can give them Feel No Pain along with slapping Augury Scanners on them. 

[Joe]

Did they actually get around to buffing the Kakophani then? Because last I heard they were still out of favour with most lists.

[MorgothNL]

Can I attach an Apothecary to a Kakophani unit? 

 

I am thinking of dropping the Rhinos with my Kakophani in favor of Apothecarys as the Kakophani already have Relentless and the Apothecarys can give them Feel No Pain along with slapping Augury Scanners on them. 

No they can not be joined by an apothecary.

 

 

Did they actually get around to buffing the Kakophani then? Because last I heard they were still out of favour with most lists.

Yeah, with the new ROW they get quite the buff (becoming troops and gaining relentless).

[heptus]

Can I attach an Apothecary to a Kakophani unit? 

 

I am thinking of dropping the Rhinos with my Kakophani in favor of Apothecarys as the Kakophani already have Relentless and the Apothecarys can give them Feel No Pain along with slapping Augury Scanners on them. 

 

You gotta bring a primus medicae for this, not an apothecary.

[01RTB01]

Did they actually get around to buffing the Kakophani then? Because last I heard they were still out of favour with most lists.

They've been amazing for a few months now. 2 shots was the update. Rite of war in book 6 makes them troops choices with relentless. What's not to love?!

[Joe]

Yeah, with the new ROW they get quite the buff (becoming troops and gaining relentless).

They've been amazing for a few months now. 2 shots was the update. Rite of war in book 6 makes them troops choices with relentless. What's not to love?!

Goes to show how long it's been since I last looked at the EC's rules. >_> Which RoW is that? I might have to have a fiddle with that.

[Slips]

Its the 3rd Company Elite RoW found in book 6.

[Charlo]

Makes a pretty great allied detachment too!

 

Kakaphoni as troops and some Palatine blades with Eidolon or something work as an amazing addition to most forces, especially slower ones.

 

Plus no Troops Tax!

Edited July 4, 2016 by Charlo

[heptus]

It's undoubtedly good ROW, though I miss some fortification shenanigans that may allieviate the gets-hot risk.

 

Still my favorite ROW and the reason to start 30k :)

[Caustic63]

It's undoubtedly good ROW, though I miss some fortification shenanigans that may allieviate the gets-hot risk.

 

Still my favorite ROW and the reason to start 30k

 

The 3rd Company RoW does not stop you from taking Fortifications. Indeed, I generally take an Aegis Line or Bunker to try and mitigate some of the Gets Hot! that is inconvenient when fielding lots of Kakophoni. 

[heptus]

 

The 3rd Company RoW does not stop you from taking Fortifications. Indeed, I generally take an Aegis Line or Bunker to try and mitigate some of the Gets Hot! that is inconvenient when fielding lots of Kakophoni. 

 

My god Slaanesh! That's so exciting - I have no idea how I confused the ROW limitation.

 

Thank you so much for the correction, Caustic63  I gotta re-paint my ol' good bunker.

Edited July 4, 2016 by heptus

[Terminus]

Makes a pretty great allied detachment too!

 

Kakaphoni as troops and some Palatine blades with Eidolon or something work as an amazing addition to most forces, especially slower ones.

 

Plus no Troops Tax!

None of the Legion-specific Rites from Book 6 can be taken as allies. Even if they could, it wouldn't be great since that Rite makes the emperors children distrusted allies to everyone else, so they wouldn't be able to score.

[heptus]

So I thought about the use of fortifications for kakophoni, but it seems not so satisfactory for both options of re-rolling 1 to hit. Ammunition dump confers the effect to a small number of unit (due to 2" bubble) and ammo store is restricted to fire-point rule (up to 4 models max in case of the bunker IMO). 

 

Is there any better way to perfectly (it's EC!) use the fortification in 3rd Company ROW?

[Charlo]

 

Makes a pretty great allied detachment too!

 

Kakaphoni as troops and some Palatine blades with Eidolon or something work as an amazing addition to most forces, especially slower ones.

 

Plus no Troops Tax!

None of the Legion-specific Rites from Book 6 can be taken as allies. Even if they could, it wouldn't be great since that Rite makes the emperors children distrusted allies to everyone else, so they wouldn't be able to score.

 

 

Not all, but this one can. It only stops you taking a Space Marine Allied Detachment, but as this is the allied detachment it is fine. It has different wording to Long March/ Creeping Death etc :D

 

Not scoring isn't too bad either - I'd just roll the Kakaphoni and Palatines up the board as support units, a small hammer and anvil to supplement a force.

[Terminus]

No, please read the intro to that section. ALL the Legion Rites from book 6 are primary detachment only.

[Lord Blackwood]

It seems Terminus is correct. 

Top of Page 191 

LEGION-SPECIFIC RITES OF WAR
The following Rites of War are specific to the Legion indicated and may only be taken by a Primary Detachment with the correlating version of the Legiones Astartes special rule. .....Rites of War for the Blood Angels, White Scars and Dark Angels are to be found in the respective sections of the Legiones Astartes appendix

Thats a bit unfortunate also when you consider it calls out the DA , WS and BA  rites as well  

Strangely enough it doesn't speak to the Rites introduced before Book 6 but I  guess its kinda implied that the Legion specific rites of war are meant to be taken as Primary detachment only.  So say no Stone Gauntlet as allies or whatnot. 

Kinda unfortunate 

Edited July 6, 2016 by Bladewolf

[Charlo]

Ah wow. That's a shame then, but good catch!

 

Makes sense I suppose from a fluff stand point!

[Terminus]

The generic Rites and the previous Legion Rites are still fair game, unless something in their mechanics prevents it (like Primarchs chosen for example, or Wrath of the Ancients

[01RTB01]

So I thought about the use of fortifications for kakophoni, but it seems not so satisfactory for both options of re-rolling 1 to hit. Ammunition dump confers the effect to a small number of unit (due to 2" bubble) and ammo store is restricted to fire-point rule (up to 4 models max in case of the bunker IMO).

 

Is there any better way to perfectly (it's EC!) use the fortification in 3rd Company ROW?

Perfection is to drop the fortifications, march into the depths of opposing forces and enjoy every one rolled and following failed armour save. That's how the 3rd company roll :)

[heptus]

 

So I thought about the use of fortifications for kakophoni, but it seems not so satisfactory for both options of re-rolling 1 to hit. Ammunition dump confers the effect to a small number of unit (due to 2" bubble) and ammo store is restricted to fire-point rule (up to 4 models max in case of the bunker IMO).

 

Is there any better way to perfectly (it's EC!) use the fortification in 3rd Company ROW?

Perfection is to drop the fortifications, march into the depths of opposing forces and enjoy every one rolled and following failed armour save. That's how the 3rd company roll

 

 

This really enlightened me, commander!

 

OK I'll drop the fort for more heads of kakophoni.

[01RTB01]

In fairness, more bodies is always better imo. Also with them being relentless and scoring makes them good for moving forwards. I do believe they're the best troops choice in heresy despite the gets hot I think they're well balanced and they do rock!

[Theredknight]

Well I played a game v mechanicum.

I think I had the worst shooting ever with 9 of my 18 rolling 1s and 5 of those dying. Terrible terrible shooting

Apart from that, I had really trouble bringing down those tough creatures, with no armour to speak of, with the buffs they are very tough to kill.

I shall tweak my list but for astartes would be a decent army. Fell blade and 3 kakophoni is pretty good.

Managed to get 5 instant kill ap2 deaths off on castellex, bugger me he rolled 4 5+s inv!!!!!