[HH1.0] Mechanicum Tactica

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Reductor is the nicest boon to Myrmidons because they gain Walkers in Ruin and flat out ignore most of the terrain commonly found on 30k/40k tables.

 

Plus Reductor Magi can buff their guns with Master of Destruction. 

I've taken a Paragon Thanatar in Reductor just to alleviate "too many medusas and Krios squadrons" complaints. If Vultarax could take Paragon, it would be a solid Avenger alternative for air and ground armor, but alas it's not an option (yet?).

 

I have zero sympathy for Legion players. Maybe they can stop taking Sicarians, Spartans and quad mortars with phosphex every game. 

Vultarax are amazing dude, and unlike planes they can start on table Turn 1. I'd say they're better than Avengers but Lightning-Primaris is still king at killing vehicles (its just more fragile and relies on Reserve rolls). 

And Ursarax are awful. Low leadership and can't sweep. There are better options for dealing with tanks than punching them with Ursarax, which is pretty much all they are good for. 

 

Yeah :( I don't know why Thallax and Ursarax aren't Fearless. I mean they're bioengineered cyborgs. It's pretty dumb they get saddled with average Ld and Stubborn, which it doesn't help them at all. 

[Withershadow]

I really like Mechanicum Avengers since they can get Kraken missiles too. They aren't as potent as a full kraken volley but 2 lascannons and Avenger cannon more than compensate for 2 more missiles. Since we're talking Myrmidons, Spartans and the like will evaporate the moment I can get my Secutors within 18", so I need something to keep the skies clear.

 

Vultarax would be a nice substitute but the lack of autonomy is concerning. Not too bad though since it still targets fliers first.

[LtDan]

I've already got my first 6 thallax. Getting another six. But question is... Are multimeltas or thrusters better??

[Withershadow]

C. Plasma Fusil.

[LtDan]

I already have my first six with two fusils

[Withershadow]

Through a combination of FW and eBay I ended up with 14 thallax, 2 thrusters and 4 fusils. I like the fusils better, although as suggested earlier in this thread I've tried the bodyguard destructor squad to give an Ordinatus tank hunter with his blast and photon thruster.

[LtDan]

How did it work?. Worth while slowing the thallax down?

[Reclusiarch Darius]

I really like Mechanicum Avengers since they can get Kraken missiles too. They aren't as potent as a full kraken volley but 2 lascannons and Avenger cannon more than compensate for 2 more missiles. Since we're talking Myrmidons, Spartans and the like will evaporate the moment I can get my Secutors within 18", so I need something to keep the skies clear.

 

Avenger is great, but the nose cannon being only S6 AP3 means you need to get side or rear AV facing to kill a lot of Legion flyers. Probably why Lightnings are more common, krakens just delete everything. 

Vultarax would be a nice substitute but the lack of autonomy is concerning. Not too bad though since it still targets fliers first.

 

In Swooping mode its exempt to the 'must charge closest unit' rule, and you can get around the 'must shoot closest target' issue by ensuring the Spartan is right underneath you. It's not the same as Tarantulas. But yeah, in a Taghmata or Reductor list, I'd take actual planes over Vultarax (probably not even in planes in Reductor, because Siege Batteries can do AA quite well). I feel like angry bees really want reliable Rite of Destruction and extra cortex range, which only Legio Cybernetica supplies. 

I've already got my first 6 thallax. Getting another six. But question is... Are multimeltas or thrusters better??

 

Multi-meltas are basically worthless in the current meta, too many things have Armoured Ceramite. 

Photon thruster still needs 6's to hurt AV12+ vehicles, but you get two shots at 48", and you can Blind Primarchs and Praetors. Plus it still kills Terminators just fine. 

[BassWave]

Unless I'm mistaken, he can take a jetpack. Therefore he didn't slow the thallax. Edited January 6, 2017 by BassWave

[LtDan]

That what I was thinking darius. Extra range and shot I think wins

[Withershadow]

The ceramite thing is meta-dependent, and honestly I have never seen it to be that big of a problem. No one puts ceramite on AV12 hulls.  It's either Spartans or Leviathans that get that upgrade.

 

The problem with the multi-melta is that you have to get close to use the extra die, which is counter-intuitive for Thallax (they want to use their jet packs to keep a distance), and without that extra die +1S and AP1 is not that big an upgrade over their lightning guns. The rate of fire of 1 for BS4 also doesn't impress me. Hence my love affair with the cheap as chips fusil which basically doubles the unit's firepower.

 

Also, Thallax are NOT FAST. Repeat after me, NOT... FAST!  I don't know why people conflate jet and jump infantry, but Thallax are as slow as any other foot-slogging infantry without move through cover, except their jets allow them to play keep-away from opponents while still engaging with their 18" range guns. If you engage at near the max distance, even with a terrible jetpack roll you should be >18" away from the enemy, and thus outside of rapid fire or charge range. And yes, the Magos can take one too to be able to do the same hop. 

 

With photon thrusters and their more impressive range, you can use jet thrusters to pop in and out of cover.  Since the lightning guns are all "wasted" in such an application, I usually keep this bodyguard unit down to a minimum of 3 guys. Use 2 as 6 T5 ablative wounds, while putting out 4 photon thruster shots from the unit. An alternative to the Ordinator is a Myrmidon, who can take two thrusters for a total of 6 shots out of the unit, but then you're just fishing for 6s with tank hunter (as opposed to rolling 6+2D6 with re-roll vs AV12 max).

[LtDan]

Think a ordinator with them sounds like a good idea. I know thallax aren't fast, what I meant was the extra jet pack move they get.

[LtDan]

I'm going for reductor. Now I've got to decide what to do with hq. Obviously archmagos reductor but..... There are so many weapon options I'm a bit lost. Any good combos??? Wanted a thruster and chainfist but can't do both. ☹

[Withershadow]

Tank hunter and S10 is still pretty solid for punching things in melee (especially since often these will be AV13 knights or dreadnoughts), and with the Reductor rules it's still AP1 like a chainfist.  With a Machinator Array, you also get two S6 AP1 armourbane tankhunter attacks.  The chainfist is not that necessary, although there is certainly appeal in the ability to evaporate any AV target you come in contact with (blow up on 4+).

 

However, do you really want/need a gun on him?  None of them really utilize his Master of Destruction rule very well except the Conversion Beamer, and it precludes you from taking a Machinator Array or getting too close to the fight.  Remember he can forfeit shooting to pass his rule to a friendly unit or vehicle within 6", so drive a Krios Venator nearby and give it four S9 AP1 tankhunting ordnance shots (so basically roll 4 dice and pick the highest, lol).

That leaves you free to equip him with melee weapons, like a powerfist/chainfist combo. Or you could take a paragon blade instead, and have 3 S6 AP2 attacks at I4 (and opponents are -1T from rad grenades so insta-gibs all marines). With the S10 fist and rad grenades, you basically need T7 or Eternal Warrior to not be insta-gibbed one way or another by his attacks.  This also frees you up to exchange your pistol for a photon gauntlet, for an opportunity to blind folks to really make those AP2 I4 attacks count.

[LtDan]

Would think the ap1 thruster might be useful..... But maybe just smash him into combat would be better?. Reductor just seem like they excell in shooting

[Withershadow]

The AP1 only matters when you penetrate armor, which you can only do versus AV11 targets.  You don't need AP1 to kill Rhinos and Javelins.  Again, his master of destruction rule is wasted on any gun he might bring himself, when you can grant it to something juicier nearby.

 

The Archmagos is very expensive, so smashing him into combat and using him to tank for Myrmidons is the best approach in my opinion.  I have a narrative event in March I am getting ready for, and the centerpiece will be Archmagos leading a squad of grav Secutors, in a Macrocarid with cleansers and graviton imploder.  We're talking like 750 points all together or so, but it's a tough vehicle and a tough unit, and enough weapons to clear swathes of any kind of targets. You got haywire, concussion, blind, interceptor, torrent, poison, armourbane, etc.

 

I haven't tried it myself, but earlier in the thread some folks were saying an alternative HQ option is the cheapo basic Magos Reductor with a conversion beamer. Take a bodyguard of Reductor Adepts for another pair of conversion beamers.  This module will cost just a tad more than the Archmagos by himself, and gives you a different way to play. Just hang back and let the servitors tank the hits with T5. Maybe even castle-up further by sprinkling in some fancy tarantulas.

Edited January 6, 2017 by Withershadow

[LtDan]

Guess the thruster be better on a ordinator for the armourbane and the combat on the arcbmagos. Thanks for the input!...also I'm basing the army on myrmidons' so that's not a bad idea

[LtDan]

Now do I get a second trios for my second myrmidon unit or a macro? It's not a dedicated transport but tougher and more heavy armed.

[Mango Polo]

Has anyone here tried Inar in a Cybernetica list? I've been toying with alternate list ideas that avoid Scoria, for the sake of variety and trying out other things.

 

At a glance he seems fun, but he's got some pretty annoying flaws, though maybe someone has found an interesting use of him?

[Caillum]

Haven't tested him yet, but I will definitely be running him as part of my Paramar invasion force. He's unique and a great modelling opportunity, but from a tactical perspective, here's 1d4chan's piece:

 

Archmagos Inar Satarael: This dude died once, came back and decided he was done with this "dying" thing so he gave himself a Monstrous Creature-sized body (were he any tougher, he'd be a Castellax) with T6, W5, FnP(5+) and a Repulsor shield which protects him from S6 shots (ie. the ones that matter) on a roll of 4+, and on a 6 the attack bounces back to the offender. However, it doesn't work against Template or Blast weapons (ie. the ones that matter), so a normal invuln would be better. Sadly he gave his body a mere 3+ save and forgot EW, but he planned for that - roll a D6 when he loses his last W, on a 3+ he teleports home denying any VP for killing him and his body Explodes. Even in death, :cuss your dudes. He's not an IC but has Patris Cybernetica meaning he can, and should join a unit of Battle-automata: 3 S6 AP2 non-unwieldy attacks and HoW means he's more competent in CC than what his WS3 might suggest, and his WT pretty much turns friendly Taghmata 12" around him into Word Bearers, rolling an additional D6 and keeping the lowest two dice when making Morale checks. Because most of your army also is Stubborn this works out very nicely. Having a TL Maxima bolter, a Graviton Imploder and a Servo-arm (which usually are mutually exclusive) he's very cheap for what you get. But for a little more I could get me a Knight! Yes, but he is both an Archimandrite AND an Archmagos Dominus, having a Djinn-skein (with 4 optional Cyber-occularii), Cybertheurgy and a Cortex Controller - in fact he's the only way of having both in your army.

So, the key strength there is the sheer number of stuff he has over a single Archmagos:

- Archimandrite is a buff for Reserves and Vehicles.

- Cybertheurgy, cortex controller and Patris Cybernetica is a buff for Cybernetica Cortex units. Also counts as an Archmagos Dominus for a Legio Cybernetica army.

- his Warlord Trait buffs non-Fearless units near him, ie. Thallax, Ursarax, Myrmidons. This works on him too, though this is redundant (along with his Stubborn rule) given he'll want to be in a Fearless Battle-automata unit.

- Emergency Teleport Protocols is a unique defence against "Slay the Warlord" and kill point missions.

- BS5, a graviton imploder, a twin-linked Maxima bolter and Precision Shots means he can shoot pretty damn well.

- Battlesmith and a servo-arm means he can repair Vehicles or Monstrous Creatures on a 4+.

- Djinn-skein gives a unit +1BS, so his unit is pretty much always BS5 for free. It's also a nuncio-vox for Barrage weapons and Deep Strike units (which works nicely with Cyber-occularis).

- Feel No Pain (5+) and 1 extra Wound over a maxed out Archmagos makes him pretty tanky.

- has Hammer of Wrath, 4 S6 AP2 attacks at I4 (on the charge), along with a servo-arm attack, and can Smash if necessary.

 

Now, the negatives:

- WS3 is bad.

- his repulsor shield is funky, but not actually that effective when compared to a straight 3++.

- only has a 3+ armour save, and no "Hardened Armour" from an Abeyant.

- the sheer number of benefits make him somewhat schizophrenic. What Mechanicum list does he really belong in?

 

Overall, I love him! Not nearly as powerful as Scoria, but that's fine. His survivability is probably less than a maxed out Archmagos too, but he should be fine if sitting in a 5-strong Castellax unit. I think he'll work best in a Legio Cybernetica list, but I would definitely try to utilise all his benefits:

- add in some Krios Venators with free IWND.

- Outflank some Vorax, which will come in on Turn 2 83% of the time.

- use him as a spotter for Thanatars.

- might almost be worth trying some Ursarax near him, as they probably won't run away...

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Satarael is more of a support guy. He's best in a mixed Legio Cybernetica list, where you're still bringing Krios Venators or Triaros to get free IWND. I'd always run him with a Castellax squad so he can't be picked off (was his old problem of always having to run solo). And yeah as a spotter for Thanatars he's great. 

 

He's not as good as Scoria in pure Cybernetica, but he lets you take non-robot units without drawback, and he's the only Reserves bonus we get besides an Arch-Magos. So if you wanna run an Archimandrite and a Dominus, just take Satarael instead. 

 

I'm planning on taking him in my casual Taghmata list, with Lightning-Primaris instead of Vultarax, Vorax instead of Arlatax, and Krios Venators instead of more darkfire Castellax. 

[TompiQ]

The new 40k magos makes me want to proxy him as Scoria until the latter gets his own model.

 

I'm considering a new way of running a Scoria focused list, allying him in with Alpha Legion running Autilon Skorr as warlord. This gets me secured master of ambush letting me infiltrate 3 non-vehicle units, so how does this sound?

 

Scoria on abeyant 315pts

4x Castellax w. mauler, siege wrecker, flamer, frag grenades 540pts

6x Vorax w. frag grenades 420pts

 

Scoria deploys with either unit (Vorax for scout or Castellax for durability) but can handle himself running solo afterwards.

 

I felt Siege Wreckers grants a major advantage vs knights, 2w terminators and custodes. Am I overestimating their potency?

 

The Alpha Legion contingent will probably run Chosen Duty for veterans in rhinos as troops, but I've yet to fully flesh it out.

 

Edit - To clarify, all three mechanicum units infiltrate.

Edited January 12, 2017 by TompiQ

[Unknown Legionnaire]

Alpha Legion & Mechanicum are treated as Fellow Warriors either way on the allies matrix.

 

'Fellow Warriors cannot benefit from the effects of allied Warlord Traits ... etc.'

[TompiQ]

Alpha Legion & Mechanicum are treated as Fellow Warriors either way on the allies matrix.

 

'Fellow Warriors cannot benefit from the effects of allied Warlord Traits ... etc.'

 

Dangit, forgot that entirely. Back to the drawing board. The only ways to get a secure MoA is through Skorr or the loyalist DG character, but neither of them allows for this strategy...

[Withershadow]

Siege wreckers are too expensive when you have smash. 20 (or is it 25?) points for effectively an extra attack in subsequent rounds of combat doesn't seem amazing. Maybe okay to get one in a squad in case you get a charge off.