Leviathan Siege Dread tactics

[Guiltysparc]

I think the dread pod is a little bigger?

[Terminus]

Dread pod is way bigger, no way can you use a legion pod instead. The mod above is still too small but it's close and could be up sized. Thing is the doors actually serve a game-related purpose, so you will need some sort of houserule about being able to see through the pod and approximate the doors.

 

http://s417.photobucket.com/user/violence_8/media/IMG_0622.jpg.html

Edited March 6, 2016 by Terminus

[TemujinZero]

The Fw ddp itself doesn't fit contemptors or leviathans. It's a bland model and the very first thing I'd cut when looking to cut back on needless resin spending. Proxy the plastic pod and make some reasonable rules accomodations.

[SkimaskMohawk]

 

 

The Fw ddp itself doesn't fit contemptors or leviathans. It's a bland model and the very first thing I'd cut when looking to cut back on needless resin spending. Proxy the plastic pod and make some reasonable rules accomodations. 

 

In general having a smaller vehicle model proxies only ever helps the owner of the model get cover where the real size wouldn't. It gets doubly wonky when the model you proxy has rules for when shooting is drawn through it as well as inherent shrouding, really doubling down on the importance of maintaining its silhouette.

 

You don't hear people proxying Russes as Malcadors

You don't hear people proxying Raiders as Spartans

You don't hear people proxying Dreadclaws as Kharybdii 

 

I've said this in another Tactics thread, but depending on your opponent to let you get away with something thats counter to the rules shouldn't be relied on as a tactic

[Brofist]

Its just a big drop pod. Just ask your opponent.

 

If they have a huge problem with it it's probably not a friendly game anyway.

[01RTB01]

 

 

 

The Fw ddp itself doesn't fit contemptors or leviathans. It's a bland model and the very first thing I'd cut when looking to cut back on needless resin spending. Proxy the plastic pod and make some reasonable rules accomodations. 

 

In general having a smaller vehicle model proxies only ever helps the owner of the model get cover where the real size wouldn't. It gets doubly wonky when the model you proxy has rules for when shooting is drawn through it as well as inherent shrouding, really doubling down on the importance of maintaining its silhouette.

 

You don't hear people proxying Russes as Malcadors

You don't hear people proxying Raiders as Spartans

You don't hear people proxying Dreadclaws as Kharybdii 

 

I've said this in another Tactics thread, but depending on your opponent to let you get away with something thats counter to the rules shouldn't be relied on as a tactic

Bigger pod generates more cover so taking a smaller dread pod actually disadvantages the dread player. My bug bear with the dread post is cost for nothing. It's essentially scenery. It arrives and then... It does nothing. I bought an anvillus as I thought they looked cool and I wanted a pod. They at least fly around a bit and do something. The dread pod doesn't even have a gun to shoot with. it's a shame anvillus can't carry leviathans as they're a decent size and also quite pricey in terms of points

 

I've got a 9k force so not averse to spending. I was about to buy a pod but decided to buy a proteus instead for the price difference. My proteus seems incompetent but at least it can "pew pew" a pod is just a lump. A scratch build by me won't look as good as resin but I think I'll have a go

[SkimaskMohawk]

The disadvantage for burning retros is more slight than you might realize as it says "through or over" for granting other units shroud, meaning that the normal pods height is irrelevant for that rule. 

 

The more relevant part of burning retros is giving your own pod shroud and making it into a 2+ save bunker for your dread to assault out of, where a smaller pod is far more valuable when trying to claim obscurement.

[ak1508]

If you use photoshop and such, you could easily manipulate the drawing images in he link to closer fit the dimensions of DDP. Before I decide to throw away my 60 quid, i will definitely give this a go. It's well worth the time to manipulate the drawing images to fit more accurate sizes than just tossing away 60 quid imho. Ideally, they should introduce the plastic DDP kits in GW to make up for this, but then with the GW pricing policy it makes me nervous that it wont be THAT much cheaper lol

[TemujinZero]

I wouldn't proxy an anvillus because they have a sexy model, but the ddp is an old ugly waste of money that was never designed for the new patterns of dread anyway. Obviously I have a responsibility to make sure I'm not gaining any game advantage from the smaller model, but I'm not wasting my resin allowance on what is essentially still a proxy with FWs seal of approval.

[Fangbanger]

 

If they have a huge problem with it it's probably not a friendly game anyway.

I'd have to disagree, I play friendly and have used a normal pod before as a proxy yet it just feels wrong. As mentioned above the dread pod is much much bigger and the smaller pod gives an unfair advantage to the owner and just looks wrong on the field.

 

Sure it's £60 but if you want to pod a dread in, that's the price. This is not a cheap hobbie and as harsh as it sounds if you can't afford it, don't build a list with it in

[Kastor Krieg]

Sure it's £60 but if you want to pod a dread in, that's the price. This is not a cheap hobbie and as harsh as it sounds if you can't afford it, don't build a list with it in

If there's a price of admission, it's definitely not a friendly game. Sorry, but not sorry.

[Fangbanger]

 

Sure it's £60 but if you want to pod a dread in, that's the price. This is not a cheap hobbie and as harsh as it sounds if you can't afford it, don't build a list with it in

 

If there's a price of admission, it's definitely not a friendly game. Sorry, but not sorry.

Don't be so ridiculous of course there is a price for admission. You have to have models to play the game? Unless you would play someone who turned up with 2000 point army of matchsticks and says "these are actually marines"

[Ishagu]

I wouldn't be happy with someone using a regular pod as a Dread Drop Pod.

 

Horus Heresy is about representing these epic battles fully, not saving money :-P

 

 

Also, I'm well aware that the Dread Drop Pod doesn't fit a Contemptor, but guess what. the regular Pod doesn't fit 10 Marines.

[Flint13]

Alright, let's agree to disagree on the pod deal. 

 

No one is intentionally trying to yank an advantage from an suspecting opponent by taking a tiny pod that can hide better. But if you're going to proxy anything, always check with your opponent, don't just assume they'll be alright with it. It's the polite thing to do. 

 

+++Move it on past this little speed bump. Plz and thanks.+++

[Terminus]

A smaller pod also has more deployment options, so there are several mechanics at work here. Really the footprint and diameter is all that you need to maintain, it doesn't have to have the same height.

 

Price of admission argument cuts both ways. I'm okay with proxies if you want to try something out, but if you're making it part of your regular army, I expect you to procure the model or a convincing scratch-build. At the same time, the elitist attitude of "if you can't afford it, show yourself out, peasant!" makes me want to start mass distributing recasts. Who wants a DDP for $20 ?! :P

[ak1508]

I can buy another Levi for that price with only a few pounds away, hence why i dont feel like the DDP is worth the cash they're asking for. Yeah, sure - it IS the expensive hobby, but its meant to be reasonable so that paople can also afford it and actually can buy it and making the cash flow. Otherwise they would need to rely only on oligarchs, which I am not :D 

 

Anyways, Im going to play around with the image and try to see if I can manipulate it to the more accurate dimensions and then scratch build it using the base bits and the GW/FW bits to mix it up. See how it goes!

 

By the way, how well does it work to have a talon of Levies made of 3? Can they actually do anything or do they die quickly due to the incomming fire while they walking?

[ThatOneMarshal]

Okay so no leviathan or dreadnought for me then :D.

 

So, since the drop pod is a no go for me now because its ridiculous price, is there any other way to run the leviathan? How well do you think a 3 man Talon would work? Since they don't have the guaranteed range anymore would it be better to give them a storm cannon?

[Raktra]

Almost 1k for the talon. It's a hefty investment, cool as it is.

[ak1508]

If they are being treated as independent of each other even if purchased as a talon, why wouldnt they allow to give them a DDP anyway? May be to avoid cheating just make it a rule that you have to give them all DDPs if you choose to do that, so it becomes a bit more tricky and etc... or not?... I don't know, so therefore, ALIENS! :D (sorry!)

[Runefyre]

If they are being treated as independent of each other even if purchased as a talon, why wouldnt they allow to give them a DDP anyway? May be to avoid cheating just make it a rule that you have to give them all DDPs if you choose to do that, so it becomes a bit more tricky and etc... or not?... I don't know, so therefore, ALIENS! (sorry!)

I've always found it odd that you can't take drop pods with 2 or more dreadnoughts in a talon, considering precision dreadnought talon strikes are a thing in the books (prospero burns I think). You could just state that the pods come in on one reserve roll and must be placed and scattered within 6" of each other upon arrival.

[ak1508]

Yeah, that might also work! ok, gotta start spamming FW email to make an FAQ with this new addition

Edited March 6, 2016 by ak1508

[01RTB01]

I'm assuming it's for balance. 1 leviathan podding in is brutal. 3?!

[SkimaskMohawk]

Wait so you get 3 pods turn one, that only count as 1 for the purposes of drop pod assault? How is that not broken?

 

Maybe we should stick to following the rules when trying to create tactics/strategies 

[Lord Asvaldir]

Each dreadnought in a talon being able to take a pod is something I could see as reasonable,but having all three count as one choice for the drop pod assault rule? That's just broken, you could easily end up with lists with 3 "drops" for your pods, where the first two are made up of a full dreadnought talon each. I'm just imagining the damage 3 leviathans and 3 cortus contemptors would do in one turn of dropping in. 

[Terminus]

No pods for talons is because they must be deployed within 6" of another dread in the talon. How does that work for follow-up pods? Do you aim for the first pod or its occupant? What happens if you don't land within 6 after scatter? Too much rule confusion.