9th Ed. Wishlist?

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, Brainpsyk said:

I don't think the 'durability thru numbers' will work.  The few people who have done the conscript spam have stated that 300 infantry is the magical number.  Even taking 100 infantry puts the guard army in a bad place because it's no longer fun to put down 100 models just to pick them up by turn 3.  Or we have to make our infantry as bad as Gretchin, and I don't want that either.  With HotE, Conscripts at 5ppm, regular infantry with free wargear at 6ppm, and then Vets at BS3 & free wargear at 7ppm seems about right.  Now everything is a choice & trade off in army list construction. 

Even right now, making Guard infantry cheaper won't help Guard play 9th, as Guard is already asking infantry to do too much:

1. Hold objectives (with no durability...)
2. board screening/move blocking (which they do REALLY well with MMM!)
3. screen tanks (with no durability, so this doesn't fly)
4. do actions (which they do just fine, IF you can get the large blob over the line...)
5. Contribute to damage output (with free wargear & HotE this is now an option)

Screening tanks is really what's holding the infantry back, because the tanks (even the TCs) aren't doing their job.  Tanks are too fragile, under-powered and over-costed, so Guard is compensating by using infantry in a role they were never designed to do (tank screening).  So again, cheaper infantry doesn't help, Guard need ALL their tanks to step to the plate.  Tanks should be freeing-up infantry, not tying them down.

I still like platoons, not because it's a way to spam infantry, but a way of getting the infantry I want without taking additional detachments (like in a Spearhead for example).  Taking a Brigade means I have to take crappy FA choices and weak Elites to get 2 additional HS slots.  Yes, units should still be able to be taken individually, but then those individual units loose the platoon benefits (like LTs re-rolls and orders). 

Accidental double post

Edited July 19, 2022 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[sairence]

Good armies in the current game will kill 100 Guardsmen in the open turn 1 just fine. Craftworlds don't break a sweat removing even more, Tau can do it just fine too to name just a few examples. Sisters will do it turn 2, when their cc-units connects, and will hide everything of value before that. Same with Blood Angels. Hell, Guard can remove plenty of bodies, given half a chance.

Besides, you're not going to manage sticking 100+ Guardsmen in good cover AND have them be able to sally out to grab objectives the next turn.

Good armies in the current game will kill 100 Guardsmen in the open turn 1 just fine. Craftworlds don't break a sweat removing even more, Tau can do it just fine too to name just a few examples. Sisters will do it turn 2, when their cc-units connects, and will hide everything of value before that. Same with Blood Angels. Hell, Guard can remove plenty of bodies, given half a chance.

Besides, you're not going to manage sticking 100+ Guardsmen in good cover AND have them be able to sally out to grab objectives the next turn.

[Emperor Ming]

Yep, one of my group uses about 160 inf and 3 tank commanders, I killed almost all of it by turn 2 with eldar But at the same time as a guard player as well

Hammer of the E and aoc helped slightly, but without that it would have been a complete joke 

Guard secondaries aint great either

Guard also suffer from morale and most factions forget that it exists and its prob a reason why the points of inf squads should go back down

Edited July 19, 2022 by Emperor Ming

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

A guard army with less than 100 infantry, 3 TCs, 3 scout sentinels, and 3 basilisks, went undefeated at the Paris GT, coming in 3rd.

im not saying we should all expect these kind of results, but clearly a mix of infantry and armor doesn’t reliably get wiped.

 

I don’t play meta lists or try to min-max, just build lists I think are cool, and even standing most of my army out in the open my army managed to survive until turn 3 or 4 and nearly wiped my enemy of white scars as well, with only 36 infantry, also not using orders or strats.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[TCC]

Shoot into combat with the risk of hitting your own troops. Not a stratagem but army wide rule.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

7 minutes ago, TCC said:

Shoot into combat with the risk of hitting your own troops. Not a stratagem but army wide rule.

This is probably the most fluffy rule I’ve seen suggested lol.

on a 1 you hit your own people

[The Pounder]

Great idea TCC!

Am I misremembering in my old age? Or was there an option to do this in 2nd edition?

[Shamansky]

13 hours ago, Jud Cottrell said:

Great idea TCC!

Am I misremembering in my old age? Or was there an option to do this in 2nd edition?

I was not playing for that long, but shooting into HtH works almost like this in RPGs in WH40k setting

[duz_]

I believe its a Valhallan strat currently. 

[TCC]

3 minutes ago, duz_ said:

I believe its a Valhallan strat currently. 

Also Vostroyan have an order ‘Repel the enemy’ to shoot whilst within engagement range in to the nearest enemy unit. But that’s not the same as being able to pick any of your units and shoot into any combat you choose. I would think if the weapons are blast there is more chance of damage to friendlies - maybe blast weapons hit friendlies on 1&2’s or all failed hits hit friendlies. 

[The Pounder]

Apparently GW is holding another reveal event on the 8th!

It’s celebrating 35 years of 40k, so by my reckoning it’s the perfect opportunity to show us the Guard update!

Surely it’s time for some leaks to wet our appetites before the main event.

[MrKoolPants]

I am very much hoping for some news on the Guard. News and rumors have been dry as the desert lately. 

[Emperor Ming]

4 hours ago, LtColKool said:

I am very much hoping for some news on the Guard. News and rumors have been dry as the desert lately. 

and the current rumours are rather horrifying as well

Loss of hvy weapons teams from squads, after making them free... what a trap that was for anyone who went out and bought loads

Removal of vets, special weapon teams and conscripts

and then removal of most if not all old regiments

Whats worse, is I can totally see them being accurate, gw don't like rules that don't have models, and tidying away the old regiments stops people asking about model ranges for each regiment bar a few

[Slave to Darkness]

Val just mentioned in the N&R thread about the new Templar mini that he will be talkin about new Guard stuff tomorrow. Fingers crossed lads and lasses. 

[MrKoolPants]

3 hours ago, Slave to Darkness said:

Val just mentioned in the N&R thread about the new Templar mini that he will be talkin about new Guard stuff tomorrow. Fingers crossed lads and lasses. 

That’s big news, if true! I’m so excited! 

 

6 hours ago, Emperor Ming said:

and the current rumours are rather horrifying as well

Yeah, not to be a negative Nancy, but it seems like we’re headed into new territory with the guard line. Maybe they’re trying to “Leagues of Votann” our model range, and have just one just for troops? You can take an Infantry Squad, and that’s it. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

7 hours ago, Emperor Ming said:

and the current rumours are rather horrifying as well

Loss of hvy weapons teams from squads, after making them free... what a trap that was for anyone who went out and bought loads

Removal of vets, special weapon teams and conscripts

and then removal of most if not all old regiments

Whats worse, is I can totally see them being accurate, gw don't like rules that don't have models, and tidying away the old regiments stops people asking about model ranges for each regiment bar a few

What does the No model no rules rule have to do with those rumors?

[MrKoolPants]

Maybe it’s not “no model, no rules” but rather “no distinct kit, no rules.” Is that a precedent that has been set for other factions? 

So for example, there is no “Special Weapon Squad” box, so there will be no Special Weapons Team. Along the same lines, there are no Heavy weapons in the Infantry Squad box, so there will be no option for HWT in that data sheet. Same goes for Command Squad, HQs, etc. 

I for one actually like the idea of that change. It’s not what we’re used to as longtime Guard players, but it could do a lot to streamline and popularize the model line and rules.

It seems like there’s trend in faction-building towards building a base of available options that goes like this: HQ choice, Troops choice, Elites choice, “Devestator” choice, “Fast Boys” choice, transport, and heavy tank. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

7 hours ago, LtColKool said:

Maybe it’s not “no model, no rules” but rather “no distinct kit, no rules.” Is that a precedent that has been set for other factions? 

So for example, there is no “Special Weapon Squad” box, so there will be no Special Weapons Team. Along the same lines, there are no Heavy weapons in the Infantry Squad box, so there will be no option for HWT in that data sheet. Same goes for Command Squad, HQs, etc. 

I for one actually like the idea of that change. It’s not what we’re used to as longtime Guard players, but it could do a lot to streamline and popularize the model line and rules.

It seems like there’s trend in faction-building towards building a base of available options that goes like this: HQ choice, Troops choice, Elites choice, “Devestator” choice, “Fast Boys” choice, transport, and heavy tank. 

Idk if there’s precedent for no specific kit no rules.

but since the command squad box doubles as a SWS kit I don’t see that unit going anywhere.

and since there seems to be a new veterans kit on the horizon i don’t think that unit is going anywhere either, which leaves very little room to believe the HWT part of the rumor for me.

it seems to me factions have been getting more bloated as a whole this edition, so I don’t see why the guard wouldn’t get more bloated as well.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Valrak has new rumors.

Box set supposed to have a new unit we haven’t yet heard of called an ordinance battery.

 

also about SWSs he shows the big reveal photo from a while ago and in the blurry background is what is clearly either a SWS or a veteran squad, so i definitely think the rumors saying they’re going away come from a troll.

[OldWherewolf]

If the rumors are true, then we could see the veterans going away in favor of Kasrkin, so we have 4 infantry squads: Conscripts, Regs, Kasrkin, Scions.

Dropping the HWT out of the infantry squads could be moving all of them into the 'Ordinance Battery'.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, OldWherewolf said:

If the rumors are true, then we could see the veterans going away in favor of Kasrkin, so we have 4 infantry squads: Conscripts, Regs, Kasrkin, Scions.

Dropping the HWT out of the infantry squads could be moving all of them into the 'Ordinance Battery'.

The photos we have almost guarantee those rumors aren’t true at least in part.

we have pictures of what appear to be both SWSes and veterans, which throws a lot of doubt onto the rumor about HWTs leaving infantry squads.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

This is either a SWS or a veteran squad.

[Emperor Ming]

I thought the current rumour set said that cadian shock troops get their own datasheet and new models

So I'm not sure those new guard looking models are vets or SWS (not the kasarkin)

Very happy to be wrong thou if that's not the case!

 

[The Pounder]

Must say, I’m well chuffed with the rumour that Krieg will be in this book!

I’m intrigued about the new Ordnance teams and what they’ll bring (gotta love those big guns!)

I saw this on YouTube:

 

Mordian Glory is a legend and his videos are usually fun or informative (mostly both)

Can’t wait to see what GW reveal on the 8th of October.

[TCC]

4 minutes ago, Jud Cottrell said:

Must say, I’m well chuffed with the rumour that Krieg will be in this book!

I’m intrigued about the new Ordnance teams and what they’ll bring (gotta love those big guns!)

I saw this on YouTube:

 

Mordian Glory is a legend and his videos are usually fun or informative (mostly both)

Can’t wait to see what GW reveal on the 8th of October.

Came here to post this too, he mentioned there is another rumour video (I could not find it in the comments).