Armageddon: The Space Marine Half

[01RTB01]

4 hours ago, MoriyaSchism said:

He's also lacking details that ground him as a soldier, no ammo, no grenades and most importantly no gun. 

 

 

 

 

 

That book looks like it has some heft, he could just chuck his book really hard at someone?

[Crimson Longinus]

So given all the hubbub about helmets, did people not just headswap whatever helmets they like on their primaris before? I sure did. 

 

Like, sure, it was boring that the primaris originally came with just one type of helmet, and it is better that they now have more variety, but for anyone that did not start with those kits it was a trivial issue to fix. I'm sure we all have more marine heads in our bits boxes than we'll ever need. 

 

And now it seems the new Intercessor kit will fix the clone trooper issue for the new hobbyist as well. 

(Ironically my paint scheme was partly inspired by Clone Troopers.)

[MoriyaSchism]

2 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

So given all the hubbub about helmets, did people not just headswap whatever helmets they like on their primaris before? I sure did. 

 

Like, sure, it was boring that the primaris originally came with just one type of helmet, and it is better that they now have more variety, but for anyone that did not start with those kits it was a trivial issue to fix. I'm sure we all have more marine heads in our bits boxes than we'll ever need. 

 

And now it seems the new Intercessor kit will fix the clone trooper issue for the new hobbyist as well. 

(Ironically my paint scheme was partly inspired by Clone Troopers.)

I did headswaps all the time, but shortly after I finished my Dark Imperium and Indomitus builds I ran out of helmets from my bits box. Every other Primaris purchase meant I had to spend 20 to 30 euro on backpacks and helmets, but thankfully the new Intercessors are going to lessen the blow on helmet front. Another issue is unlike the old Mark III Heresy kit the Primaris kits don't feature enough stuff to accessorize all 10 Space Marines. 

 

The Lamenter is an old blutack mockup from years ago that's still in my attachments. I did this all the time. Old weapons, pauldrons, helmets and backpacks. Trimmed gorgets, knees and resculpted legs. 

Edited Sunday at 07:18 PM by MoriyaSchism

[Blindhamster]

57 minutes ago, MoriyaSchism said:

There's just so much personality here. 

I was super happy about all the bare heads, so yeah I agree, plenty of personality. 
 

(I’m being silly, much like you, I do actually recognise that the helmets themselves needed a bit more variety, the wolves got it and I suspect the intercessor recut that is coming will too, I’m personally happy with the variety in the Armageddon box too)

Edited Sunday at 05:09 PM by Blindhamster

[Robbienw]

I don’t think there actually was an argument that Primaris marines had less details or decorations, I think it morphed from a comment made by jes goodwin about Primaris having less relic stuff and people took that and make up complaints that were largely only in their imagination.

 

The actual complaint directed against Primaris was that they were all very samey and bland with little armour part variation - many years later they are trying to fix this.  And also tacticool features, excess armour plates and the ever present knee rims.

[phandaal]

18 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

So given all the hubbub about helmets, did people not just headswap whatever helmets they like on their primaris before? I sure did. 

 

Like, sure, it was boring that the primaris originally came with just one type of helmet, and it is better that they now have more variety, but for anyone that did not start with those kits it was a trivial issue to fix. I'm sure we all have more marine heads in our bits boxes than we'll ever need. 

 

And now it seems the new Intercessor kit will fix the clone trooper issue for the new hobbyist as well. 

(Ironically my paint scheme was partly inspired by Clone Troopers.)

 

I did this with a unit of Intercessors, along with trimming down the knee rims. Small changes really do make a big difference!

 

(As someone with a metric ton of B1 Droids from that other galaxy, I feel you on the Clone Trooper thing. )

[The Lost Son]

I'm happy the land speeder is back I loved them from the go in 3rd. The captain is a nice mix up of the Black Templars marshall and the Wolf Guard Battle Leader though the more I look at it the torso would be great on a bike. The intercessors and standard bearer are a nice reimagining of those from dark imperium honestly and I hope when the multi part kit comes out that there will be a return to sense and it's a straight 10 instead of double 5's which is personally one of my bigger issues with all GW's newer output. Librarian is a tidy remake quite nice to see one dynamic after 8 editions. Vanguard and eradicators I don't really care for but I plan on converting most things at least a little. Best stock up on some tactical marines for bolters I guess or find out if any of my old collection still exists.

[Karhedron]

2 hours ago, jaxom said:

If I recall correctly, there was mention of Vanguard Veterans being "better on the charge." They do have new weapons, but this seems to me like their special ability is unchanged?

 

Possibly they were referring to Blood Angels VanVets getting charge bonuses in LAG or RCO?

[Evil Eye]

The funny thing about oldscale Marines is if you give them longer legs and slightly extended waists, either by hacking up plastic legs ala @Veteran Sergeant and his amazing work or just printing new ones altogether, they look pretty good next to more modern minis. Not perfect, but it really is mostly the legs that are holding them back. Red Warden made some excellent Grey Knight legs (now tragically bopped) that took the plastic kit from "Great fun to build but firmly oldscale" to "Basically perfect".

 

Personally I do like oldscale stuff, enough that I've collected some old metal Marines to paint up largely unconverted save for custom backpacks where the OGs were missing, as sca;e be damned they're gorgeous models. But as someone that also likes the newer scale for Marines, it's comically easy to make the older kits look more the part.

 

That being said I'm honestly hoping I can get my greasy claws on the box. The newer Marine stuff looks honestly kinda good, and it won't be too hard to remove the more irritating Primaris design elements and recontextualize or convert other bits to be more pleasing. At the very least my personal STC machine will make sure I can replace bonces, boltguns and backpacks, and from the looks of the sprues the knee flanges should be easily removable.

[MoriyaSchism]

4 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

The funny thing about oldscale Marines is if you give them longer legs and slightly extended waists, either by hacking up plastic legs ala @Veteran Sergeant and his amazing work or just printing new ones altogether, they look pretty good next to more modern minis. Not perfect, but it really is mostly the legs that are holding them back. Red Warden made some excellent Grey Knight legs (now tragically bopped) that took the plastic kit from "Great fun to build but firmly oldscale" to "Basically perfect".

 

Personally I do like oldscale stuff, enough that I've collected some old metal Marines to paint up largely unconverted save for custom backpacks where the OGs were missing, as sca;e be damned they're gorgeous models. But as someone that also likes the newer scale for Marines, it's comically easy to make the older kits look more the part.

 

That being said I'm honestly hoping I can get my greasy claws on the box. The newer Marine stuff looks honestly kinda good, and it won't be too hard to remove the more irritating Primaris design elements and recontextualize or convert other bits to be more pleasing. At the very least my personal STC machine will make sure I can replace bonces, boltguns and backpacks, and from the looks of the sprues the knee flanges should be easily removable.

After seeing some Badab War conversions on instagram using metal models, the jeweler's saw in my tool box has started tempting me like the Blade of Antwyr. 

 

[Wispy]

2 hours ago, Scribe said:

All they need do is release the old armour marks in the new scale, and all the primaris chatter other than their comical lore and the stupid rules goes away. I doubt anyone argues that the og Marines actually look better, they have not aged well.

All they need to do is do a herculean task to satisfy a loud minority who are insecure Primaris models are just a wee bit taller than the MKVIs and MKIIIs already available.

 

(because hat's the heart of the problem, isn't? Insecure Their favorite guys aren't as big. Small Dog syndrome.)

Edited Sunday at 07:36 PM by Wispy

[phandaal]

52 minutes ago, MoriyaSchism said:

After seeing some Badab War conversions on instagram using metal models, the jeweler's saw in my tool box has started tempting me like the Blade of Antwyr. 

 

The guys from Cult of Paint have been doing some awesome conversion videos on YouTube for their Badab War project using new Marine sculpts. The latest video has Executioners done using the new Renegade Marines kit, and they look really great.

 

No doubt this new Intercessor kit with its modified chest pieces and Mk7 faceplates will inspire similar conversions.

 

Edited Sunday at 08:00 PM by phandaal
wrong painter name

[Scribe]

4 minutes ago, Wispy said:

All they need to do is do a herculean task to satisfy a loud minority who are insecure Primaris models are just a wee bit taller than the MKVIs and MKIIIs already available.

 

(because hat's the heart of the problem, isn't? Insecure Their favorite guys aren't as big. Small Dog syndrome.)

 

I'm sure you are joking, but no. The heart of the issue was terrible lore, ugly vehicles, and the initial roll out was a bit too clean.

 

Once they hit the guys with the massive Shields, the Black Templars, and Wolves, and heck the Sternguard, it became obvious GW could fix the models. 

 

The terrible lore, rules, and grav vehicles will persit until they go into Legends, but the troopers don't have to suck.

 

So let's go GW, release Marines in the.new scale with the old armor, don't even call them primaris, update the rules to let them take Rhinos, and we can all move on from the primaris mistake.

[MoriyaSchism]

10 minutes ago, Wispy said:

All they need to do is do a herculean task to satisfy a loud minority who are insecure Primaris models are just a wee bit taller than the MKVIs and MKIIIs already available.

 

(because hat's the heart of the problem, isn't? Insecure Their favorite guys aren't as big. Small Dog syndrome.)

Which Greek demigod do I have to thank for the re-done Castellan Crowe sculpt and the Red Corsair Raiders? 

[Crimson Longinus]

I don't fully get the hate of grav vehicles. It is finally returning to the original lore and marines again have grav tanks, you just no longer need to convert them out of deodorant bottles. So conceptually at least they seem fine. As for the execution, I think Repulsor chassis looks really good. I like Impulsor less, the basic version works well enough, but I think the Gladiators could have benefitted from a bespoke hull design; the Impulsor chassis do not work so great for them.

 

But in any case, I hope the tracked vehicles stay and primaris can finally ride in a Rhino, so that everyone can just choose which they want to use. 

[MoriyaSchism]

8 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

I don't fully get the hate of grav vehicles. It is finally returning to the original lore and marines again have grav tanks, you just no longer need to convert them out of deodorant bottles. So conceptually at least they seem fine. As for the execution, I think Repulsor chassis looks really good. I like Impulsor less, the basic version works well enough, but I think the Gladiators could have benefitted from a bespoke hull design; the Impulsor chassis do not work so great for them.

 

But in any case, I hope the tracked vehicles stay and primaris can finally ride in a Rhino, so that everyone can just choose which they want to use. 

Glad we're in agreement. One argument against tracked vehicles I've seen was the silly thing about how Space Marines should be getting top of the line stuff in the current setting, the same time period where half of the Imperium is cut off from itself and they even call this part of the galaxy "Imperium Nihilus". I'm willing to bet all the people stuck on that end of the Rift don't have the most recent equipment or the most expedient lines of supply. On the topic of classic grav tanks I have something up my sleeve that might eventually show up on the tutorial section of the forum as soon as I get all the parts necessary. 

Edited Sunday at 08:11 PM by MoriyaSchism

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 hours ago, Lord Marshal said:

 

I've seen people speak fondly of Centurions these days; perhaps the most universally reviled kit I can remember (at least when it came out). I think even the new Corteaz caught less flak. If the Nemesis Babycarrier ever goes to Legends Purgatory I feel confident in saying a lot of people will suddenly realise they "always loved it."

 

I'm not in the business of outright dismissing criticism based off "oh it's just nostalgia, new thing good, I must cons00m ze slop" but there's definitely a cohort of people on the internet for whom the exact same model could be released today and would automatically despise it just by virtue of being new. Past a certain point it feels like getting into a discussion about something is pointless because the arguments don't really feel like they're being made in good faith, as you can guess what will be said next anyway.

 

I can't remember where I heard it, but somebody once said "if Desolators were in Dawn of War 1 they'd be beloved today" and I don't think they're incorrect.

 

New=bad is how I felt when the SG, sanguinor, and astorath were introduced.

 

no lore explanation for their sudden existence just “they were always there, accept it”

 

which is ironic because I generally like the new SG models a lot more than the old ones.

Edited Sunday at 08:34 PM by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Robbienw]

1 hour ago, Wispy said:

All they need to do is do a herculean task to satisfy a loud minority who are insecure Primaris models are just a wee bit taller than the MKVIs and MKIIIs already available.

 

(because hat's the heart of the problem, isn't? Insecure Their favorite guys aren't as big. Small Dog syndrome.)

No.  The heart of the problem is the Mk X range is very ugly.

 

Very few people obsess over mm size differences between model ranges.

[Laurence]

1 hour ago, Crimson Longinus said:

I don't fully get the hate of grav vehicles. It is finally returning to the original lore and marines again have grav tanks, you just no longer need to convert them out of deodorant bottles. So conceptually at least they seem fine. As for the execution, I think Repulsor chassis looks really good. I like Impulsor less, the basic version works well enough, but I think the Gladiators could have benefitted from a bespoke hull design; the Impulsor chassis do not work so great for them.

I think they're far too busy.  Something closer to the sleek simplicity of the Deodorant Antigrav Attack Tank would have been much nicer, IMHO.

[Crimson Longinus]

31 minutes ago, Robbienw said:

No.  The heart of the problem is the Mk X range is very ugly.

 

Easily the best looking marine armour overall. Other marks have some nice specific bits, but all the old marks are pretty clunky and overly simplistic in their basic design. Mk X looks finally like it could be functioning real technology rather than a simple toy. And this is of course even with ignoring the utterly terrible proportions of the old kits. 

[Robbienw]

20 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

Easily the best looking marine armour overall. Other marks have some nice specific bits, but all the old marks are pretty clunky and overly simplistic in their basic design. Mk X looks finally like it could be functioning real technology rather than a simple toy. And this is of course even with ignoring the utterly terrible proportions of the old kits. 

Do you have access to some different kind of Mk X models that the rest of us don’t?!

 

”it could be functioning real technology” - I lost it at that one, thanks for the laugh 

[Crimson Longinus]

12 minutes ago, Robbienw said:

Do you have access to some different kind of Mk X models that the rest of us don’t?!

 

No, just the same ones that have ushered GW into record profits year after year. 

Face it, you're in the minority. Overwhelmingly people think that primaris are a massive improvement, and when you look the models side by side it is pretty obvious why. 

 

 

[The Lost Son]

After looking more it's 2 x 5 on the poses but way more variety in the arms that's making it look like a full 10 for the intercessors which for push fit is impressive. 

[MoriyaSchism]

6 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

No, just the same ones that have ushered GW into record profits year after year. 

Face it, you're in the minority. Overwhelmingly people think that primaris are a massive improvement, and when you look the models side by side it is pretty obvious why. 

 

 

So when people convert them to look like classic Space Marines do these miniatures suddenly become worse? Does the armour somehow become less functional? Did they ruin these models in the same manner one would ruin a model by slathering it with a two dozen layers of paint?  Is this objectively worse than the original out of the box sculpt? 

[Wispy]

3 hours ago, Scribe said:

 

I'm sure you are joking, but no. The heart of the issue was...[cope]

I know what you say but I don't believe you and think you are just making excuses for Small Dog Syndrome. *Shrugs*

Edited Sunday at 10:47 PM by Wispy