++ AUGUSTUS b'RAASS ++ pre-heresy BRASS SCORPION p.247

[Augustus b'Raass]

Daemon Prince build time, and I need your feedback. 

As I've written before, I am trying to make a Nurgle Daemon Prince using the Mourngul miniature as a base. 

 

The basic concept will look something like this, but with a ton of cabing running from his arms to his torso, and coming from the torn-off underside. I want this to look as mechanically fleshy as possible, instead of as just torn-off ghoul-y. 

 

My main thing is, he will be a FLYING Daemon Prince - and even though the Mourngul is supposed to be some ind of spirit/ghost-like thing, this Daemon Prince will be something made of a facsimile of (daemon) flesh. So in order for it to be able to fly, it either needs something mechanical like a Jump Pack (but that has already been done on my first Nurgle Daemon Prince; or it needs wings. Enter some plastic wings from the AoS Crypt Flayers Kit:

 

But that also introduces an ancillary problem: it becomes even more top heavy - while the only support strut is in a 5mm thick resin wrist - not sturdy enough for my kind of gaming/transportation needs. It will need more support struts. Enter a pice of GW plastic ruins, which will incorporate a cleverly (if I may say so myself) disguised pin. 

 

Now, that would give me enough structural strength to make the wings even more heavy - the original idea was to give him wings from the OOP metal Nightmare kit: behold:

 

Now, my question to you is: plastic Crypt Flayer wings or metal Nightmare wings?

 

Any other suggestions regarding this conversion - which will be pretty involved anyway, are most, most welcome. I appreciate any feedback on this, actually! :D :tu:

Let me know!

Cheers

 

Replies!
 

@ ElDuderino: Actually they are not as hard as you might think. They're still marine kits that follow a certain structure. The only issue is: being afraid to damage parts with your hobby saw. I have no fears when it comes to that, as I know I can just fill up those damaged details with a bit of putty and/or some glass beads to resemble pustules. You have no idea how many crimes I've hidden with some microbeads in my Nurgle Collection!

 

@ rednekkboss: I''m looking forward to your final entry!

 

@ Midnight Runner: Hey buddy!  thanks for stopping by again - and the compliment. I'm glad you like him. I swear the worst crimes in the blown up pictures are only just, just visible on the actual miniature. 

 

@ Soulhunter1995: Cheers, buddy! Thanks for stopping by! I like your forum name!

 

@ KrautScientist: Thank you! I take that as extremely high praise, coming from you!

 

@ Gederas: If given the choice I would always go for a FB. The Grenade buff given by the BP is strong, but far more situational than FB's spray, overwatch, and negative charge mods.

 

@ Pandoras Bitz Box: Haha thanks, buddy. I really appreciate your following this thread so closely, and always giving such elaborate and constructive feedback. It's very useful and highly appreciated! I've seen you do the same for other threads here, and kudo's to you! You're a merit to this forum!

 

[hushrong]

I dunno how you guys follow Nurgle. His blessings knocked me on my rear this weekend. Couldn't get much of anything done but some KT games.

 

But in that time you worked like a beast! For starters your Khârn is great. That deep red and vibrant flesh looks great on the mini. I also may have to steal your conversion for the arm wrapped in chains if I pick up ol' Khârn for myself. The blightspawn also look great. He is a big guy with that backpack of his! I never realized he was that huge! Now I am trying to figure out if I could use that in a conversion for my army because he looks so dang cool. And that Daemon Prince is AWESOME! I say the plastic wings since they have more defined detail. I wonder if bigger wings like morathi's would look awesome of be over the top on your daemon prince.

[Mechanist]

Congratulations on the great ETL results a very impressive collection of models.

 

The Daemon prince is looking promising, I say that actually hovering isn't an issue for Daemons take the disk of Tzeentch for example. The laws of physics don't really apply but myths legends and expectations are far more important.

On the other hand I think the raggedy feather wings would be amazing. I can't remember which model they come from but I know something has a pair.

[gianlucafiorentini123]

Plastic wings for me too, they fit the aesthetic of the rest of the model a lot better than the others IMO. The metal wings also add a lot of weight to the top of the model but don't look big enough to compensate for this.

[Gederas]

Loving the new Daemon Prince, its looking awesome. :tu:

 

That being said, the wings look bit goofy. Actually, they look a lot goofy :lol: They're way too small.

 

My main thing is, he will be a FLYING Daemon Prince - and even though the Mourngul is supposed to be some ind of spirit/ghost-like thing, this Daemon Prince will be something made of a facsimile of (daemon) flesh. So in order for it to be able to fly, it either needs something mechanical like a Jump Pack (but that has already been done on my first Nurgle Daemon Prince; or it needs wings.

From the Death Guard codex:

 

"Some Daemon Princes can even fly, enormous insect wings or spiraling vortices of noxious fumes carrying them across the battlefield"

 

You could use, say, the AoS Spirit Hosts as billowing smoke coming from the torn in half area of the body, which would also add some more structural integrity to the model.

[ElDuderino]

I like the plastic wings for the same reasons as hushrong, also I quite like that they're a bit small. Look atrophied in a sense. And kudos for new DP ideas! Your old Prince was awesome but this wins in originality hands down. Death and starvation seems like it should be more prominent in nurgle, as opposed to rot and fat (and bells and trees haha)

[KrautScientist]

Hmm, interesting concept for a Daemon Prince! I am not a huge fan of the stock model, to be honest, but I am still confident that you'll knock it out of the park! :)

 

A couple of thoughts:

 

• from the two sets of wings you posted, I'd go with the plastic wings (as the nightmare wings haven't really aged all that well, if you ask me). However, the other guys are right in that the wings are a bit small -- off the top of my head, how about the Manticore wings from the WGB/AoS Manticore?
• I do think you should give him some kind of tattered cowl.
• regarding the question of adding that ruin and/or having all kinds of organic stuff emerging from his lower torso, I just want to point out that the model's lack of a lower body is very much its main gimmick, and it heavily influences its general look and feel as well as its silhouette. I would therefore be wary of doing anything that would change that element too much -- you could do that, of course, but then why go for this base model in the first place? Plus I'd wager it would draw even more attention to the model's already very weird proportions.
• I think the blob of poster tac you have used for the wing mock-up suggests that some kind of hunchback would work really well on the model -- and make it look suitably different from the stock creature without messing with the overall design.

Anyway, hope this helps! :)

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

The wings are comically small. I dunno if you could even find some now, but Balrog wings might be sized more appropriately for this thing. Otherwise, what about some kind of technological anti-grav system implanted into its back? Maybe several tech-looking spines running down the middle of its back. 

[Augustus b'Raass]

Thanks, everyone. The overwhelming concensus goes to the plastic wings, so that's what will happen. 

 

I did some building, glueing and pinning, both to the miniature itself and to its base. Here's what I have so far. 

 

 

 

 

 

I hope you like! 

 

The base needs a lot of work still. The big challenge will be to make a surface that looks like rock. I took some inspiration from the FW team, and made some small rocks on sticks, which I will be able to use to press in milliput - thereby mimicking the surface. :D

 

 

Cheers

 

Replies:

 

@ hushrong: I hope you feel better, buddy! The Khârn conversion is super easy to do and I recommend it highly - those weird chains are extremely cumbersome and stupid. Plastic Wings +1

 

@ Mechanist`: No idea which miniature you mean - ragged feathery sounds more Tzeentchian...

 

@ gianlucafiorentini123: Cheers, that's a good point for the plastic wings +1

 

@ Gederas: Ah but then I'd have to buy those spirit hosts, and I have a no-buying more plastic policy in place... ;)

 

@ ElDuderino: Thanks for the feedback, that's a good point too! Pastic Wings +1

 

So that's Pastic Wings +1, Metal Wings +0. Seems like an easy choice, eh? ;) :D

[KrautScientist]

*Sigh* I will say that it's actually hard to provide feedback to you when you are always three steps ahead, already...

 

New assembly looks good, though. Looking forward to seeing the model painted in about five more minutes ;)

[Mechanist]

The scibor angel or death is probably the model I was reminded of.

 

https://images.beastsofwar.com/2012/03/Scibor-Angel-of-Death.jpg

 

The wings from a Tomb Kings Carrion would also work kind of the style or a ragged winged reaper much like the epic mortarion.

It would probably be doable with other feather wings with a little Dremel work to remove some feathers and add some ragged flesh and some bones to get a similar but more modern and less clunky version of the carrion wings.

[gaurdian31]

Khârn looks lovely! The dark red is great. The new prince is coming along well. I agree with KrautScientist in that a cowl/hood would look great on him. The blightspawn are looking good too!

[hushrong]

Thanks! Good ol' robitussin, Sunny D, and hours of sleep have been my saving grace!

 

The updated DP is getting even better! Getting those Christmas Carol spooky vibes with the cables drifting beneath his mass. Like the chains on the ghost that visited Scrooge I wonder if you head those cables whipping or his wings beating as that DP descends on you. If I could have predicted the future that you were doing stuff like this I could have sent you the base stuff from 30k Khârn and Abaddon v. Loken to break up and use for the rubble on the base. I do look forward to seeing how this FW rock trick works out. That looks like a neat hobbying trick!

[Bjorn Firewalker]

Trying to capture a Chaos Warlord at the very moment of his Ascension to the rank of Daemon Prince?

 

The model you made is certainly intimidating, but the fact it has no legs made me think of it as a Chaos spawn instead- it seemed the would-be Daemon Prince didn't retain sufficient control over his powers to dictate what form his body would take upon his Ascension.

 

I must commend your efforts, nonetheless. As I said, your model looks INTIMIDATING.

[ElDuderino]

That rock idea is pretty damn clever! I wonder... instant trim moulds?

 

I like the new additions, however I feel like it's lacking some marine aesthetics, ATM it's just the shoulder pads that points to it having been a marine. Can't think of any ideas though except for replacing the wings with the backpack prong-things from the demon prince... which is a major change from your concept of course, just brainstorming a bit:)

[hushrong]

Bjorn, he got impatient with his ascension so he just ripped off his mortal legs before they could change to get a move on

 

I would like to argue that I think daemon princes do not all need to be symmetrical, bipedal hulks but that their ascended form could also be a reflection of their soul. This marine's wretched existence has led him to become a malformed, ghoulish entity. Maybe this is how he saw himself after turning against the emperor and being besieged by the poxes of Nurgle. His own ghastly image reminding him of one the stitched-together amalgamations of undead flesh that haunted his homeworld and now he echoes that.

 

Perhaps he suffered terrible injuries and his lower half was bionics that he wished to part with when ascending.

 

Heck, he could be a bit off so to speak. I mean, look at Daemon Primarch Fulgrim compared to his brothers.

 

Of course the warp does work in mysterious ways.

[Augustus b'Raass]

Cheers, guys!

 

@ KrautScientist: I couldn't help it!! I just kept going. Actually, your feedback is much appreciated - even at this stage, where the general shape is left. There's tons of ideas in my head still, but I'm not sharing because I want fresh ideas - and you always provide. So please don't be discouraged because of my impatience. I'd like to hear what you have to say regardless of the wings. Also, the wings aren't attached yet. Actually, I should make a pic of the metal wings. Also, I can't work on it until tomorrow, so feedback: GO! :D

 

@ Mechanist: Nah, third party bits are a bit of a nono, as I want to be able to take this thing to tournaments. I'm not sure about feather wings anyway.... sorry 

 

@ guardian31: ?? KrautScientist didn't write anything about a cowl or hood! Even still: cool idea, although I'm also a fan of the hair, and I'm guessing that would get in the way of the sculpt. This needs some pondering. 

 

@ hushrong: Hurray! Although Nurgle is displeased ;) Ah, buddy, that's super nice, but really I think the stone press idea I have going will do some wonders. 

 

@ Bjorn Firewalker: haha that's actually a cool thought! Perhaps it is. And spawn, daemon prince: tomaytoe tomahtoe. ;)

 

@ ElDuderino: Instant trim molds would be a godsend. Marine aesthetics will come - no worries. Lots of cabling coming from his arms into his chest, Campaign Pips on his forehead, maybe even the left-overs of a backpack!

 

@ hushrong: These:

Maybe this is how he saw himself after turning against the emperor and being besieged by the poxes of Nurgle. His own ghastly image reminding him of one the stitched-together amalgamations of undead flesh that haunted his homeworld and now he echoes that.

 

Perhaps he suffered terrible injuries and his lower half was bionics that he wished to part with when ascending.

are extremely cool thoughts. I like them!!

 

Keep 'm coming!

[KrautScientist]

Cheers, guys!

 

@ guardian31: ?? KrautScientist didn't write anything about a cowl or hood! (...)

 

Actually, yes I did

 

Hmm, interesting concept for a Daemon Prince! I am not a huge fan of the stock model, to be honest, but I am still confident that you'll knock it out of the park!

 

A couple of thoughts:

 

• from the two sets of wings you posted, I'd go with the plastic wings (as the nightmare wings haven't really aged all that well, if you ask me). However, the other guys are right in that the wings are a bit small -- off the top of my head, how about the Manticore wings from the WGB/AoS Manticore?
• I do think you should give him some kind of tattered cowl.
• regarding the question of adding that ruin and/or having all kinds of organic stuff emerging from his lower torso, I just want to point out that the model's lack of a lower body is very much its main gimmick, and it heavily influences its general look and feel as well as its silhouette. I would therefore be wary of doing anything that would change that element too much -- you could do that, of course, but then why go for this base model in the first place? Plus I'd wager it would draw even more attention to the model's already very weird proportions.
• I think the blob of poster tac you have used for the wing mock-up suggests that some kind of hunchback would work really well on the model -- and make it look suitably different from the stock creature without messing with the overall design.

Anyway, hope this helps!

Edited July 30, 2018 by KrautScientist

[Gederas]

If you're dead set on wings, maybe see if you can source some Hive Tyrant wings? They're suitably large enough, and with only some minor modifications can look suitably Nurgly.

[Augustus b'Raass]

Gak! I completely missed that somehow. Wow that never happened. I must've been really into the flow. 

 

Anyway, that's great feedback. I did quick snap made pictures of the DP with metal wings mocked up:
 

 

 

Now, to go through the excellent points Kraut made:
 

 

• from the two sets of wings you posted, I'd go with the plastic wings (as the nightmare wings haven't really aged all that well, if you ask me). However, the other guys are right in that the wings are a bit small -- off the top of my head, how about the Manticore wings from the WGB/AoS Manticore?

Cheers - I agree they're quite small, but he's also floating? I don't know. I hear what you're saying about the Manticore wings you gave me, but dude - they're reserved for a Khornate DP I have planned - one that will blow your mind (remember the Blood Throne you gave me? Think Motorcycle)

• I do think you should give him some kind of tattered cowl.

That is a cool idea - though I doubt I'll get to keep the cool hairs on the stock Mourngul if I chose to do so...

• regarding the question of adding that ruin and/or having all kinds of organic stuff emerging from his lower torso, I just want to point out that the model's lack of a lower body is very much its main gimmick, and it heavily influences its general look and feel as well as its silhouette. I would therefore be wary of doing anything that would change that element too much -- you could do that, of course, but then why go for this base model in the first place? Plus I'd wager it would draw even more attention to the model's already very weird proportions.

I'm interested in your thoughts on what I did with the pewter cabling jutting out from his torn body.

• I think the blob of poster tac you have used for the wing mock-up suggests that some kind of hunchback would work really well on the model -- and make it look suitably different from the stock creature without messing with the overall design.

That's really a cool idea, which I can maybe combine with ElDuderino's idea of (the remains of) a backpack!

 

Cheers!
 

Reply:

 

@ Gederas: Ah those are some cool wings, though I'm going for the ones I have posted. I don't want him to get too big.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Augustus b'Raass

[KrautScientist]

Hmm, the metal wings don't really do much for me -- I think the plastic wings just work better with the general look of the model. I also think Bjorn Firewalker has a point regarding how the model could use something that points towards its former life as an Astartes -- maybe the remains of a breastplate? You could also add some ports to the arms and torso where the power armour used to connect. And maybe some service studs and implants on his forehead as as well?

 

I also stand by the cowl -- it would be possible to have both a cowl and have some of the hair emerge from it. If anything, I'd say a cowl points towards a former mortal life somehow, and also ties him into a more general Death Guard look.

 

Another option would be to feature the suggestion of discarded armour on his base, almost like a shell that the daemonic creature burst out of at the moment of ascension.

 

Oh, and how about some disgusting texture on his arms? Some fly-like bristles, for example ;)

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

You already made up your mind and were working on it while asking for input?

 

[Augustus b'Raass]

Hmm, the metal wings don't really do much for me -- I think the plastic wings just work better with the general look of the model. I also think Bjorn Firewalker has a point regarding how the model could use something that points towards its former life as an Astartes -- maybe the remains of a breastplate? You could also add some ports to the arms and torso where the power armour used to connect. And maybe some service studs and implants on his forehead as as well?

 

I also stand by the cowl -- it would be possible to have both a cowl and have some of the hair emerge from it. If anything, I'd say a cowl points towards a former mortal life somehow, and also ties him into a more general Death Guard look.

 

Another option would be to feature the suggestion of discarded armour on his base, almost like a shell that the daemonic creature burst out of at the moment of ascension.

 

Oh, and how about some disgusting texture on his arms? Some fly-like bristles, for example

That's great! I mentioned the ports and the campaign studs on his forehead in the comments above, but I guess I must've subconsciously hoarded those from your comment or something. I like the idea of discarded armour.  Maybe I can salvage some plastic DP torso parts - I think I still have one somewhere. Re: the cowl - I'll just see what I can do there. About the fly-like texture - how would you suggest doing that? 

 

 

You already made up your mind and were working on it while asking for input?

 

No, as I wrote - I asked for advice and just started building the rest. The wings are pinned, but not glued - as evidenced by the latest pictures with the metal wings on it. :p

Hidden Content

Really: all options are still open - although with the ton of feedback I got, I think if I have to chose between the two options presented, I'll go for the plastic wings. The only thing set is the genera pose and the structural strengthening by means of the ruin. That's all, really - so if you have any ideas - I'd love to hear them! Edited July 30, 2018 by Augustus b'Raass

[Gederas]

 

 

Hmm, the metal wings don't really do much for me -- I think the plastic wings just work better with the general look of the model. I also think Bjorn Firewalker has a point regarding how the model could use something that points towards its former life as an Astartes -- maybe the remains of a breastplate? You could also add some ports to the arms and torso where the power armour used to connect. And maybe some service studs and implants on his forehead as as well?

 

I also stand by the cowl -- it would be possible to have both a cowl and have some of the hair emerge from it. If anything, I'd say a cowl points towards a former mortal life somehow, and also ties him into a more general Death Guard look.

 

Another option would be to feature the suggestion of discarded armour on his base, almost like a shell that the daemonic creature burst out of at the moment of ascension.

 

Oh, and how about some disgusting texture on his arms? Some fly-like bristles, for example

That's great! I already thought of the ports and the campaign studs on his forehead. Maybe I can salvage some plastic DP torso parts. I like the idea of discarded armour. :tu: Re: the cowl - I'll just see what I can do there. About the fly-liketexture - how would you suggest doing that?

I have an idea about the fly-like bristles:

 

Why not get some thin plastic rods, heat them up and pull them apart to get the bristling? Kind of like how Morbäck did the dripping fluids on these Plague Drones.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

I posted an idea earlier.