Duz does RG

[ShinyRhino]

 

@ Shrieker

 

Not to stray off-topic, but I just looked on the US site, and I couldn't find these manuals you refer to. Could you be so kind as to furnish a link? Much appreciated.

 

It looks like it's only available in the UK.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Stormcloud-Attack-Flight-Manual-SM-CSM#

 

Color me disappointed. I wanted some of those sheets for my vehicles.

[duz_]

So I got the day off work today because of bad weather.

Which gave me an opportunity to do some painting.

I finished off the rhino. I'd take a photo but the camera probably wouldn't show the edge highlighting.

I tried doing the highlights on the edges of the camo but it didn't quite work. Mainly because it meant doing more free hand straight lines...

I think it'll work for the table top. Although i'll see what happens with my next.

Anyhow that didn't take so long. So I decided I'd make some progress on my terminators. Unfortunately they took a lot longer than I thought. I got most of my Sgt done. I just need to finish his shield arm.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

What white did you use for the helmet/arm?

[duz_]

The white is

Chaos black primer

A few thin coats of ulthuan grey

Nulin wash

Very thin patient coats of lamian medium and white scar (occasionally with a little bit of water to help )

Its slow and somewhat painful. Which is why these guys are taking so much longer than I thought.

Next time I should cheat and do the off white whites. So much quicker and then I can highlight after. The dawnstone method Duncan did has me interested.

A bit more progress today

[Race Bannon]

Good formula, is that the gold you mentioned in another thread?

[duz_]

Yes its the same gold as the one mentioned here

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329841-raven-guard-humble-beginnings/?do=findComment&comment=4623693

 

You can also do it with a nulin wash and it doesnt come out as rich. But that's what I have been using on most my RG so far. I mixed it up a bit for the terminators.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Yes its the same gold as the one mentioned here

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/329841-raven-guard-humble-beginnings/?do=findComment&comment=4623693

 

You can also do it with a nulin wash and it doesnt come out as rich. But that's what I have been using on most my RG so far. I mixed it up a bit for the terminators.

duz, I don't like you anymore.  You just cost me $50 since there is no way Im going to be able to not buy a box of Terminators next time I'm at the local store. :<

 

I wish the pinion or battle company had an elite slot like the chaos warband :/

[Race Bannon]

Also ordered these for my Razorbacks. I love assault cannons. I think they're one of the best weapons in the game.

http://m.ebay.com/itm/252670302796?_mwBanner=1

The turrets are longer than the GW ones. Actually longer than I realised too. But still look neat and cheaper than trying to source GW ones.

I'm curious if you've made a pic of of this on your Rhino? It's one thing to see it adbertized, but another actually used.

[duz_]

duz, I don't like you anymore. You just cost me $50 since there is no way Im going to be able to not buy a box of Terminators next time I'm at the local store. :<

 

I wish the pinion or battle company had an elite slot like the chaos warband :/

Haha youre welcome. I run these in my 1st Co task force if Im running a TSF.

 

I'm curious if you've made a pic of of this on your Rhino? It's one thing to see it adbertized, but another actually used.

They're still in transit. They should hopefully arrive sometime this week, if not next. I will take pics then.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

 

duz, I don't like you anymore. You just cost me $50 since there is no way Im going to be able to not buy a box of Terminators next time I'm at the local store. :<

 

I wish the pinion or battle company had an elite slot like the chaos warband :/

Haha youre welcome. I run these in my 1st Co task force if Im running a TSF.

 

I'm curious if you've made a pic of of this on your Rhino? It's one thing to see it adbertized, but another actually used.

They're still in transit. They should hopefully arrive sometime this week, if not next. I will take pics then.

 

I really don't like the 1st company formation.  It is really clunky.  You gotta take like 550 points of stuff just to get access to terminators that dont charge out of DS or shoot twice or do anything special.  IMO it is better to take the blood angels version which does allow for charges out of DS.  Am I nuts to prefer shooty terminators since they actually do something the turn they arrive?  

 

Anyways... your assault terminators look great but fix that aquila!  It doesn't stand out enough.

[Race Bannon]

Could you use RG CT with the BA formation?

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Could you use RG CT with the BA formation?

No idea... I don't have the new BA book.  I'm just reading the formation from battlescribe.  It is a blood angel formation consisting of 3 units of assault terminators that can charge out of DS.  I don't really see any benefit they would get from being shrouded.  They have 3++ anyways... unlikely that shrouded would help them against overwatch any better than their invul save already does.  

[Race Bannon]

Bad question: could non-BA use BA formations?

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Bad question: could non-BA use BA formations?

I'm not the best person to ask about that.  Battlescribe has no objection to me adding a formation of BA alongside my raven guard though.  

 

Is this allowed?

 

Talon Strike Force

-pinion

-aux

 

+

 

Blood Angels Formation 

-arch angels orbital intervention force

 

I would assume this is legal.  Seems like the sort of rules juggling/list tetris you would use to make a tournament list.

[Race Bannon]

Hmmm. If so, then I have another book to buy :P Edited January 15, 2017 by Race Bannon

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Hmmm. If so, then I have another book to buy

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2016/10/40k-is-angels-blade-any-good.html

 

Scroll down a bit ... they have an 1850 list which is 3 formations from 3 different books/chapters mashed into 1 army.  The list looks extremely filthy though.  It is basically a drop pod/DS alpha strike insta-win army.

[duz_]

So didn't quite get through all of them with my 4 day weekend. 1 to go and some highlighting on another. At least they all have arms now!

I have a 1000pt game tomorrow where I'll be using the pinion demi co. It will also be the first time I have my RG on the table all with heads! :D RG shoulder pads are still in the pipeline. I joke at my store that its a race between GW releasing plastic Mk7 ones and me buying some.

[Race Bannon]

Man, good to see Raven Guard TDA   So, you are replacing the shoulder pads eventually?

[Claws and Effect]

Quick note: Any Raven Guard specific patterns should really be Kiavahr Pattern rather than Deliverance. Kiavahr is where all their special goodies are made.

[librisrouge]

Any chance we'll see a battle report from this 1k game.

[Nusquam]

Quick note: Any Raven Guard specific patterns should really be Kiavahr Pattern rather than Deliverance. Kiavahr is where all their special goodies are made.

 

Somethings are Deliverance Pattern. Somethings are Kiavahr Pattern, like one of the common combi-melta looks(which have 3 shots in lore). I'm betting it was just an 'oops' on FWs behalf, but you could take it as an opportunity for super secret Ravenspire tech.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Nusquam

[duz_]

NB some of the pics are apparently out of order. Ill fix that when im on my pc

So last night was my match up against DE.

The final score was 17-12, a humiliating defeat to the RG. Although they were valiant in their efforts.

We played maelstrom scenario 3, tactical escalation. (ie you get as many cards as the round number).

We play more or less play the rule book version of it.

The TL;DR version first

I started off strong in the first two turns scoring all my objectives and claiming first blood and setting myself up for line breaker with a successful drop pod landing in a relatively quiet corner of his deployment zone.

However, his T6! (normally T5) grotesques started to weaken my right flank from T2/3. His remaining obsec Venoms were able to claim markers in subsequent turns.

Once my right flank fell and my 2nd rhino (with all 3 HPs and 4+ cover!) was exploded by some lucky rolling by a single Warrior with blaster (6 to pen and 6 on the table at AP2) I lost a lot of mobility.

Turns 4,5 and 6 saw my opponent claw back maelstrom points while I struggled to claim mine between not having the mobility or not being able to contest objectives and undesirable cards like assaulting an assault based list and forcing failed leadership tests on a fearless army (at that point).

The game ended of T6, which saw my devastators succumb to another grotesque unit. 7 attacks from the leader alone at AP3 proved too much for my remaining 4 dev's.

Had the game gone to T7 I could have maybe hoped for a draw with a favorable draw. As well as my 2 remaining tactical squads, had joined one another on the other side of the board and still had some fire power left in them and enough distance from his assault units.

We used the new empyric storm cards. You draw them each player turn. Out of 6 turns, there was 4 cards that had any effect. 1 granted a model the psyker rule and Smite power, but failed castings meant auto perils. 1 caused D3 S6AP3 wounds, killed a single tactical marine, 1 gave everyone +1A which was kinda fun, the 4th allowed my opponent to redeploy 1 unit anywhere on the board 9" away from me. They didn't really add much to the game. Maybe if you’re doing the new campaign missions they'd be more fun.

I think my biggest failing was not grasping that the benefit his grotesques rolled at the beginning of the game was +1T. I had already formulated a plan around massed small arms fire dealing with mostly T3, AV10 and T5 units. T6 is tough to deal when the only things rolling to less than 6's to wound were my dev squad and 1 melta in a tactical squad. Neither of which really got a chance to fire on them.

Had his grotesques been T5 I think the first combat I was engaged with them might have gone slightly different. At least slowing them down 1 extra turn, if not possibly defeating them.

Now the extended version

The lists

RG: Pinion demi co

Cpt - Artificer armour, swift strike and murder, jump pack, auspex

AM - 5man, 2 flamers

2x Tac - 5man 1 flamer, rhino

1x Tac - 10 man, melta, grav cannon, imperial SM, drop pod

1x Dev - 5 man, 2x las, 2x plasma

2x Scouts - 5 man CCW

1x Scouts - 5 man bolters

995pts

DE

CAD

Succubus

3x 5man warrior squad, 1 blaster, venoms

Grotesquerie

Haemonculus

2x Grotesques - 3man radier

995pts

Deployment

We played on a 4x4 board with very heavy ruins. I knew initally it would be a tough match up because of the amount of LOS blocking pieces. It was thematic though and I figured my sneaky RG could try and use it to their advantage too. Which helped to some degree at the beginning of the game, but lead to issues later on.

I won the roll of to choose sides and deploy first.

I took the slightly heavier side of the board, trying to find the best spot to place my Dev's. Which was in a ruin in the corner of the board. From here they would start the game in LOS of 1 raider and essentially deny my opponent any chance of coming down that flank because it was a perfect fire zone.

My AM with shredmaster Cpt deployed in the centre ruins. Awaiting to counter charge the enemy once they got close.

Each flank had a rhino with a 5 man squad with flamer and they sat on objectives which were in my deployment zone.

1 scout squad supported my dev's in the ruins, the 2nd infiltrated further down the same flank. While a 3rd infiltrated in the diagonal opposite corner to my dev's. (I wish that they or LSS could take locator beacons!)

The pre game plan had been to outflank one of my rhinos with the scouts. With the objective placement though it seem to make sense to start both rhinos on the board already covering the 2 in my zone.

Night fight was in effect, but with all my ignore cover scouts it made little difference to either side.

Turn 1

My drop pod came in with precision. Landing right next to one of his venoms with 5man warrior squad. The scouts that were in the ruins next door moved up to provide ignores cover.

The scouts in the opposite corner, just hung around in the ruins with no real purpose that turn.

My AM and Cpt moved up to the edge of the ruin they were in. My SGT fell and tripped to his death in the process...

Both rhinos remained static as did the dev's.

Shooting saw my scouts run just enough to get into 9" of the 10 man squad that had deployed out of the drop pod (a whole 1"!).

They then granted them ignores cover (the rule just states in the shooting phase I can nominate a unit within 9". It doesn't say the SGT can’t act normally or it has to be at the beginning of so I guess this is acceptable?). The unit proceed to obliterate the venom and pin the disembarking warriors.

My Dev's with 2 lascannons and only 1 plasma cannon in range of a raider got 1 pen and stunned it. (As it would turn out I kept forgetting to roll my get hots for my plasma cannons until the 4th turn. Although they were generally out of range for most of the game and if not didn’t do any damage).

I scored my 1 card and first blood.

My opponent moved up the board, disembarking the grotesques from the stunned raider. The proceeded to obliterate the 5 man scout squad which was hanging out in the ruins.

He failed to score any points.

Turn 2

My AM squad stayed in position to claim the objective they were next to.

My dev's finished off the raider that was previously stunned.

The scouts and tactical squad finished off the disembarked warriors.

The left flank rhino remained stationary. While the second positioned it self to prepare for the counter offensive of the approaching grotesques.

I scored both points again. One being D3 from memory, 2 points.

My opponent moved to score some objectives with his venoms and pushed his grotesques towards my rhino which was expecting them.

A raider flat out in support.

His assault phase saw him make a 9" charge into the rhino. Destroying it, my tactical marines got out ready for the reprisal.

Turn 3

This is when my draws got a bit tough.

One was marker 6 which the grotesques were now contesting over the wreckage of my rhino, my tac's not being obsec.

They moved forward to flame and assault them. My AM's and Cpt jumped over to add to the assault.

My tactical marines and scouts in his deployment zone slowly (1" and 2" rolls) moved through cover to get view of the other venoms and warriors in the area (this would also prove an issue later).

My remaining rhino pushed up the side of the building looking for some easy targets and more objective markers.

The scouts supporting the dev's moved to claim the one the rhino had left and the plasma dev and sgt moved realising their vantage point was of little use any more.

My shooting phase was abysmal. My Tac squad and 2 flamers from the AM's did little damage to the T6 grotesques! Bolter fire did little better.

The other tac marine squad and scouts ran another 1" ...

The Dev's fired on a venom which kept passing 5+ invuls.

Meanwhile the combat went reasonably well. I did about 3 wounds to the beast. Most coming from Cpt shredmaster. However they did not break so I couldn’t run them down.

I believe I claimed 2 out of 3 objectives this turn.

My opponents phase saw him reinforce the flank where the combat was taking place, as well as scoring some more objectives.

A second squad or grotesques joined the combat as well as a 5 man warrior squad.

This proved to be the breaking point for my remaining units. With T6 and them not being MC's I couldn’t use grenades and even with shred my Cpt couldn’t get through their hide. Weight of AP3 attacks from the 2 grotesque sgts took down the remnants of both squads.

Turn 4

This was a real turning point of the game.

With 2 squads tripping over themselves in cover, the loss of a rhino and my AM's I was very flat footed.

The objectives I required were too far away and others required my opponent to fail a test or for me to win an assault.

Again due to the terrain I had limited shooting options. I wiped out all but 1 warrior in a squad near his deployment edge. Which then passed his leadership test.

My last rhino grabbed an objective that my AM had previously claimed.

My Dev's turned their guns on the quickly approaching grotesques, but did little damage.

The scouts moved to intercept.

The CC scout squad that had been slowly moving through cover assaulted a 4 man warrior squad hoping to wipe it out and claim objective.

However the warriors swung first at I5 and 2A each because of the empyric storm cards. They dropped 2 models in the first round, with numbers depleted it wasn't able to do enough damage in return.

My opponents turn saw him move some grotesques towards my dev's. The lone warrior blew up my last rhino! The odds were 1/108 of the result!

The warriors finished off the remaining scouts and the grotesques were out of charge range.

Turn 5

My final stand essentially.

I tried to claim what little points I could. I did this by wiping out the remaining warrior that had blown up my rhino. This required 2 units to fire at it. Which I had hoped to use 1 squad to assault the remaining warriors that had been fighting my scouts.

The scouts with the Dev's moved to get the charge on the grotesques as I needed to issue a challenge.

At this point his units were fearless which made my psychological warfare card impossible.

The scouts got their charge off, issue the challenge and then were wiped out before they could land a blow.

My opponent shuffled around some units to claim objectives. His grotesques hit my remaining devs wiping them out.

Turn 6 (final turn)

At this point there wasn’t much movement from either side. We had essentially circled each other around the board. With just a few warriors close to my remaining 2 tactical squads.

Nonetheless, it was a fun game. One of those which see the dice and card gods swing part way through the game.

Edited January 19, 2017 by duz_

[Shadow Captain Vyper]

Nice batrep! It looks like things are coming along nicely. After reading through it I have a few thoughts. (I know you didn't ask for criticism, so if it's unwanted feel free to ignore me )

1) When playing Dark Eldar (or any of the armies with superior mobility), I think the best method to approach them is to keep your army together and avoid fragmenting yourself too early on. You need to draw the enemy in by baiting with an aggressive unit, or by trying to get the opposition to commit his forces against you openly. Like the saying goes, a picture is worth a thousand words, and with the dense terrain, this game truly looked to be death by a thousand cuts. When I visualize playing an opponent like this, I imagine that fight scene from SIn City with Mickey Rourke and Elijah Wood. Where he's getting cut up, then manages to handcuff himself to the faster/more agile enemy, and beat the #$%& out of him. By keeping your force together, you can enable more retaliation when he comes for you. This of course can become an issue based on card draws in maelstrom. If you stay together, and score 1-2 points a turn, and he draws lots of "Control X" and spreads out, he can avoid coming to fight you altogether as well.

2) I feel like looking at the table and lists, this was the sort of game where Demi-Co may have been a better choice. The option to take/hold maelstrom from the heavy hitting grotesques could have proven pivotal, perhaps? Just curious how strong the ignores cover worked for you. Doesn't seem like it did much for the Devs, but the tacticals in the pod seemed to benefit from it quite well?

3) This smaller setting for points feels like an uphill battle in a way for Marines in general. What I mean by that is his access to mobility and weapons that can punish the opponent are much cheaper on a unit by unit basis. Venoms in particular are very good in smaller game like this where you can disengage and actually live, due to lessened return fire. I think the best chance of winning a game like this is trying to cram as many Jump Infantry or Bikes as you can into your list, to be able to reach out and cripple his mobility. The rerollable Hammer of Wrath will prove especially deadly against the lightly armored Eldar (both transports and infantry).

4) Given the nature of the board, I probably would have split up Murderwings and the ASM unit very early on, to try to have two units that could pressure his mobility.

On a less-criticism, more questioning line of thinking: How did you feel with having your tacticals split up in options, by having two in Rhinos, and one in a pod? I tend to gravitate towards all one or the other, and I was just curious if you felt like having a split in this sort of a game was an asset or a liability?

Overall, great batrep, look forward to seeing more! (And more of that camo pattern explored, its growing on me )

[Furiyen]

Nice Report Duz, really enjoyed it. I think your TH Terminators maybe working into your list very, very soon.

 

Not being familiar with Grotesque rules, what Save do they bring with? I'm wondering if Grav is much use against them...

[duz_]

Easy one first @Furiyen

Thanks. Yes I've featured in a couple of larger games I do like what they bring. Usually a lot of fear and concern! ;)

They are a 6+/5+FNP so bolters should have been ok against them at T5. So grav would be useless. Grav against DE in general is a bad idea. I brought it more because I want to test the overall effectiveness of that drop pod squad.

 

@Itvyer

Thoughts are always welcome

 

1) yes you are entirely correct

I deployed this way for a number of reasons. 1 I was hedging my bets on scoring points for markers for the first two turns.

2 I'm still getting a feel for SMs and want to see how they go for durability especially against these glass hammer style armies

3 Coming from a guard background I am well versed in castling up and laying down fire. I get a bit bored of that tactic so I'm trying to see how versatile SM are by comparison

 

2) ill have to admit battle demi co is probably the more rounded option, but im trying to keep my list somewhat fluffy. My group isn't super competitive so I don't want be the one who ups the ante. Its also part the reason I am more reluctant to use my raptor wing. Engaging the Grotesques in CC was my fatal mistake. I misjudged my odds and should have opted for a tactical retreat. I was actually wishing I was running a TSF so I could opt to fall back! The ignore cover was a great addition for both units. Each one used it every turn of the game almost. I really didn't need the 3rd scout squad but I had an awkward amount of points. A LSS would probably been a good idea TBH.

 

3)I think the lists were fairly balanced. 1000pts is not a bad size for SM. Smaller points they do start to struggle. My scout bikers aren't assembled yet unfortunately.

 

4)I had enough board control and mobilit early on. I should have used that unit to pick on venoms and warriors though. I didn't realise the grotesque leader could deal out 7 AP3 attacks alone!

 

I've come to really like my current set up. The drop pod with the 10 man really gives me the ability to apply pressure to high priority targets T1. The grav cannon and melta are a great combo surprisingly. Same range if you move and both can do a number on armour and TEQs.

The 2 mounted squads give me mobility and objective grabbing. If I have the points I'd run them as assault cannon razorbacks and outflank them with ignores cover.

Im planning on running my first co the same. Melta stern guard in a pod while the grav cruise in a rhino.

Im considering in that list getting a drop pod for my devs so I have 3 and can manipulate which 2 I want to show up first turn.