Chaos codex release date 8/5/17

[Panzer]

 

 

So with the tank, 3 units, 1 of which being a raptor with an icon of despair, that's minus 6 to somethings ld. And butcher cannon. So It can be minus 7?

Yeah that sounds like the maximum benefit...but also sounds like overkill lol

Just having -2 or -3 should be enough to be make a difference most of the time I'd say.

 

 

When you're fighting Orks or Bugs and you manage to kill the Synapse/Nobs nearby, you'll be glad for huge modifiers to reduce their huge units.

 

Orks maybe, but against Tyranids not really. Either you killed all Synapse in range then you won't need such a huge modifier, or there is a Synapse in range and then it doesn't matter anyway. ^^

[Ghorgul]

I don't think anyone should go all in with Ld modifiers. SM and many others can be handled okey if one can stack -3 to -4 Ld, i think. Against Orcs one needs plenty of Horde removal in case Orcs brings huge mobs of Boyz, more elites units shouldnt be huge problem.

Against Tyranids one needs good synapse removal, I don't know too much about that, have to start having practice matches with my Brother who plays Tyranids part-competitively.

 

Vehicle and Flyer heavy lists should be the absolute biggest problem if one tries to go all in with Ld modifiers.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Ghorgul

[Brother Aiwass]

And that's why I firmly think that at least 1 or 2 Xiphon Interceptors are almost mandatory.

[Brother Aiwass]

 

Tank -1

3 raptors -3

fearsome -1

Icon -1

Butcher -2

 

That's -8 in my book

To be fair the Raptors don't give a -1 modifier to LD but rather add 1 to morale tests. In this case it's the same outcome but it's in fact something different.

 

Damned perfECtionist

Edited August 2, 2017 by Brother Aiwass

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

I don't think anyone should go all in with Ld modifiers. SM and many others can be handled okey if one can stack -3 to -4 Ld, i think. Against Orcs one needs plenty of Horde removal in case Orcs brings huge mobs of Boyz, more elites units shouldnt be huge problem.

Against Tyranids one needs good synapse removal, I don't know too much about that, have to start having practice matches with my Brother who plays Tyranids part-competitively.

 

Vehicle and Flyer heavy lists should be the absolute biggest problem if one tries to go all in with Ld modifiers.

Flyers are actually pretty easy with Night Lords, at least. Charge them with Raptors and/or Heldrakes.

[Trevak Dal]

I got supreme confidence in my World Eaters ability to punch up with bugs, gangbangers and guardsmen. Might even sculpt a mustache worthy of a son of Dorn for my lord.

 

Just had a funny thought...Emperor's Children Daemonprince with dual claws modeled like Armstrong from Fullmetal Alchemist, lol.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Trevak Dal

[Bloody Legionnaire]

Night Lords sound incredibly awesome.. I guess once the rulebook hits we'll not for fact how everything is going to work.

 

If World Eaters and Word Bearers don't end up with anything near what NL got I might have to start a NL for myself. 

[1000 Sons]

Do we know for sure that Thousand Sons are getting their own codex, or is it still up in the air ? Hoping they are in this, I hate waiting.

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Do we know for sure that Thousand Sons are getting their own codex, or is it still up in the air ? Hoping they are in this, I hate waiting.

 

Yes, it has been confirmed in these latest legion sneak peaks that 1ksons and DG are getting their own soon.

[Panzer]

I got supreme confidence in my World Eaters ability to punch up with bugs, gangbangers and guardsmen. Might even sculpt a mustache worthy of a son of Dorn for my lord.

 

Just had a funny thought...Emperor's Children Daemonprince with dual claws modeled like Armstrong from Fullmetal Alchemist, lol.

That....would be fabulously terrifying!

 

 

Do we know for sure that Thousand Sons are getting their own codex, or is it still up in the air ? Hoping they are in this, I hate waiting.

That's been confirmed. You gonna have to wait a little longer to get rid of your Index.

[DreamIsCollapsing]

Well you can still play with the new Codex a Tzeencht warband with Rubric in Elit sloot and Magnus in a Auxillary Detachment.

 

Do someone know what happen to the "common" unit of special legion/Chapter ?

 

For exemple, a Dark Angel with a standard Land Raider must follow the profil & cost of the Index or the codex while waiting for the Dark Angel codex ?

Same question for DG & TS

[HeresyBeliever]

I have just made a £19 bet with myself (I purchased some Mutilators), 

 

That both Mutilators, Obliterators and Abaddon will have a reduction in points when the codex is released. 

[Plaguecaster]

The more I see stuff being revealed for the chaos marine Dex the harder it is to try and convince myself not to buy the new Dex and stick to death guard as my main army, a word bearers force with lots of Possessed just sounds so tempting :D Edited August 3, 2017 by Plaguecaster

[the jeske]

I don't think anyone should go all in with Ld modifiers. SM and many others can be handled okey if one can stack -3 to -4 Ld, i think. Against Orcs one needs plenty of Horde removal in case Orcs brings huge mobs of Boyz, more elites units shouldnt be huge problem.

Against Tyranids one needs good synapse removal, I don't know too much about that, have to start having practice matches with my Brother who plays Tyranids part-competitively.

 

Vehicle and Flyer heavy lists should be the absolute biggest problem if one tries to go all in with Ld modifiers.

Kind of a depends on the type of unit. suicide unit that are ment as hunters of elite units can work well. normally a 5 man unit doesn't care if it has to do a moral check, it either dies or doesn't take damge, but if you drop the Ld by 2 or 3 it takes way less fire power to finish it off. And you can drop two squads in the near of 2 support units split fire[as in one squad shots one enemy unit], but still double dip on the debuff to Ld.

[Gabocius]

 

 

Yeah that's how I'm reading it which sounds pretty solid to me. As the article pointed out even high LD units are going to have to worry about moral when facing Night Lords. I mean if you're facing space marines who cares about a ld reroll when you have ld3 or 4? Seems like a raptor heavy, assault focused NL army will actually work this edition. Their strategem seems pretty solid as well, could really help save a valuable unit from a strong shooting attack. 

And since rerolls happen before modifiers....

 

From what I see you could have the following:

 

Kill 4 Space Marines out of 10. They roll a 4, plus 4 casualties is an 8. Sarge is still alive, so there's no failure. Can't reroll.

 

THEN.....that -5 from Raptors/3 NL Units/Icon of Despair kicks in and they lose 5 models.

 

Ouch.

 

 

Nasty!

Then add in Butcher Cannons from FW for extra -2 Ld. One could have Contemptor with 2 butcher cannons shooting at 2 different units every turn and then pile in raptors next to those units.

NL Raptor squad + Butcher Cannon is -4 Ld already. Then if you add in Icon of Despairs. It's easy -5 Ld for 2 squads. You dont even want Raptors to be huge CC monsters, you only want them to be able to inflict as much damage all around as possible.

 

Then add in Fire Raptor and maybe use In midnight clad for it if enemy tries to take it down.

 

 

As sfPanzer said, raptors give a -1 modifier to the Ld test, so the outcome would be :

 

3 NL units, at least one being raptors and one having icon of despair (if attacking the same unit, not every one need to be raptor or have the icon as it doesn't stack...check for other marks / icon on the other units to increase their damage output !).

On a 10 man squad, X casualties, sarge alive. Ld to be taken into acount is 8-3-1=4 (modifiers are applied to the Ld, not the roll itself, so it's applied before the roll). This said, with X >= 3 the test is automatically failed, whatever the roll, tks to the +1 modifier to roll of the raptors.

So, as soon as you kill at least 3 man in a squad, the outcome of the morale test roll is the number of additionnal casualties, quite nice ! That's an average of 2.75 more casualties taking into account the reroll of the failed morale test for rolls >3.

 

Even with a single victim, the outcome of the morale test would actually be 1.5 additionnal casualties (a bit less with the reroll of failed morale tests).

 

Now if don't think of a single unit being attacked be our 3 NL units, but of 3 units being each attacked be one NL unit, in a perimeter small enough for the modifiers to all stack in each fight...then you really maximize the efffect of terror. Terror coordinate assault !! In response the adverse player shall place his units even further one from another than usual.

Now I'm dreaming of a stratagem that would increase the area of the terror effect

Edited August 3, 2017 by Gabocius

[Lord Asvaldir]

World Eaters faction focus is up. As expected their trait is +1 attack when a unit charges. Not amazing on say normal csm, but if you're running bezerkers as your troops that's going to be brutal. Their strategem costs 3cp which is a not pricey but bezerkers fighting 3 times in a turn with the extra charge attack sounds utterly brutal. Warlord trait also seems fun, similar to Angron's butcher's nails rule in 30k. The article also mentioned some artifacts that protect against psyker powers but without saying what they actually do..

 

Overall pretty much what I expected for WE. Assault oriented units like bezerkers, terminators and maybe even possessed are going to be solid choices, whereas ranged units won't get any benefits from the WE abilities.. As it should be with a khorne army!

[Iron_Within]

So....

IW vs WE = WE run across the table get hit with accurate shouting that ignores cover. Blenders any unitin reach who then doesn't run away and gets shot some more.

 

WE VS EC =runs across table gets shot even more than the dam IW. Charges and gets punched first. The 3 remaining guys hit back 30 billion times

 

WE VS NL = WE start running when SUDDENLY SURROUNDED BY SCARY THINGS. One guy dies and almost everyone else legs it from batman grimdarker sons. The three remaining guys get even angrier and start thier 3 billion punchy facey attacks

[Panzer]

Why not amazing on normal CSM? With a Chainsword it's still 3 Attacks on a basic Troop choice. ;)

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Well.  If you're playing World Eaters, why are you taking CSMs anyway?  Shouldn't you be stocking up on 'Zerks and Terminators to begin with?

[Panzer]

So....

IW vs WE = WE run across the table get hit with accurate shouting that ignores cover. Blenders any unitin reach who then doesn't run away and gets shot some more.

 

WE VS EC =runs across table gets shot even more than the dam IW. Charges and gets punched first. The 3 remaining guys hit back 30 billion times

 

WE VS NL = WE start running when SUDDENLY SURROUNDED BY SCARY THINGS. One guy dies and almost everyone else legs it from batman grimdarker sons. The three remaining guys get even angrier and start thier 3 billion punchy facey attacks

You...you don't know how the always strike first stuff works, don't you?

If you charge and the enemy has a always strike first rule they don't automatically strike before you guys.

It just means you activate units as if none would strike first. Which means since it's your turn you get to attack first with one of the units you charged with, then he attacks with one of his units, then you attack with one of the units you charged with and so on.

It's NOT like in 7th when you charge a unit with higher initiative than yours.

 

Also, d'uh, not all of your units get into melee without getting shot to bits first. Big surprise. But what gets there should be enough to kill units far bigger due the amount of high strength AP-1 attacks.

Well.  If you're playing World Eaters, why are you taking CSMs anyway?  Shouldn't you be stocking up on 'Zerks and Terminators to begin with?

Yeah, but nobody asked about how smart it is to take them in the first place. :D

[Iron_Within]

 

So....

IW vs WE = WE run across the table get hit with accurate shouting that ignores cover. Blenders any unitin reach who then doesn't run away and gets shot some more.

 

WE VS EC =runs across table gets shot even more than the dam IW. Charges and gets punched first. The 3 remaining guys hit back 30 billion times

 

WE VS NL = WE start running when SUDDENLY SURROUNDED BY SCARY THINGS. One guy dies and almost everyone else legs it from batman grimdarker sons. The three remaining guys get even angrier and start thier 3 billion punchy facey attacks

You...you don't know how the always strike first stuff works, don't you?

If you charge and the enemy has a always strike first rule they don't automatically strike before you guys.

It just means you activate units as if none would strike first. Which means since it's your turn you get to attack first with one of the units you charged with, then he attacks with one of his units, then you attack with one of the units you charged with and so on.

It's NOT like in 7th when you charge a unit with higher initiative than yours.

 

*urgh* I'm surprised you didn't call me out that I said that 3 berzerkers have 3 billion attacks when they only have 298,749 each... It's a tongue in cheek take on the Legion traits. 

 

Looking at it objectively I think these traits along with the Warlord traits, relics etc. are nicely balanced against each other. IW Legion Trait is ok, but the Warlord trait is the best I've seen yet for example. I'm looking forward to see how these forces square off.

[Khornestar]

Well, it's not like our army is worse with these traits/etc.

 

More attacks per model is great. Some psychic defense is cool, should we need to use it. We're not locked into artifacts/warlord traits the way we were in 7th, so pick before the battle as makes the most sense.

 

BUT... I'm really hoping that World Eaters either get a daemon weapon artifact, or there is a generic CSM daemon weapon available. Our cc characters aren't very impressive at dishing out damage right now, short of the named ones/daemon princes.

Edited August 3, 2017 by Juggernut

[Blackheart1223]

So WE get a Brass Collar Relic that allows the Bearer to deny 1 power per enemy psychic Phase and inflict a Perils on the caster if successful. They also get a stratagem that is an exact copy/paste of the Black Templar one. Nice that I don't have to worry about building psychic defense into my list anymore.

[dark_elf]

 

You...you don't know how the always strike first stuff works, don't you?

If you charge and the enemy has a always strike first rule they don't automatically strike before you guys.

It just means you activate units as if none would strike first. Which means since it's your turn you get to attack first with one of the units you charged with, then he attacks with one of his units, then you attack with one of the units you charged with and so on.

It's NOT like in 7th when you charge a unit with higher initiative than yours.

 

This is why I don't think the EC trait is any good. Any time the trait will kick in it's when my opponents charged. But if they charged they will strike first. If I charge I was always going to strike first.

 

Am I missing something? I just don't see how this trait is useful. 

[Panzer]

 

 

You...you don't know how the always strike first stuff works, don't you?

If you charge and the enemy has a always strike first rule they don't automatically strike before you guys.

It just means you activate units as if none would strike first. Which means since it's your turn you get to attack first with one of the units you charged with, then he attacks with one of his units, then you attack with one of the units you charged with and so on.

It's NOT like in 7th when you charge a unit with higher initiative than yours.

 

This is why I don't think the EC trait is any good. Any time the trait will kick in it's when my opponents charged. But if they charged they will strike first. If I charge I was always going to strike first.

 

Am I missing something? I just don't see how this trait is useful. 

 

You are missing that it works like a free counter-charge Stratagem so actually only every second (beginning with the first) charging unit of the opponent strikes first.

You are also missing that from the second combat phase on you simply strike first unless the enemy has a similar ability. ;)