Black Templars Index

[Sword Brother Adelard]

4 hours ago, Sea Creature said:

"On other note, seems very strange that you loose the scout on the Pcrusaders if u put characters with them…"

 

Not true as has been officially stated.

 

Well, it looks like it is according to the rule?

 

Where's this official statement?

[9x19 Parabellum]

Aannnnnnd it's up!!!

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/oF1iWIkNsvlUHByM.pdf?fbclid=IwAR2z8dTzwMYmhVskuKIARE-dzn1E32CgDciyNegjEHTzvHuROUkvffbpuu0

 

Helbrecht 105!

Grimaldus 120!

 

Both tasty!

 

Primaris Sword Brethren: 30 ppm

Primaris Crusader Squad:  16 ppm but have to take it in multiples of 10....oof... and RIP PCS in Land Raider Crusader :-(

Edited June 16, 2023 by 9x19 Parabellum

[Marshal Mattias]

It's sad that the days of oversized (Primaris) Crusader Squads are ending... 

I don't expect we'll see a lot of 20-man units on the table; it has rarely been more than a meme.

Also if you want more than 5 sword brethren, you pay for 11

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Great, so you need three boxes to make a full squad?

[9x19 Parabellum]

the presumption is that the stand-alone Castellan will go in with these guys for 11.  There is much wailing and gnashing of teeth going on in the Implausible Nature discord channel right now.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

5 minutes ago, 9x19 Parabellum said:

the presumption is that the stand-alone Castellan will go in with these guys for 11.  There is much wailing and gnashing of teeth going on in the Implausible Nature discord channel right now.

That makes even less sense tbh, because GW don't do units that need two different boxes to make up, They clearly mean you to build the optional castellan in the box as the castellan, plus the other four guys, but then you have to have 6 more? just make it 10.

 

[Tokugawa]

Brethen 30pts, Chosen 23pts. Where is the internal logic?

[9x19 Parabellum]

Ok well here are the choices; you choose whatever you want to believe.

 

EITHER:

1. GW intended for the Castellan (or similar single HQ-ish type_ model) to be included as part of the Primaris Sword Brethren Unit.

OR.

2. GW does not know that their PSB box contains 5 models, and/or that 5x2 = 10, and/or that 10 is not 11.

OR

3. The PSB Datasheet is a typo.

 

Given the infeasability of #2, and the the very intentional printing of the unit composition of the datasheet (#3). i think #1 is the most likely scenario.

 

Also I think the Chunky-boi Castellan model is meant to be the Castellan Datasheet (it's the corresponding art to that datasheet).  And either he, or the Marshall/Castellan that comes in the big BT box  is meant to pull double duty (optional) in the PSB box.

[Sete]

I dont know what to make of this. Unit sizes are a bit annoying, also the lack of flexibility on the PCS. 

 

Anyway gonna start building the crusade.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

35 minutes ago, 9x19 Parabellum said:

Ok well here are the choices; you choose whatever you want to believe.

 

EITHER:

1. GW intended for the Castellan (or similar single HQ-ish type_ model) to be included as part of the Primaris Sword Brethren Unit.

OR.

2. GW does not know that their PSB box contains 5 models, and/or that 5x2 = 10, and/or that 10 is not 11.

OR

3. The PSB Datasheet is a typo.

 

Given the infeasability of #2, and the the very intentional printing of the unit composition of the datasheet (#3). i think #1 is the most likely scenario.

 

Also I think the Chunky-boi Castellan model is meant to be the Castellan Datasheet (it's the corresponding art to that datasheet).  And either he, or the Marshall/Castellan that comes in the big BT box  is meant to pull double duty (optional) in the PSB box.

 

Its none of those. The PSB box includes an option to build one model as a 'Castellan,. That's why the original unit was 4-10, so you could build the 5 models as either 5 PSB, 10 PSB or 4 PSB and one separate Castellan.

Now they've thrown that Castellan in as the unit's "Sergeant", but seemingly double counted him somewhere?

[redmapa]

Yeah the unit sizes are very clunky when you're used to more granularity but it's not a big deal to me, I'll get used to it and I still want to give 10th a try. Overall I think the points are pretty good, I can fit a lot of other units to go with 2 Raiders and a block of Terminators which are still 1000pts but the rest feels cheaper while the 1000pts of Terminators and Raiders feel worth their points imo, so at first glance I think we are still doing well, we shall see how that fares in reality.

[Sir Clausel]

So i was making a list to try out on sunday. Marines have gone up in points for alot of stuff. My list is around 10% more expensive.

And boy im not liking that you have to either take min or max. Makes kinda difficult to make a list close to 2000 points

Edited June 16, 2023 by Sir Clausel

[Kilamandaros]

Looks like we have to pay 15-20 points for the privilege of having an option for multi melta on primaris vehicles? What a joke - was actually going to buy an executioner but I'll save the cash!

Edited June 16, 2023 by Kilamandaros

[Emperor Ming]

3 hours ago, Kilamandaros said:

Looks like we have to pay 15-20 points for the privilege of having an option for multi melta on primaris vehicles? What a joke - was actually going to buy an executioner but I'll save the cash!

That's a bit stupid, considering everyone gets free gear now........

[SkimaskMohawk]

3 hours ago, Kilamandaros said:

Looks like we have to pay 15-20 points for the privilege of having an option for multi melta on primaris vehicles? What a joke - was actually going to buy an executioner but I'll save the cash!

 

I mean, the points they actually cost for most of their lifespan in 9th? It does suck that it's basically the only upgrade that still costs points, but you can also just run a gladius and save a bunch of points. And even at 20 points, it's not the worst upgrade for an executioner; you can follow up the big laser for the below half strength bonus to hit against the big stuff. Especially on oaths. 

 

On a completely different note, i wonder how many msu crusader squads will start popping up for the 3/5 special weapon efficiency. Could still take some intercessors to sticky objective your way up the board.

[Tokugawa]

Our named heroes priced properly, if not aggressively. But aren't they on the very beginning of a Templar player's shopping list?

 

Crusaders are OK. 75pts Oldborn crusader squad is also OK for some backyard work?

 

Desolation marine on 24pts is absolutely crazy. But they can't be acquired at reasonable price, before the retail box arriving with new marine codex, so I just don't think about them.

[Medjugorje]

I really hate the new MM rules. Its just a trash weapon and absolutely overpriced ... AND NOW WE HAVE TO TAKE IT... wow GW.

 

 

The next thing is that my next list is 2010 points... i could cut the enhencement but cant buy anything with it... I would like to cut all MM out of it. Maybe its better to play my BT as Gladius to have Advance + charge and far cheaper.

[The Emperors Champion22]

52 minutes ago, Medjugorje said:

I really hate the new MM rules. Its just a trash weapon and absolutely overpriced ... AND NOW WE HAVE TO TAKE IT... wow GW.

 

 

The next thing is that my next list is 2010 points... i could cut the enhencement but cant buy anything with it... I would like to cut all MM out of it. Maybe its better to play my BT as Gladius to have Advance + charge and far cheaper.

If someone is gonna not play you over 10 points then they can kick rocks

[SkimaskMohawk]

Multi meltas are trash? Maybe if you're a faction where they're the only real source of anti tank, like sisters of battle.

 

But they're a great supplemental weapon to the dedicated things like the laser destroyer. In fact, against lander Raiders and other t12 vehicles, the MM averages more damage than the lascannon...without being in melta range, and barely falls behind against t10-11. Against their oath target they surpass lascannons into t10-11, still without counting the melta bonus.

 

Idk, i feel selfish saying i want a multimelta and a 6fnp over every other marine version for free. Maybe I'm out of touch with modern marine players.

[Tokugawa]

If this forced-to-buy weapon is 5 or 10 pts, no one would bother anything. 

 

But the reality is, on some tanks it even cost 25pts. Even in prime time of multi-melta, 25pts was still a price needed to carefully consider. Now it is robbery.

[9x19 Parabellum]

3 hours ago, Medjugorje said:

I really hate the new MM rules. Its just a trash weapon and absolutely overpriced ... AND NOW WE HAVE TO TAKE IT... wow GW.

 

 

The next thing is that my next list is 2010 points... i could cut the enhencement but cant buy anything with it... I would like to cut all MM out of it. Maybe its better to play my BT as Gladius to have Advance + charge and far cheaper.

 

So I've read the detachment rules for Gladius Strike Force and I actually do think you're on to something.
I also think it's very easy to use the Librarian and just call it something else (for fluff).  Call it a "Apostle of the Crusade" or something like that.  4+ fnp against psychic attacks and 4++ is very Black - Templary.  Give him a shield and say he's "reflecting back psychic energy" (to represent the psychic ranged attacks that a librarian gets) and the force weapon is suitably statted per a black templar fighter anyway.

 

Now you can get your vehicles w/o paying the stupid price for the Multimeltas.

[Lord_Ikka]

1 hour ago, SkimaskMohawk said:

In fact, against lander Raiders and other t12 vehicles, the MM averages more damage than the lascannon...without being in melta range, and barely falls behind against t10-11. Against their oath target they surpass lascannons into t10-11, still without counting the melta bonus.

How are you calculating a multi-melta being better than a lascannon against T10+ vehicles? 

[SirJyo]

Have we discussed the anti synergy with Helbrecht missing the "chapter master keyword.

Or our marshal missing the "captain" keyword?

[Tokugawa]

1 hour ago, SirJyo said:

Have we discussed the anti synergy with Helbrecht missing the "chapter master keyword.

Or our marshal missing the "captain" keyword?

With brethren max size become "11 models" I feel it may be intended. 12 models is max capacity of some transports. He is headstrong and don't want another advisor join the squad to advice him how to do?

[Kastor Krieg]

4 hours ago, 9x19 Parabellum said:

 

So I've read the detachment rules for Gladius Strike Force and I actually do think you're on to something.
I also think it's very easy to use the Librarian and just call it something else (for fluff).  Call it a "Apostle of the Crusade" or something like that.  4+ fnp against psychic attacks and 4++ is very Black - Templary.  Give him a shield and say he's "reflecting back psychic energy" (to represent the psychic ranged attacks that a librarian gets) and the force weapon is suitably statted per a black templar fighter anyway.

 

Now you can get your vehicles w/o paying the stupid price for the Multimeltas.

+ RECLUSIARCH! THIS FRATER, RIGHT HERE! +