Imperial Guard Commissar Graves + Centaur RSV + Hippogriff AFV

[SteveAntilles]

46 minutes ago, L30n1d4s said:

I agree about a Centaur loaded with (2) HWTs.

 

If you go with Krieg HWTs, then you can have 6 x D6 D5 AP-1 Dmg2 shots that autohit and ignore cover (which work equally well with both regular shooting and Overwatch)

 

If you go with Catachan HWTs, you can choose 6 Lascannons, give the Centaur Scout 6", and then turn 1 stay still (to activate Heavy) and give them +1BS with an order... that's 6 Lascannon shots hitting on 3+s... if you are running Grizzled Company, then the Centaur also gets reroll 1s to Hit and you can use a Strat to give its shooting Ignores Cover.

Can't fit two Krieg teams though, because of the fire coordinator. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Do you think they typo’d the heavy lascannon profile, or did that on purpose?

 

also just realized the meltagun can be paired with any main weapon.

 

Auspex tactics has a hippogriff break down video up with average damage stats for the main guns.

 

lascannon/melta is looking nice, but so is v-cannon/melta.

 

 

Edited April 16 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Tastyfish]

The hippogriff looks small enough that it could even use more or less anything Centaur/Chimera sized and up as LOS blocking terrain.

Shooting and scooting out from behind a Dorn or Russ etc.

Edited April 16 by Tastyfish

[Crimson Longinus]

Hippogriff is very cute and I want at least one. But the firepower certainly is not impressive. Move-shoot-move is nice and all, but it doesn't matter that much if they cannot actually kill anything. It also is a bit annoying that probably the best loadout is the big melta with the small melta as that is the only combination that looks goofy. 

 

Maybe an anti-infanty loadout and rushing them to contest and clear objectives might work?

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

Hippogriff is very cute and I want at least one. But the firepower certainly is not impressive. Move-shoot-move is nice and all, but it doesn't matter that much if they cannot actually kill anything. It also is a bit annoying that probably the best loadout is the big melta with the small melta as that is the only combination that looks goofy. 

 

Maybe an anti-infanty loadout and rushing them to contest and clear objectives might work?

What are you talking about?

 

the v-cannon is perfect anti-MEQ, and pairs well with either coaxial weapon 

 

Double melta is solid into really heavy armor

 

las/melta is great into medium and heavy armor.

 

its not a battle tank. It’s a scout car, as such it’s meant to take opportunistic shots at heavier vehicles and primarily screen against infantry and other scout vehicles.(also monsters in 40K)

[Kommisar_K]

4 hours ago, L30n1d4s said:

I agree about a Centaur loaded with (2) HWTs.

 

If you go with Krieg HWTs, then you can have 6 x D6 D5 AP-1 Dmg2 shots that autohit and ignore cover (which work equally well with both regular shooting and Overwatch)

 

If you go with Catachan HWTs, you can choose 6 Lascannons, give the Centaur Scout 6", and then turn 1 stay still (to activate Heavy) and give them +1BS with an order... that's 6 Lascannon shots hitting on 3+s... if you are running Grizzled Company, then the Centaur also gets reroll 1s to Hit and you can use a Strat to give its shooting Ignores Cover.

 

And the value just keeps increasing! 

 

"It's a good day to guard!"

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Id just like to point out that centaur says it can transport 12 infantry models, ogryns count as 3, can’t transport artillery.

so unless they redesignate HWSes as artillery they don’t count as 2 models.

 

might be an oversight that gets FAQ’d but as it stands you can pack 9 lascannons and 3 autocannons in there if you want

[Tastyfish]

15 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Id just like to point out that centaur says it can transport 12 infantry models, ogryns count as 3, can’t transport artillery.

so unless they redesignate HWSes as artillery they don’t count as 2 models.

 

might be an oversight that gets FAQ’d but as it stands you can pack 9 lascannons and 3 autocannons in there if you want

"Counts as two for transport and firing deck" is a special rule of the heavy weapon team, rather than a transport note like the ogryns.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

45 minutes ago, Tastyfish said:

"Counts as two for transport and firing deck" is a special rule of the heavy weapon team, rather than a transport note like the ogryns.

Nvm

 

it’s so stupid how they put information for different units in two different places 

Edited April 16 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[DemonGSides]

4 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Nvm

 

it’s so stupid how they put information for different units in two different places 

 

Agreed, it should always just be on a unit's data sheet how much space they take up.  I can't think of a situation where units have different numbers depending on the transport type.  Then if there is some reason for it to be different, then the actual transport datasheet can have that as part of it's abilities.  Very silly.

[Crimson Longinus]

11 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

What are you talking about?

 

the v-cannon is perfect anti-MEQ, and pairs well with either coaxial weapon 

 

And by "perfect" you mean it can almost kill two marines. 

 

11 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Double melta is solid into really heavy armor

 

las/melta is great into medium and heavy armor.

 

Well, the "melta cannon" is actually just a multimelta. The melta loadout is basically like a SoB squad with multimelta and melta, except without bolters and pistols. And the "heavy las cannon" is actually just a normal lascannon.

 

I don't understand why they named them this way, because both "melta cannon" and "heavy lascannon" are already existing guard weapons and have significantly more powerful profiles in their other appearance. 

 

11 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

its not a battle tank. It’s a scout car, as such it’s meant to take opportunistic shots at heavier vehicles and primarily screen against infantry and other scout vehicles.(also monsters in 40K)

 

But yeah, you are probably right. It should be compared to marine ATV or attack bike. It just sorta looks like a tank so it made me compare it to the real tanks. But I definitely expected a bit more fire power. Like I expected the turret weapon to have a bit more punch than a normal portable heavy weapons that a lot of imperial armies have.

[MoriyaSchism]

If armour facings were a thing the armoured car would have a bit more anti-tank bite like actual scout cars with high velocity cannons. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

9 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

And by "perfect" you mean it can almost kill two marines. 

 

 

Well, the "melta cannon" is actually just a multimelta. The melta loadout is basically like a SoB squad with multimelta and melta, except without bolters and pistols. And the "heavy las cannon" is actually just a normal lascannon.

 

I don't understand why they named them this way, because both "melta cannon" and "heavy lascannon" are already existing guard weapons and have significantly more powerful profiles in their other appearance. 

 

 

But yeah, you are probably right. It should be compared to marine ATV or attack bike. It just sorta looks like a tank so it made me compare it to the real tanks. But I definitely expected a bit more fire power. Like I expected the turret weapon to have a bit more punch than a normal portable heavy weapons that a lot of imperial armies have.

2 marines is nearly half a squad…yeah that’s good. Unless you want to go back to having the game be hyper lethal

 

i did previously specifically wonder here if that was a typo or intentional in regards to the heavy lascannon.

 

regardless of the names of weapons the profiles are solid profiles. A lascannon and a melta shot, or 3 melta shots is solid fire power for a light recon vehicle.

 

dont see people complaining sentinels are under gunned when the fill the same niche. It could be argued these are more heavily armed than their chicken walker cousins 

 

I definitely expected the v-cannon to have more punch, and was hoping it would clearly outshine an autocannon in the light AT roll, but as it stands it seems like they’re pretty even.

 

9 hours ago, MoriyaSchism said:

If armour facings were a thing the armoured car would have a bit more anti-tank bite like actual scout cars with high velocity cannons. 

I definitely think the vigilator cannon could have been AP-2 or damage 3, without being the obvious choice, making the vehicle too busted.

 

like a <blast> Ad6 S8 AP-2 D2 really that good?

or 

<blast> Ad3+1 S8 AP-1 D3 really that good?

[The Pounder]

I’ll be taking 2 Hippogriff (because they’re in the box!)

 

First one will be the double Melta second will be Vigilator and HeavyStubber.

 

As for the Centaur I’ll probably run 2 with a Krieg Combat Engineers in each!

 

Even if they’re a little underwhelming I think the models are cool!

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 hours ago, The Pounder said:

I’ll be taking 2 Hippogriff (because they’re in the box!)

 

First one will be the double Melta second will be Vigilator and HeavyStubber.

 

As for the Centaur I’ll probably run 2 with a Krieg Combat Engineers in each!

 

Even if they’re a little underwhelming I think the models are cool!

Honestly if they’re not bringing points for wargear back, why not the melta?

if you want anti-infantry the Gatling cannon is a better choice, and d6+blast is already solid anti-infantry, the stubber provides negligible anti-infantry capability while the melta props up the vehicle’s capability against armor.

 

I’d love if the new CP had a hippogriff, but I bet it will be a centaur.

bet we get a mid edition army box that will have one of each, plus whatever the regiment flavor of the week is for battleline, command squad, and heavy weapon squad, or arty unit

Edited April 18 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Tastyfish]

Don't think of the hippogriffs as a light tank, it's the third type of sentinel.

Scout sentinels get scout and can move more easily into cover to find a good firing spot or to claim an early objective. Armoured sentinels have a 2+ save to let them shoot from the backfield.

 

The wheeled sentinels don't scout but can move fast and dip in and out of cover for when you want a mid to late game sentinel. Sure they might kill two marines, but the idea is that those might be the penultimate two marines. Or they can move to contest somewhere where OC4 matters.

[HeadlessCross]

16 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

And by "perfect" you mean it can almost kill two marines. 

 

 

Well, the "melta cannon" is actually just a multimelta. The melta loadout is basically like a SoB squad with multimelta and melta, except without bolters and pistols. And the "heavy las cannon" is actually just a normal lascannon.

 

I don't understand why they named them this way, because both "melta cannon" and "heavy lascannon" are already existing guard weapons and have significantly more powerful profiles in their other appearance. 

 

 

But yeah, you are probably right. It should be compared to marine ATV or attack bike. It just sorta looks like a tank so it made me compare it to the real tanks. But I definitely expected a bit more fire power. Like I expected the turret weapon to have a bit more punch than a normal portable heavy weapons that a lot of imperial armies have.

It doesn't need to be efficient at killing because it shoots and scoots. That's invaluable. 

[Casual Heresy]

I think I love the Hippogriff. It looks cool, the rules look fun and It’s certainly settled the problem I’ve been having with my growing guard collection. 
 

I love the updated Cadians, and I love the baroque style of the Vostroyan infantry I have which pair well with Krieg in the style I’m planning the paint mine (bronze armour and red great coats). I want both but can’t justify having doubles of vehicles and units just to have two styles of guard army. 
 

The new stuff gives me a solution. My Cadians will be a lighter infantry focussed force with plenty of Hippogriffs, Sentinels, and I’ll focus on sneaky movement trickery lists. The Vostroyans/Krieg force will be a more traditional guard list with artillery and tanks (and one day build up to a full Imperial pony club list). Two distinct collections with distinct play styles so I’m not just building the same army twice. There will be a couple of shared units like a Commissar Tank Commander. 
 

Now the final question is; will I be painting the new stuff as traditional Cadians or Ultramar Auxilia?

[Crimson Longinus]

9 hours ago, HeadlessCross said:

It doesn't need to be efficient at killing because it shoots and scoots. That's invaluable. 

 

Why? It is only valuable if the shooting actually does something. Scooting to miss with one normal lascannon shot is not valuable. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

7 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

Why? It is only valuable if the shooting actually does something. Scooting to miss with one normal lascannon shot is not valuable. 

Things have value beyond how much damage they can do.

 

The value is the threat they pose. It forces your opponent to take them into account and plan around them.

 

But they should do reliable damage, and they likely will.

[Crimson Longinus]

35 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Things have value beyond how much damage they can do.

 

The value is the threat they pose. It forces your opponent to take them into account and plan around them.

 

But they should do reliable damage, and they likely will.

 

But the issue is that this thing does not pose a threat. Seriously, look at the damage output, and remember that in the new edition cover will be -1 to hit. It is anaemic. No one is scared of one lascannon that misses two thirds of the time. Like sure, if this thing cost 50 points or so, then it might be good, but I bet it is gonna be more than that, possibly quite a bit more. 

[Dr. Clock]

Some legitimate criticisms on the Hippo for sure... It does seem like effectively a third sentinel type, but I'd be rolling with the Vigilator for sure. I can't see more than 65 points, which is pretty rough considering the likely expense in time and money. It could/should have been much closer to Achilles Ridgerunner profiles IMO... I guess all the best lasers in the Imperium are used for mining rather than xenocide...

 

Anyhow, hopefully they do beef the profiles up a bit in future after they see how it sells compared to everyone's new fave half-track. 

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[HeadlessCross]

3 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

Why? It is only valuable if the shooting actually does something. Scooting to miss with one normal lascannon shot is not valuable. 

Because it ensures you get multiple turns of shooting than normal for such a unit. Over time, that's more damage. 

[redmapa]

2 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

But the issue is that this thing does not pose a threat. Seriously, look at the damage output, and remember that in the new edition cover will be -1 to hit. It is anaemic. No one is scared of one lascannon that misses two thirds of the time. Like sure, if this thing cost 50 points or so, then it might be good, but I bet it is gonna be more than that, possibly quite a bit more. 

 

Welcome to the Guard! Nothing poses a threat unless there's 3 of them and the infantry is expendable, this thing fits right in as a Sentinel alternative where Sentinels might be cheaper this thing will survive longer and be useful in the long term to get objectives and protect your real heavy hitters like Russes and Dorns.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, redmapa said:

 

Welcome to the Guard! Nothing poses a threat unless there's 3 of them and the infantry is expendable, this thing fits right in as a Sentinel alternative where Sentinels might be cheaper this thing will survive longer and be useful in the long term to get objectives and protect your real heavy hitters like Russes and Dorns.

Armored sentinel will probably survive slightly longer with its 2+