[HH1.0] 30k Space Wolves tactics

[Jackalwolf]

I could be wrong but I dont think so. You setup your models. Opponent sets up his models. Now you take your 6 inch scout move if you are infantry or 12 inch scout move if you are a vehicle.

 

Now I am just basing my conversation on the Iron Warriors gunline I play against and the Alpha Legion list I was using for a time. As the whole army infiltrates after you are done setting up, I can get all the firing angles  I want and most likely go first, and the quad lascannons arent going to do much to artillery as most times they are going to put that in cover, so you might peel a wound or two off 1 quad mortar if the spartan even has LOS.

 

That's just my point, yeah the deathstar when it gets into combat will do fine, but at the expense of that one unit you really have no shooting- it should be easy for a good opponent to isolate and destroy your other supporting elements because the spartan wants to rush up the board right? So its a win for me if I can force you to disembark back in your deployment and keep you from pushing forward.

That is a good point indeed but if you're going to infiltrate alpha I'll outflank both vets squads and deny that power, while moving the Spartan all up fro the with scout so I'm out of multi melta range, and pray for the best with the mortis.

 

Actually you're making me realise if be better off without the mortis and with an extra flier or unit I can outflank or rush forward from deployment but I do like the model...

[Baluc]

@Grieux Scout isn't a move it is a 6" or 12" redeployment. 

 

The problem in your list isn't the specifics its the premise. Some legions are just better of not fielding their Primarch in this case I think we are one of them. Leman Russ dominates our armylist in a way that is unmanageable. I typically am very hard on Primarchs that need a transport outside of mega battles or large scale narrative gaming. The only Primarchs I consider viable at 2.5 are Mortarion, Corax, Night Haunter, Perterabo, and Horus can be made to work as well. 

[Jackalwolf]

Yep I get the point but I won't be able to field anything beyond 2k without Russ until at least 18 months from now so I have to make the best of it, and as it is making him hit and run, proffered enemy, fnp and 8 extra wounds is the best use I can find for him which means investing circa 50% of army points in it and bootstrap the rest of the list.

 

EDIT: just checked and yep as both of you mentioned 6' redeploy for infantry, monstrous creatures and walkers and 12' for anything else.

Edited March 7, 2017 by Grieux

[Baluc]

Yep I get the point but I won't be able to field anything beyond 2k without Russ until at least 18 months from now so I have to make the best of it, and as it is making him hit and run, proffered enemy, fnp and 8 extra wounds is the best use I can find for him which means investing circa 50% of army points in it and bootstrap the rest of the list.

 

Maybe start with a list of what you have, that way we can make suggestions that are viable.

[Runefyre]

@Grieux Scout isn't a move it is a 6" or 12" redeployment. 

 

The problem in your list isn't the specifics its the premise. Some legions are just better of not fielding their Primarch in this case I think we are one of them. Leman Russ dominates our armylist in a way that is unmanageable. I typically am very hard on Primarchs that need a transport outside of mega battles or large scale narrative gaming. The only Primarchs I consider viable at 2.5 are Mortarion, Corax, Night Haunter, Perterabo, and Horus can be made to work as well. 

And of course Magnus. That bastard does everything. A little too much of everything. For only 40 more points than Russ.

Edited March 7, 2017 by Runefyre

[Jackalwolf]

I'm going to stick to the list I posted with some tweaks if needed like multi melta rhinos for the vets and make them outdlank as needed depending on opponent.

 

A quick alternative sacrificing anti air is

 

Hvarl Red-Blade 210

 

The Wolf-kin of Russ 100

 

Speaker of the Dead: Artificer armour; Great Frost blade; Melta bombs 130

 

3 Space Marine Chosen: 2 × Power weapon; Single lightning claw; 3 × Combat shield 140

 

Hunters of Kattegat (10 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Artificer armour; Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 9 Veteran Space Marines; 3 × Power weapon 210

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

Hunters of Kattegat (10 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Artificer armour; Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 9 Veteran Space Marines; 3 × Power weapon 210

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

6 Varagyr Terminators: 6 × Second Frost blade (axe, claw or sword); 4 × Power fist; 2 × Chainfist 352

• Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Leman Russ 455

 

2,517 points

 

You depend in four quad lascannons for anti air but gain more anti armor, start with a 12' scout move for the two Spartan, have the vets outflank and shoot with multi melta and in turn two charge with all and use the two Spartan as mobile artillery.

 

Or you can drop Hvarl and sacrifice scout to gain a flier or an extra unit or whatever.

 

Or drop the Wolf kin and Hvarl and add Geigor and a lightning with kraken.

 

Main point is I'm convinced the Pale hunter is powerful if used well and represents perectly the Night of the Wolf where the SW made some genius tactical maneuvers while in close quarter combat.

Edited March 7, 2017 by Grieux

[Purge the Daemon]

I'm going to stick to the list I posted with some tweaks if needed like multi melta rhinos for the vets and make them outdlank as needed depending on opponent.

 

A quick alternative sacrificing anti air is

 

Hvarl Red-Blade 210

 

The Wolf-kin of Russ 100

 

Speaker of the Dead: Artificer armour; Great Frost blade; Melta bombs 130

 

3 Space Marine Chosen: 2 × Power weapon; Single lightning claw; 3 × Combat shield 140

 

Hunters of Kattegat (10 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Artificer armour; Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 9 Veteran Space Marines; 3 × Power weapon 210

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

Hunters of Kattegat (10 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Artificer armour; Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 9 Veteran Space Marines; 3 × Power weapon 210

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

6 Varagyr Terminators: 6 × Second Frost blade (axe, claw or sword); 4 × Power fist; 2 × Chainfist 352

• Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Leman Russ 455

 

2,517 points

 

You depend in four quad lascannons for anti air but gain more anti armor, start with a 12' scout move for the two Spartan, have the vets outflank and shoot with multi melta and in turn two charge with all and use the two Spartan as mobile artillery.

 

Or you can drop Hvarl and sacrifice scout to gain a flier or an extra unit or whatever.

 

Or drop the Wolf kin and Hvarl and add Geigor and a lightning with kraken.

 

Main point is I'm convinced the Pale hunter is powerful if used well and represents perectly the Night of the Wolf where the SW made some genius tactical maneuvers while in close quarter combat.

 

Honestly Spartans without upgrades die really fast and if you get imbolized or try to cross terrain it's bad news without dozer blade etc.

 

Honestly you shouldn't ever use giegor unless he's the only character in a squad with warriors mettle. Simply because a Praetor can buy refractor field paragon blade for the same cost and thus is already better.

 

I don't know if I rate dedicated melee vets they are good except a Rhino means they wait for a turn to get shot at.

 

Also as a side note I don't know how your meta is but I wouldn't feel comfortable being 17 points over.

[Jackalwolf]

Or particularly for what the iron warrior gun line our colleague mentions:

 

Vlka Fenryka

 

Speaker of the Dead: Artificer armour; Great Frost blade; Melta bombs 130

 

3 Space Marine Chosen: 2 × Heavy chainsword; Power fist; 3 × Combat shield 130

 

Centurion: Artificer armour; Great frost blade 85

 

Centurion: Artificer armour; Great frost blade 85

 

Hunters of Kattegat (9 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 8 Veteran Space Marines; 2 × Power weapon 178

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

Hunters of Kattegat (9 Veteran Space Marines): Veteran Sergeant (Power weapon); Warrior's Mettle; 8 Veteran Space Marines; 2 × Power weapon 178

• Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier: Pintle-mounted multi-melta 50

 

6 Varagyr Terminators: 6 × Second Frost blade (axe, claw or sword); 6 × Power fist 342

• Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Primaris-Lightning Strike Fighter: 2 × Two Kraken penetrator heavy missiles 205

 

Legion Spartan Assault Tank 305

 

Leman Russ 455

 

2,498 points

 

No more scout but who cares since all that starts on the board is on assault Spartans. Then bring out flanking vets on a 2+ and in turn two charge with the two cc units in Spartans, the vets with attached centurions,and bring in the lightning. Four quad lascannons plus two out flanking multi meltas plus the lightning with krakens while still, having two massive cc threats, Russ with hit and run and two vet squads capable of mincing anything short of other elite squads.

 

Point is I still think the idea is very workable but will need these little tweaks.

Oh that was just a quick and dirty sample, would just cut the points wherever. Just toying with different ideas based on the same concept: a very maneuverable army that can't easily be bogged down. If you want dozer blades sure cut two pw in the vets and add them to all.

[Baluc]

What's the fixation with the Special characters?

 

- Just choose outflank with your vets

 

- chuck a Centurion in one of the vet units

 

- what is the command squad for? 

 

What is so convincing about Pale Hunter? That you can't just do without the RoW and take some Drop pods? You understand if you hit and run 2d6 at the end of your turn, the opposition player gets to shoot you in their turn. And, if you do it their turn you have just spend another round in combat without any of your legion rules. 

 

This is more of a general statement. SW players need to get off of this assault focus. The win mechanics of the majority of the missions is objectives/board control, the rest are kill points variants (combat being the worst way to get kill points). 

 

How does Pale Hunter help you secure objectives in a way that drop pods, or having your full compliment of Heavy support choices does not? If its the +1 to reserves a Brother Domacles the command tank does double duty as an HQ and assisting your outflanking vets. Hit and Run? I think I've covered that one.

 

The +1 attack is very tempting especially as I do quite like having multiple units and the movement phase, which the +1 attack directly rewards. 

 

The only way I forsee Pale Hunter working is Russ with like 40+ veterans, which you clearly do not have ready. I think your enjoyment and the rewards of painting your models would probably be better served with a Bloodied Claw styled list.

[defl0]

You've litterally mentioned rules above that don't stack...

If you run hvarl in Pale Hunters you aren't benefiting form the hit and run from what is likely a mini combat deathstar or even a big one.

The prefered enemy bubble is a Warlord trait so if you take Russ you lose it.

Rad grenades the same ones available to all legions as in only forge lords. Your only other option is Deathsworn a unit that can't be made a deathstar at all since characters can't join and has no invulnerable save.

Everyone else also had outflank with marksmen Veterans possibly the most common unit in the game. Veterans are litterally the gold standard for Troops because they can actually do something with their points vs all targets (this includes mechanicum and custodes who Grey Slayers do very poorly against)

Also in terms of hit and run allowing you to leave in your turn great and you are going to shoot them with all that artillery you brought or those Medusas and vindicators the quad mortars?? In your 1 heavy support slot with a ban on all artillery type units.


The biggest issue is this.

We are playing in an edition of a game were shooting is by far the better means of killing things, it has more effective time more target options and harder to avoid. This right of War really tries to focus on close combat and reserves, reserves means we have less shooting on the board. So the big problem is we are essentially playing the wrong type of game. Armies that don't shoot and don't have board presence don't do very well. (Mechanicum, solar Auxilla, iron fire are very good for a reason)

 

 

 

 

What? 

 

Why doesn't Hvarl not stack with Pale Hunters? He get's your units their via scout or out flank (which stacks with other SW rules). He gives a prefered enemy force multiplier bubble with stacks with Grey Slayers. 

 

And yes you lose the Warlord trait if you take your primarch, but that's the same with every legion... Not to mention the scout 3 units is basically a a warlord trait that he get's even if you do take Russ. 

 

And yes, you can get rad grenades through a Forge Lord in every legion, but that is very inefficient compared to taking a great unit that already has them. Honestly, I'm not sure why you wouldn't take Deathsworn, they are kind of a lynchpin unit in the list. They literally are what makes The Bloodied Claws ROW work. You shouldn't downplay this. Rad grenades are a hard to fit into most legions and are really good, especially when coupled with power axes and +1S on the charge. It's a strong combo that hardly exists anywhere else in the game outside of maybe Raven Guard and a couple other fringe cases. Oblitting multi wound T4 termies is a big part of the 30K game.

 

BTW - You know that vets are scoring and can still be taken as Elites, right? They are great for supporting your other outflanking units, especially at higher levels. It's an important distinction. A lot of people take vets as troops and lose game because of the 2 VP caveat of POTL... Personally, I think POTL is a liability for most legions until you start getting into higher point ranges, at which point you will can afford vets in your elites. Even Russ unlocking them means you will only be using these guys at high levels too. And again... Wolves don't do shooting vets better than other legions. They do hth vets well, but 10 grey slayers with PWs are going to be overkill as it is a lot of the time. 

 

As for 1 heavy and not artillery. YES. You lose some good units like rapiers and multiple units of heavies. But I play RG with Decap Strike all the time with a 1 heavy limit. There are a lot of ways to get tons of shooting, even with those restrictions. Lightnings and speeders are 2 of the best anti spartan units in the game. Typhons are amazing at infantry clearing. 3 Predators can produce a ton of daka. 3 laser vidis in very good at tank hunting. Anvillus Drop pods are totally allowed in the Bloodied Claw ROW, so you have deepstriking contemptors with 2 hth weapons and grav guns. 

 

At the end of the day though, you are playing space wolves... How much were you really going to spend on HVY support? Yeah, higher point games I see your point, but anywhere under 3k you will have tons of firepower options. 

 

As for your final point: 

 

I do agree, that much of the game is firepower centric. But the super shoot lists are MOST susceptible to hth. But most legion simply can't get across the board into hth fast enough, that's really why the game is so shooty centric. Legions are often required to rely on transports to get across the board and these transports often get blown up in your deployment zone from shooting alpha strike.

 

But Wolves have scout on 3 units. Land raiders starting in the middle of the board are a problem for a lot of shooty lists. And outflank is a viable option if you can make it reliable, which you can. Plus, there are other ways to get scout. You can easily have an all scouting wolf army. 

 

If HTH is not your play style, Wolves might not be your legion. But you are way off the mark if you think HTH is a useless tactic and can't work in 30k... 

[Jackalwolf]

Hit and run only in opponents phase of course. It just brilliantly recreates the maneuverability of the night of the Wolf. Post your opposing 2.5k list here. Command squad is to confer hit and run to Russ plus more ablative wounds and challenge shenanigans. Edited March 7, 2017 by Grieux

[Runefyre]

Deathsworn donr get furious charge in bloodied claw, so they have no way to ID T4 without taking a power fist.

[Baluc]

Hit and run only in opponents phase of course. It just brilliantly recreates the maneuverability of the night of the Wolf. Post your opposing 2.5k list here. Command squad is to confer hit and run to Russ plus more ablative wounds and challenge shenanigans.

 

I posted this list in the Custodes thread.

 

Shield Captain

Tribune

w/Paragon Spear, Arae-shrikes, Cyber Familiar, Digital Lasers, Praesidium Shield

 

Hetaeron Guard Squad

3x HG w/ Praesidum Shield, Paragon Blade

1x HG w/ Praesidium Shield,  Power Gauntlet

Arae-Shrikes

 

2x Guard Squad

w/ Arae-Shrikes, 2x Adrasite, 1x Pyrithite

 

Sentinel Squad

w/ Arae Shrikes, Teleport Tansponders, 2x Power Gauntlet

 

2x Agamatus Jetbike Sqd

w/ 3x TL Corve Las-pulser

 

Caladius Grav-Tank

w/ Arachnus Heave Blaze Cannon

 

LoW:

 

Sub-Orbital Wing

Primaris Lightning

Gw/ Ground Tracking Auguries, Battle Servitor, 2x Kraken Penetrators 

 

Still has room to play.

 

Here is an AB list.

 

 

Praetor (warlord)

Jetbike, Combat Gear

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Veteran Squad

10 Vets

w/ Vox, 2x plasmagun

Rhino

 

Veteran Squad

10 Vets

w/ Vox, 2x plasmagun

Rhino

 

Sicaran battle tank

w/ Lascannon Sponsons

 

Jav

w/ CML, 2x Hunter Killers

 

Jav

w/ CML, 2x Hunter Killers

 

Sky Hunter Sqd

5x sky hunters

 

Medusa

 

Vindicator Sqd

2x Vindicator

 

Scorpius

 

Typhon

 

 

Literally just wrote it right now.

 

 

[defl0]

What's the fixation with the Special characters?

 

- Just choose outflank with your vets

 

- chuck a Centurion in one of the vet units

 

- what is the command squad for? 

 

What is so convincing about Pale Hunter? That you can't just do without the RoW and take some Drop pods? You understand if you hit and run 2d6 at the end of your turn, the opposition player gets to shoot you in their turn. And, if you do it their turn you have just spend another round in combat without any of your legion rules. 

 

This is more of a general statement. SW players need to get off of this assault focus. The win mechanics of the majority of the missions is objectives/board control, the rest are kill points variants (combat being the worst way to get kill points). 

 

How does Pale Hunter help you secure objectives in a way that drop pods, or having your full compliment of Heavy support choices does not? If its the +1 to reserves a Brother Domacles the command tank does double duty as an HQ and assisting your outflanking vets. Hit and Run? I think I've covered that one.

 

The +1 attack is very tempting especially as I do quite like having multiple units and the movement phase, which the +1 attack directly rewards. 

 

The only way I forsee Pale Hunter working is Russ with like 40+ veterans, which you clearly do not have ready. I think your enjoyment and the rewards of painting your models would probably be better served with a Bloodied Claw styled list.

 

Well Hvarl Red Blade gives a lot of force multipliers. At smaller games (under 2K) good lists vs bad lists tend to be based on how much you can get out of your compulsory point expenditure. So he really helps get grey slayers across the board and even gives them a boost in hth.

 

I think pale hunter is really your outflank army. I can't say this enough, but Hit & Run is the strongest rule in the game. In general, you jump out of hth at the end of you their turn, shoot them and charge back in on your turn. Yes that means you have to grind for a turn, but you also keep them from shooting and moving. But this is why you take priests on bikes.... They are fearless. They can outflank with the unit. They can charge ahead to give you the +1 attack or stay attached to unit to keep the unit fearless. Fearless blobs that out flank are very useful, and it's nice that your can get across teh board and can kill stuff. 

 

So how does Pale Hunter help you hold objectives and win the KP games better than having 3 heavies and pods? Well, for one heavies generally don't score or hold objectives and pods give up KPs. 

 

Pods really aren't that different than outflanking with grey slayers. Neither can assault the turn they come in and sure pods can start in the middle of the board, but grey slayers move in and then run. And then can move run and charge. So that's 6+ D6 + 6 + d6 +2d6 or 26". That's more than half way onto the board on average. 

 

Also, why would you be focussing on running vets with Pale Hunter. You get MUCH more from +1 attack on a unit of 20 models than one of 10. Gray Slayers are totally the better core for this ROW. 

Deathsworn donr get furious charge in bloodied claw, so they have no way to ID T4 without taking a power fist.

 

My bad. I was thinking grey slayers or assault squads with power axes multi charging with deathsworn. 

[Baluc]

@Defl0 Priests can't take bikes

[Runefyre]

 

What's the fixation with the Special characters?

 

- Just choose outflank with your vets

 

- chuck a Centurion in one of the vet units

 

- what is the command squad for? 

 

What is so convincing about Pale Hunter? That you can't just do without the RoW and take some Drop pods? You understand if you hit and run 2d6 at the end of your turn, the opposition player gets to shoot you in their turn. And, if you do it their turn you have just spend another round in combat without any of your legion rules. 

 

This is more of a general statement. SW players need to get off of this assault focus. The win mechanics of the majority of the missions is objectives/board control, the rest are kill points variants (combat being the worst way to get kill points). 

 

How does Pale Hunter help you secure objectives in a way that drop pods, or having your full compliment of Heavy support choices does not? If its the +1 to reserves a Brother Domacles the command tank does double duty as an HQ and assisting your outflanking vets. Hit and Run? I think I've covered that one.

 

The +1 attack is very tempting especially as I do quite like having multiple units and the movement phase, which the +1 attack directly rewards. 

 

The only way I forsee Pale Hunter working is Russ with like 40+ veterans, which you clearly do not have ready. I think your enjoyment and the rewards of painting your models would probably be better served with a Bloodied Claw styled list.

 

Well Hvarl Red Blade gives a lot of force multipliers. At smaller games (under 2K) good lists vs bad lists tend to be based on how much you can get out of your compulsory point expenditure. So he really helps get grey slayers across the board and even gives them a boost in hth.

 

I think pale hunter is really your outflank army. I can't say this enough, but Hit & Run is the strongest rule in the game. In general, you jump out of hth at the end of you their turn, shoot them and charge back in on your turn. Yes that means you have to grind for a turn, but you also keep them from shooting and moving. But this is why you take priests on bikes.... They are fearless. They can outflank with the unit. They can charge ahead to give you the +1 attack or stay attached to unit to keep the unit fearless. Fearless blobs that out flank are very useful, and it's nice that your can get across teh board and can kill stuff. 

 

So how does Pale Hunter help you hold objectives and win the KP games better than having 3 heavies and pods? Well, for one heavies generally don't score or hold objectives and pods give up KPs. 

 

Pods really aren't that different than outflanking with grey slayers. Neither can assault the turn they come in and sure pods can start in the middle of the board, but grey slayers move in and then run. And then can move run and charge. So that's 6+ D6 + 6 + d6 +2d6 or 26". That's more than half way onto the board on average. 

 

Also, why would you be focussing on running vets with Pale Hunter. You get MUCH more from +1 attack on a unit of 20 models than one of 10. Gray Slayers are totally the better core for this ROW. 

Deathsworn donr get furious charge in bloodied claw, so they have no way to ID T4 without taking a power fist.

 

My bad. I was thinking grey slayers or assault squads with power axes multi charging with deathsworn. 

 

I'm honestly not sure how you would fit assault squads in a bloodied claw list, as we're locked into taking Grey Slayers and I'm not wont to spend more on troops....

 

Otherwise that is a valid tactic, could be situationally useful for taking down elite terminators, or even custodes if you take power fists....

Edited March 7, 2017 by Runefyre

[Purge the Daemon]

Except 20 Grey Slayers take up a lot more room and a hell of a lot more points than 10 Veterans...

 

And hit and run again is really good on units that are deathstars. You don't see people begging for hit and run tac squads because it's nigh on useless.

 

It's really good on units that just one to bounce around anihlating things (thunder wolf cavalry, black knights are the key examples in 40k) we don't have units that fast or that hit as hard every time or are as resilient.

[Runefyre]

Except 20 Grey Slayers take up a lot more room and a hell of a lot more points than 10 Veterans...

 

And hit and run again is really good on units that are deathstars. You don't see people begging for hit and run tac squads because it's nigh on useless.

 

It's really good on units that just one to bounce around anihlating things (thunder wolf cavalry, black knights are the key examples in 40k) we don't have units that fast or that hit as hard every time or are as resilient.

Terminators can come close though they're alot slower, but obviously we're barred from H&Ring with them.....

[Purge the Daemon]

 

 

Except 20 Grey Slayers take up a lot more room and a hell of a lot more points than 10 Veterans...

 

And hit and run again is really good on units that are deathstars. You don't see people begging for hit and run tac squads because it's nigh on useless.

 

It's really good on units that just one to bounce around anihlating things (thunder wolf cavalry, black knights are the key examples in 40k) we don't have units that fast or that hit as hard every time or are as resilient.

Terminators can come close though they're alot slower, but obviously we're barred from H&Ring with them.....

Which is essentially my whole argument. Would be great except they saw the rule was powerful so took it off units it is actually good on so it's kind of just mediocre at best.

[Jackalwolf]

 

Hit and run only in opponents phase of course. It just brilliantly recreates the maneuverability of the night of the Wolf. Post your opposing 2.5k list here. Command squad is to confer hit and run to Russ plus more ablative wounds and challenge shenanigans.

 

Here is an AB list.

 

 

 

Praetor (warlord)

Jetbike, Combat Gear

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Predator Sqd

1x Pred

w/ Lascannon sponsons

 

Veteran Squad

10 Vets

w/ Vox, 2x plasmagun

Rhino

 

Veteran Squad

10 Vets

w/ Vox, 2x plasmagun

Rhino

 

Sicaran battle tank

w/ Lascannon Sponsons

 

Jav

w/ CML, 2x Hunter Killers

 

Jav

w/ CML, 2x Hunter Killers

 

Sky Hunter Sqd

5x sky hunters

 

Medusa

 

Vindicator Sqd

2x Vindicator

 

Scorpius

 

Typhon

 

 

 

Literally just wrote it right now.

Can't comment on the custodes for lack of knowledge but in the ab for instance, and going of the latest list I wrote, on turn one I'd try to take out the sicaran with the quad Spartan lasers x2, outflank the vets in rhinos to multi melta the scorpius, deploy vets and, exchanging the pw for combi melta disembark them and try to take down some predator.

 

Turn two crash against the jetbikes and assault with Russ and his unit, assault the predators with the Varagyr, dedicate the Spartans to focus on the vindicators, bring in the lightning and throw 4 kraken missiles and lascannons against the typhon, run the rhinos against the typhon too and assault your vets with my vets with centurions.

 

Of course it will depend greatly on who has first turn and if you manage to take down one Spartan in your turn one (I'd sacrifice two vets to add Flare Shields if I was facing your list!)

 

Point is I think my list would have a chance and that's all I want from a game.

Edited March 7, 2017 by Grieux

[sturguard]

Okay so what about this foundation- Bloodied Claw- why, because you need to charge in this list and it has to be turn 2 being able to reroll charges 2 times a game (From Russ and the formation is important)

 

Russ

Wolfkin

Praetor however you want to kit him with 2 wolves (I would make sure he can blow up vehicles)

Geigor

5 Legion Termies

Karybdis

 

This is around 1200-1250 pts. However the idea is to come down weather as much fire, then split apart. The Praetor goes off with his wolves if they are left, Russ goes off, the Wolfkin go off, and Geigor goes off. I fully expect the terminators to all be dead and Russ to have a few wounds on him.

 

Why Geigor- he isnt great but he can move, run and charge. Russ can also move run and charge as well I believe. So how best to support this?

 

First I think at least 2 squads of Vets that are outflanking- why? So any of the HQs can join a unit if they are in trouble- maybe you use 3 units of vets.

 

I think that Javelins are good too of course I am partial to it so I would include a Lightning.

 

Now the other thing I was thinking was a contemptor cortus talon just to put pressure on the enemy. Maybe  with dual kheres each, thats 36 shots that cant be ignored for too long. 

 

In any event you have to have supporting firepower, maybe whirlwinds? What do folks think? Baluc you think this could work? 2500 pts?

[Jackalwolf]

Okay so what about this foundation- Bloodied Claw- why, because you need to charge in this list and it has to be turn 2 being able to reroll charges 2 times a game (From Russ and the formation is important)

 

Russ

Wolfkin

Praetor however you want to kit him with 2 wolves (I would make sure he can blow up vehicles)

Geigor

5 Legion Termies

Karybdis

 

This is around 1200-1250 pts. However the idea is to come down weather as much fire, then split apart. The Praetor goes off with his wolves if they are left, Russ goes off, the Wolfkin go off, and Geigor goes off. I fully expect the terminators to all be dead and Russ to have a few wounds on him.

 

Why Geigor- he isnt great but he can move, run and charge. Russ can also move run and charge as well I believe. So how best to support this?

 

First I think at least 2 squads of Vets that are outflanking- why? So any of the HQs can join a unit if they are in trouble- maybe you use 3 units of vets.

 

I think that Javelins are good too of course I am partial to it so I would include a Lightning.

 

Now the other thing I was thinking was a contemptor cortus talon just to put pressure on the enemy. Maybe  with dual kheres each, thats 36 shots that cant be ignored for too long. 

 

In any event you have to have supporting firepower, maybe whirlwinds? What do folks think? Baluc you think this could work? 2500 pts?

 

That´d make a great foundation for an in your face force indeed.

[Baluc]

You are starting to drift to my list. Obviously I don't field Russ, so that frees me of the Spartan/KAC burden.

 

Praetor
w/ Jetbike, Aether Rune Armour, Frost Claw, Powerfist, Iron Halo
Master of the Legion: The Bloodied Claws

Priest of Fenris

Caster of Runes

w/ Mastery Level 2, and Force axe

Legion Centurion
Praevian Consul
w/ Artificer Armour, Great Frost Blade, Volkite Charger
4 Vorax Class Battle-Automata
w/ Frag Grenades

10 Grey Slayers
w/ Huscarl, Great Frost Blade
Rhino

10 Grey Slayers
w/ Huscarl, Great Frost Blade
Rhino

Legion support Squad
10x Marines
w/ Volkite Cavliver

Javelin Squadron
2x Javelin attack Speeders
w/ 2 Hks, and CML

Land Speeder Squadron
2x Land speeders
w/ Multi-Melta, and Graviton Gun

Land Speeder Squadron
2x Land speeders
w/ Multi-Melta, and Graviton Gun

Sicaran Battle Tank
w/ Lascannon Sponsons, and Dozer Blade

Sicaran Venator

LoW: Typhon Heavy Siege Tank

 

Basically the majority of the list is built around the concept of taking away the opposition's speed, and then attacking them with the correct close combat unit for the task. Most units have anti-vehicle utility and anything that doesn't can be kept off the board. 

 

Howl of the Death Wolf is a strong ability, and you can wall your units off from forced charges by deploying behind your rhino.

[sturguard]

So instead of a Praetor do I take Hvarl so I can get 3 Grey Slayer Squads in rhinos and scout them up towards the Kharybdis drop? Give the rhinos multimeltas so they have a chance to pop tanks and the GS squads are a bit cheaper than the Vets plus I take advantage of the Bloodied Claw rules a bit more.

 

Support with 2 Javelins (I have them)

 

So

Russ

Hvarl

Wolfkin

Geigor

5 Legion Terminators

Kharybdis

 

3x10 Grey Slayers- 2 pfist, AA, GFB, Rhino MM

2xJavelins MM and CML

Lightning with dual Kraken Bombs

 

What else?

[Purge the Daemon]

Okay so what about this foundation- Bloodied Claw- why, because you need to charge in this list and it has to be turn 2 being able to reroll charges 2 times a game (From Russ and the formation is important)

 

Russ

Wolfkin

Praetor however you want to kit him with 2 wolves (I would make sure he can blow up vehicles)

Geigor

5 Legion Termies

Karybdis

 

This is around 1200-1250 pts. However the idea is to come down weather as much fire, then split apart. The Praetor goes off with his wolves if they are left, Russ goes off, the Wolfkin go off, and Geigor goes off. I fully expect the terminators to all be dead and Russ to have a few wounds on him.

 

Why Geigor- he isnt great but he can move, run and charge. Russ can also move run and charge as well I believe. So how best to support this?

 

First I think at least 2 squads of Vets that are outflanking- why? So any of the HQs can join a unit if they are in trouble- maybe you use 3 units of vets.

 

I think that Javelins are good too of course I am partial to it so I would include a Lightning.

 

Now the other thing I was thinking was a contemptor cortus talon just to put pressure on the enemy. Maybe with dual kheres each, thats 36 shots that cant be ignored for too long.

 

In any event you have to have supporting firepower, maybe whirlwinds? What do folks think? Baluc you think this could work? 2500 pts?

To my knowledge Russ can run and charge as he doesn't have warrior's mettle.

 

I'm not sure I rate shooty cortus the extra bs of a normal Contemptor is really good especially when you won't be using cortus special rules.

 

I think Javelins are very strong if you have to her armour to saturate them otherwise they get picked off but even then they are cheap.

 

Marksmen vets are always good can't deny that.

 

I just feel like you are losing out on a lot of options for 1 extra howl of the death wolf. Sure it's good but is it that game changing that it's better then being able tk take quad mortars as fire support or dreadnought drop pods I'm not sure.