Angelus Speculation

[stuka06]

 

 

Perhaps the original bodyguard will disband after Terra, going along with the prevailing theme of agonising guilt.

Well no, all bar Azkellon died aboard the Vengeful Spirit. Azkellon was forced to stay behind to guide the chapter, and may have re-moulded the new SG in his image.

I have to admit, I was unaware of that.

 

TBH, I'm way behind on reading HH, so my speculation ist based solely on ... something....

Maybe, we see Azkellon as a named character for BA, with a look and feel to his miniature and statline that reflects a blue print of what the SG will be 10k years later.

 

 

On the Lion:

I hope that he will be be an above average fighter, but gives the player the tools to mould his army in a way that makes you able to specialize your forces to attack specific problems. The feud with Russ came from Johnsons meticulous planing and moulding his attack plan to the specific fortress he was attacking. That is something, I'd like to see reflected in his rule set.

[Jarkaira]

Lion should be able to hand out USR from small list to X amount of his units and I'll hope they either got a consul who can do same but for a single unit or either that their praetor get's same kind of rule. He could also be more of a MC slayer with his wounds becoming double on 4+ roll or something like that when he uses his weapon as unwieldy.

[m_r_parker]

 

Extermination with 4 Legions was taken in the 6 months, including printing and delivery from China.

FW already have full Daemons codex, Mechanicum army list and basic rules for DA and BA. All they have to do is write background story (we know Alan worked on DA for years), advanced Legion rules and draw artwork. I see no reason in such delay. A bit dissapointed in new FW release policy.

 

 

I'm just posting my personal opinion, given what the releases for the Black Books have been for the past couple of years and what the ForgeWorld team have now been asked to take up by GW. They were very clear during the seminars at the Weekender that they're not very far down the line of getting this book done, and from the lack of talk about the various campaigns that the narrative is based on I'd say that they're probably finalised the structure of the book and are looking at filling the pages. 

 

Let's not also forget that FW have been given control over the Specialist Games area, and such are now responsible for content on Blood Bowl, Adeptus Titanicus, The Hobbit, and still also have duties in providing content for the other GW main systems (and there are lots of people waiting on the next IA book, which from what we've been told has been a direct result of focussing resources to getting Inferno completed). Plus they also have to fit in with regular GW events / releases as well - we were supposed to see a full Magnus model at the Weekender, but because there was a early preview of the plastic Guillman they were requested not to do a full reveal, and not have 2 Primarchs revealed within the same week (so now he's going to be on show at Warhammer Fest).

 

As much as I would love them to, they can't just focus on the Heresy series. I would love to see two Black Books per year with weekly Heresy models, but that's not on the cards from what we've seen so far. We've just had the most controversial release in the entirety of the Heresy series, possible in FW's entire time, with the Inferno book that has faced multiple issues and delays (Inferno was originally raised as book 4 after Istvaan) - and the last thing I want to see is more people get frustrated over release timeframes because expectations haven't been set correctly. Next Weekender seems like a fair bet given the past couple of book releases, and the feedback we've been given so far, and there's nothing wrong with hoping that it gets out sooner. But I've seen it happen too many times; hope becomes rumour, rumour becomes fact, fact becomes disappointment - literally there were discussions a couple of years ago that there was going to be a second Prospero book that would cover the White Scars, which was never mentioned by anyone from FW and was just somebody looking for a way to get that Legion into the series, suddenly people start talking about it like it's actually part of the schedule. 

 

Let's just wait and see how things develop during the year, and see what feedback we get from events like the Open Day and Warhammer Fest.

[b1soul]

Betrayal - Oct. 2012

Massacre - Oct. 2013

Extermination - May 2014

Conquest - Nov. 2014

Tempest - May 2015

Retribution - Feb. 2016

Inferno - Feb. 2017

Angelus - ???

 

I guess we'll see...

 

As for the rumour about Inferno II or Inferno: Aftermath (potentially covering WS, DG, SW, AL, and DA)...it was more wish-listing by me and others. I don't think anyone seriously believed FW had added it to the official schedule

[Ficinus]

Since the other wings probably won't get new rites in the next book, it would be cool if the new units for the Dark Angels fit into the themes of the wings lacking unique rites. So, like, a beefed up Destroyer squad for the Dreadwing, a unique terminator unit for Deathwing, and maybe a breeched/assault squad for the Stormwing. That way DA players could begin to play/simulate all six (or five of the six, who knows what the Firewing is) of the wings without the insanity of six rites of war in the first book.

[Brother-Captain Gilead]

Now here's a wild thought: what if the DA would actually end up getting no special units? With Dark Angels being the First they would work like the Ultramarines in 40K used to be in the 3rd edition: they would be disgustingly vanilla with only the characters to add on top of the codex army list. This would translate to Horus Heresy as Dark Angels possessing no unique troops on top of the crusade army list, but they would still be different by having their special characters as well as the mementos of the Old Night and then the six rites. I feel this would illustrate how an individual Dark Angels army would shift their focus on an engagement by engagement basis rather than working on the principle of "If you are Perturabo, all problems can be solved through siegecraft".

 

The more I think on this the more I think this could be a flavorful way to drive home the fact that unlike in 40K, in 30K Dark Angels had to have been the kings of flexibility by the virtue of them having to hold down the fort and handle most of the work in the early years of the Great Crusade while the rest of the legions ramped up their number (they couldn't call in the Iron Warriors when they needed help with a siege -> Stormwing, they couldn't request Iron Hands support when there was an armored engagement -> Ironwing and they couldn't trust on White Scars to handle the scouting for them -> Ravenwing etc.).

Edited February 23, 2017 by Brother-Captain Gilead

[Corswain]

I see what you're saying but FW and BL have already said that the "standard" Legion Astartes structure was established after the DA structure was. And I'd feel a bit ripped off if we've waited all this time for no real reason.

[Brother-Captain Gilead]

Oh, I won't complain if we get proto-black knights and proto-deathwing, I was just thinking aloud of other potential ways to go with DA. I personally would like for our legion rules / RoW / wargear / unique units to mostly reflect our unique position as the First more than anything else (and I would also love to get RoWs for each of our wings, but then we would have more RoWs than any other legion and I don't know if that is a reasonable wish).

[Ficinus]

I think it's reasonable to expect rites for all six wings, but not in Angelus. By the time they finish the entire series, though, I would expect it.

[Robzilla]

Random thought here not entirely related to angellus...

So GW seem to be pushing for tie ins wherever possible (case, inferno and burning of prospero)

 

What are the odds that they will tie in the next boxed set (that we are All hoping for) to angelus?

 

If so, my money is on for Dark Angels and Night Lords?

 

'Raising of Thramas' anyone?

 

Anyways, on topic. Can't wait to see the new rules for the primarchs. Hoping the dark angels get a few cool rules to fix there legion, and maybe get a couple more rites of war to reflect the various wings. (come on choom-heavy army of ancient tech!)

 

Really itching for the atremenar, and hope foreword give them some attention.

 

Wouldn't even mind so much if they didn't get any models, just an upgrade pack would do nicely!

[b1soul]

I'd feel a bit ripped off if we've waited all this time for no real reason.

To put it mildly

[Charlo]

DA will get a fair chunk of stuff.

 

It's not just about the 6 wings, but the differences in Calibanite and Terran ways of war. The Grav Land Raider and Void Shell Vindicators have been mentioned by Bligh already.

 

...There is also the funny speculation that the Ravenwing Rite only allows flyer Lords of War or Lion El'Johnson... But he himself would invalidate the rules unless he has a Jetbike option or some other special rule.

 

I think we'll see some Terminators with absolutely disgusting weaponry (in the best way, think every dude has a plasma repeater) and then some robed veteran dudes and one or two left-fielders.

[Farseer Anath'lan]

DA will get a fair chunk of stuff.

 

It's not just about the 6 wings, but the differences in Calibanite and Terran ways of war. The Grav Land Raider and Void Shell Vindicators have been mentioned by Bligh already.

 

...There is also the funny speculation that the Ravenwing Rite only allows flyer Lords of War or Lion El'Johnson... But he himself would invalidate the rules unless he has a Jetbike option or some other special rule.

 

I think we'll see some Terminators with absolutely disgusting weaponry (in the best way, think every dude has a plasma repeater) and then some robed veteran dudes and one or two left-fielders.

 

You could put him in a flyer/dreadclaw/etc, and he'd satisfy the 'all infantry in flyers' condition.

Edited February 25, 2017 by Farseer Anath'lan

[rendingon1+]

...There is also the funny speculation that the Ravenwing Rite only allows flyer Lords of War or Lion El'Johnson... But he himself would invalidate the rules unless he has a Jetbike option or some other special rule.

 

 

 

1d4chan inspired speculation to be precise. Which means it should not be even considered.

You could put him in a flyer/dreadclaw/etc, and he'd satisfy the 'all infantry in flyers' condition.

 

Exactly. People often choose most... outlandish explenations/predictions for simplest of things.

[Charlo]

 

...There is also the funny speculation that the Ravenwing Rite only allows flyer Lords of War or Lion El'Johnson... But he himself would invalidate the rules unless he has a Jetbike option or some other special rule.

 

 

 

1d4chan inspired speculation to be precise. Which means it should not be even considered. 

 

I disagree... It's a fair point to be made. 1D4Chan is a great (if a little silly) resource and really helped me get back into the hobby. End of the day its just views written by people like you and me - a dude on the internet. No need to get high and mighty about it.

[Ashur]

Do we have a release date for Angelus? 

Edited September 30, 2017 by Ashur

[Slips]

We'll know more at the next event FW is present at hopefully; otherwise "Sometime in the future maybe early next year"

[1ncarnadine]

Early next next year, (2019) or maybe as soon as late next year. No way it's early next year, and they've said as much. Weekender 2018 release is speculatively Adeptus Titanicus atm.

[ShadowCore67]

 

 

 

...There is also the funny speculation that the Ravenwing Rite only allows flyer Lords of War or Lion El'Johnson... But he himself would invalidate the rules unless he has a Jetbike option or some other special rule.

 

 

1d4chan inspired speculation to be precise. Which means it should not be even considered.

You could put him in a flyer/dreadclaw/etc, and he'd satisfy the 'all infantry in flyers' condition.

 

Exactly. People often choose most... outlandish explenations/predictions for simplest of things.

It's actually a decent theory. Check your sources before you bash. The Ravenwing RoW clearly states that the LoW itself has to be of the flyer type. That is different then putting the Lion in an Anvillus, Caestus, etc.

 

Unless just an oversight from FW, its totally plausible.

Edited September 30, 2017 by ShadowCore67

[m_r_parker]

Do we have a release date for Angelus?

I wouldn’t be putting it down for anytime in the immediate future. The passing of Alan Bligh has put the writing section back considerably, and the sculpting team are looking to plug some of the gaps in the previous books in the mean time. Speaking to some of the designers at the Open Day they’re now looking at getting some models and units ready for release alongside the Black Book releases, rather than just have the book drop and people wait for models.

 

We might get more of an insight to timelines at the upcoming HH Weekender, but I’m not expecting anything for 12 months.

[Allart01]

Do we have a release date for Angelus? 

 

I remember hearing "Christmas 2018" at the last Open Day.

[m_r_parker]

 

I remember hearing "Christmas 2018" at the last Open Day.

 

 

And to be honest, with that timeframe, I wouldn't be surprised if they hold it back a couple of months for the 2019 HH Weekender in early February. Makes it a big release event with a new BB and models for the newly introduced Legions, with everything going on general release shortly afterwards.

 

But, this is all speculation at the moment. Best we don't fixate until something a bit more concrete comes to light.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I have high hopes for every Legion. I would like to see some new units and and an incorporation of new Primaris to flesh them all out. Inceptors just don’t cut true weight for me.

[Corswain]

I have high hopes for every Legion. I would like to see some new units and and an incorporation of new Primaris to flesh them all out. Inceptors just don’t cut true weight for me.

Really don't see them putting Primaris into 30K. And I really hope they don't.

[StruManChu]

Don't forget they've got the 7th Edition rulebook to adapt and release for 30k too, which will take precedence over any new Legion books. At the moment new players either have to rely on their friends old rulebooks or use the unofficial 8th edition Heresy rules, neither of which are ideal for FW.