Upcoming BL Stuff - 2023

[DarkChaplain]

5 hours ago, Ubiquitous1984 said:

I guess so - seems like it's fine to talk about it on reddit so I'll discuss it there.

 

That's what I did today. Even got reminded of the Bucephalus being the Emperor's ship, which links directly with some stuff we learn in the book and almost makes me a little sentimental about the Emperor. Too bad we can't talk about the books here right now. It's baffling, especially when books becoming available on the preorder weekend has been a thing for years now.

 

3 hours ago, Taliesin said:

 

The collection does not have Thorpe's Luther book and Guymer's Lion book, which is what I want to see reprinted. Its been a few years since they were OOP.

 

Luther is a HH characters novel and Lord of the First is a Primarchs novel, and neither has precedence for getting omnibus'd so far. I'd expect at least the characters novels to be collected at some point, but that's still far off at this rate =/

[Roomsky]

I assume the mods are skittish about "encouraging" piracy by allowing threads for a book that hasn't actually come out yet. I'm sure someone out there actually got a copy early in error, but most commentators are probably using the 4chan pdf. Purely optics I'd imagine.

 

Meanwhile, my local bookstore handed me my copy of Iron Kingdom a good 2 weeks before it should be readable. 

[DarkChaplain]

That's pretty much all it is: Some digital store breaking the street date.

I recall Barnes & Noble also doing this a lot when I was in the US a couple of years back; stuff I had on preorder for after my return would sit on the shelf weeks early (so I bought myself a copy of Legend of the Galactic Heroes #2 while I was still over there and was pretty much done by the time I returned.... and still had to pick my preorder up from the PO box).

 

But with brick & mortar, publishers have less direct control (they can retaliate, but often it'll be detrimental to pull their products from the chain, and if it's a small indie store, it'll either not become widely known or isn't worth bothering the legal department over), but digital? They could've cracked down on pre-sales for years and haven't, so I'd say it's fair game.

 

Then again, BL doesn't have a proper pre-release spoiler policy anyway; that'd go against their limited edition and event pre-release strategy.

 

Have you started on The Iron Kingdom yet, Roomsky? Definitely interested in reading your thoughts!

[Roomsky]

Regarding GW's lack of control over local book stores: my local shop does honour release dates when stipulated; my orders from Seven Seas often arrive early, only for the sales rep to inform me they can't actually sell it until the release date. This suggests to me that it's not a case of lack of oversight, BL simply doesn't bother with enforcing release dates.

 

I'm about 150 pages in to Iron Kingdom, very solid so far. It has Kyme's usual issues of weird similes and overuse of stock characters, but man the guy knows how to structure a book. The opening chapters are all really effective character introductions, and the balance of action scenes to world building and dialogue has been spot-on (contrast Wolftime which basically wastes the first 100 pages on action scenes that fail completely to establish the main characters.) So far it works well as a standalone, but it carries several threads forward from Gate of Bones in a way that won't feel undercooked even if you haven't read that book. If there's no thread for it by the time I'm finished, I'll create one with fuller thoughts.

 

 

[DarkChaplain]

7 minutes ago, Roomsky said:

my orders from Seven Seas often arrive early

 

We talkin' about Light Novel publisher Seven Seas? I'm still bugging them in every monthly licensing survey about continuing translating Lodoss. It's been nearly 5 years now, I think, but I ain't going to let them off easy :')

 

Sounds like TIK is going to be a banger, then. I also read that his old Marines Malevolent characters are included, which is neat. They were in the Sallies trilogy and iirc also had some shorts, though I'm not sure if those featured the same characters anymore. I definitely appreciate authors picking up their legacy characters where appropriate when we're talking Dawn of Fire / early Post-Rift. IF the shorts featured the same characters, they were active and alive during the Third War for Armageddon, and reasonably close to the big events to get swept up into the wider war.

 

Funnily enough, I just checked Amazon and saw that The Iron Kingdom's ebook goes for 6,50€ - even on BL's own store!

Avenging Son and basically anything else released recently are still sitting at 11,99€, including other straight-to-paperback releases.

If this is a price error, I'd recommend acting swiftly, before they might fix it.

[Ubiquitous1984]

1 hour ago, Roomsky said:

 

 

I'm about 150 pages in to Iron Kingdom, very solid so far. It has Kyme's usual issues of weird similes and overuse of stock characters, but man the guy knows how to structure a book. The opening chapters are all really effective character introductions, and the balance of action scenes to world building and dialogue has been spot-on (contrast Wolftime which basically wastes the first 100 pages on action scenes that fail completely to establish the main characters.) So far it works well as a standalone, but it carries several threads forward from Gate of Bones in a way that won't feel undercooked even if you haven't read that book. If there's no thread for it by the time I'm finished, I'll create one with fuller thoughts.

 

 

Such a relief to hear this.  I think Kyme gets a bad rep, but sadly it’s rubbed off onto me whereby I now fear each of his stories will be terrible.  In reality I’ve enjoyed every book of his I’ve read.

 

[Sothalor]

For people in the US, ebooks purchased directly from the Black Library site have been priced at $13.99 for titles with equivalent large format & SoT hardback releases.

 

This marks a price decrease from its prior $16.99. The same is true for the Primarchs series; you can actually see the difference between Sanguinius and the other Primarch volumes.

 

It looks like the paperback-release ebook prices have not changed from the existing $9.99 price point.

 

I've no idea if this is to be the new standard going forward or if GW's infrastructure AI rebellion is causing shenanigans.

[Ubiquitous1984]

A guy on the BL Nutters facebook group has received a response from the secretary of the GW directors that he sent a complaint email to.

 

In a nutshell they acknowledge and apologise for what happened at the weekend, and say they are going to look into making sure it never happens again.  However (and as expected) there will be no more LE’s copies available for those who did miss out.  The same FB group ran a poll and at last reading, 120 people missed out on the LE in that one group alone.  80 managed to get copies.  

[Sothalor]

Yeah, maybe I'm cynical.

 

100% BULL:cuss: they're "looking into things" and making sure it "won't happen again." It's happened consistently for every one of the Siege of Terra releases. It happens consistently for all limited edition releases. :cuss:ing hell, it happens frequently for the new regular edition releases. They damn well know what's happening on a regular basis. 

 

They just don't care.

[Ubiquitous1984]

12 minutes ago, Sothalor said:

Yeah, maybe I'm cynical.

 

100% BULL:cuss: they're "looking into things" and making sure it "won't happen again." It's happened consistently for every one of the Siege of Terra releases. It happens consistently for all limited edition releases. :cuss:ing hell, it happens frequently for the new regular edition releases. They damn well know what's happening on a regular basis. 

 

They just don't care.

At this stage I think it would be fair for BL to do a ‘print on demand’ service for the SoT LE’s.  Have them unnumbered and unsigned, but allow people who have gaps in their collection to fill them at RRP instead of the crazy scalper prices. 

[Felix Antipodes]

3 hours ago, Ubiquitous1984 said:

At this stage I think it would be fair for BL to do a ‘print on demand’ service for the SoT LE’s.  Have them unnumbered and unsigned, but allow people who have gaps in their collection to fill them at RRP instead of the crazy scalper prices. 

I was just about to suggest the same thing.  Same format but without the numbering and authors signature.  Those who want the true LE version can still chance their luck against the script bots and the rest can settle for the POD copies.

If they did this I’m not sure there would be that many scalpers to battle against tbh and it would ensure “this never happens again” as GW claims is their aim.

[wecanhaveallthree]

6 hours ago, Ubiquitous1984 said:

Such a relief to hear this.  I think Kyme gets a bad rep, but sadly it’s rubbed off onto me whereby I now fear each of his stories will be terrible.  In reality I’ve enjoyed every book of his I’ve read.

 

 

Kyme's been solid-to-great since Old Earth back in '17. I know stink tends to stick, but he literally hasn't penned a single bad work for five, six years now. It's a little frustrating that he hasn't managed to shake off that cloud hanging over him, but then again, you build a hundred bridges and write one bad book, you're not a bridge builder, you're a... bad booker.

 

Whereas Abnett's been resting on Eisenhorn's laurels for more than a decade! He can't keep getting away with it! Ahhhh!

[Roomsky]

I mean, I agree Kyme's recent stuff is worthy of praise. That he went from basically unreadable guff like Deathfire to the excellent Vulpone Glory is probably the biggest leap quality-wise we've seen out of ANY BL author. But I'd hazard any of us who started reading after Eisenhorn was old hat judge Abnett pretty consistently on the work he continues to produce. The man's soldier dialogue, stylishly snappy prose, and ambition in plotting is still matched by a scant few in the stable. I think Saturnine and Anarch, 2 very recent novels, are among his best works.

 

And I get that's not enough for some - but unless he GOT's the Heresy's finale it's absolutely enough for me.

Edited February 23, 2023 by Roomsky
Clarity re: Vulpone Glory

[cheywood]

12 minutes ago, Roomsky said:

I mean, I agree Kyme's recent stuff is worthy of praise. That he went from basically unreadable to Vulpone Glory is probably the biggest leap quality-wise we've seen out of ANY BL author. But I'd hazard any of us who started reading after Eisenhorn was old hat judge Abnett pretty consistently on the work he continues to produce. The man's soldier dialogue, stylishly snappy prose, and ambition in plotting is still matched by a scant few in the stable. I think Saturnine and Anarch, 2 very recent novels, are among his best works.

 

And I get that's not enough for some - but unless he GOT's the Heresy's finale it's absolutely enough for me.

Kyme’s definitely gotten better, but he’s also published a grand total of 4 novels since 2017 by my count. 
 

edit: my mistake, it’s 5 novels. Like some of GW’s lore writers math was always my weakest subject.

Edited February 23, 2023 by cheywood

[wecanhaveallthree]

19 minutes ago, Roomsky said:

I mean, I agree Kyme's recent stuff is worthy of praise. That he went from basically unreadable to Vulpone Glory is probably the biggest leap quality-wise we've seen out of ANY BL author. But I'd hazard any of us who started reading after Eisenhorn was old hat judge Abnett pretty consistently on the work he continues to produce. The man's soldier dialogue, stylishly snappy prose, and ambition in plotting is still matched by a scant few in the stable. I think Saturnine and Anarch, 2 very recent novels, are among his best works.

 

And I get that's not enough for some - but unless he GOT's the Heresy's finale it's absolutely enough for me.

 

I think Abnett's technical and stylistic excellence mask some really, really bad ideas and decisions. I'm not sure if we're allowed to comment here about That Book That Hasn't Come Out Yet, but it was so patently pandering and obfuscating that I had to put it down more than once in sheer annoyance. Increasingly, I don't believe Abnett writes good Warhammer. He is his own thing, like Fehervari, but lacks Fehervari's respect and sensibility for the material.

 

Abnett gets away with it because he shucks and drives. He's all sleight-of-hand, and the charm has worn off for me.

 

Volpone Glory is a handsome and beautiful book and I will hear no more Kyme-related slander.

 

[Roomsky]

3 minutes ago, wecanhaveallthree said:

Volpone Glory is a handsome and beautiful book and I will hear no more Kyme-related slander.

 

 

Edited my post to make it clearer I think Vulpone Glory is good.

 

I see your point about some of Abnett's decision making - but to me he's like, I don't know, a good cheesecake. You can make many good and factual points about how it's bad for me; still tasted good. Was still good for my soul.

 

I fully expect book 8 to be like Echoes for me: good in all the ways I care about, with a big asterisk noting some things I don't care about will annoy people.

[wecanhaveallthree]

I get it. I've got guilty pleasures, too. I grew up on a steady diet of Anne McCaffrey and it took my parents several years to convince me that I was a) not a dragon b) not going to get a dragon and, as I aged, c) not enter into a risque telepathic romance with a dragon. Alas, even the greatest of us have failings.

 

ADB and Abnett just don't write the kind of Warhammer I want to read about, I suppose. They clearly sell like cheesecake, so more power to them, and I do feel appropriately snooty and crotchety when I tell people to stop having fun. 

 

 

[Nagashsnee]

Kyme has 2 major things going against him.

 

1) The hh salamander books are bad, like properly bad, worse then that they are a surprising amount of them.  And while i know some people enjoyed them the overall bad impression has stuck, why these books specifically? Because it wasnt just salamander players getting them, it was most HH fans.  Suddenly you have a large number of people with no specific ties to the chapter/legion reading the book on its own merits. Worse then that suddenly you are 30+ books in to this series and you get ANOTHER one of those kyme salamander books. Now i would argue a large part of the blame is how they did the HH as a numbered series and thus basically made people looking for the 'complete story' buy essentially filler.  Personally i have complained ALLOT of the HH kyme books because for me they were the wake up call that the HH series has reached the filler/milk the fans stage. They are the books that caused me to no longer automatically buy HH books on release ( well the doubly whammy of vulkan lives and unremembered empire).  This would be bad enough if not for...

 

2) The heavy heavy cloud of inner BL nepotism, that is to say, that he got to put out badly received book after book ( salamanders) for YEARS while also being a editor and reasonably high up the BL food chain. He then came crashing into the HH the theoretical flagship series that if the work wasnt up to par you got booted from. and from which untested authors were kept from, and then straight off into dawn of fire. Flagship projects with guaranteed sales...

 

So for me the fact that he got better is not worthy of praise, after YEARS of putting out poor quality cash grabs ( which for me only happened thanks to his internal company position and leverage)  he finally got enough paid practice to not be terrible? 'Slow sarcastic clap'. 

[theSpirea]

4 hours ago, wecanhaveallthree said:

 

Kyme's been solid-to-great since Old Earth back in '17. I know stink tends to stick, but he literally hasn't penned a single bad work for five, six years now. It's a little frustrating that he hasn't managed to shake off that cloud hanging over him, but then again, you build a hundred bridges and write one bad book, you're not a bridge builder, you're a... bad booker.

 

Whereas Abnett's been resting on Eisenhorn's laurels for more than a decade! He can't keep getting away with it! Ahhhh!

I haven't read Volpone Glory but the latest Kyme's book I've read is Sepulturum and so far it's the worst addition to the Horror imprint. I struggled to finish that. Especially overuse of "sh**" and "f***". He's the type of author that throws in it to make characters sound wanna-be cool/edgy/badass but it doesn't work like that, it reads like fan fiction.

 

Going through his full BL catalog, I don't think there's even a single book I would recommend to my friends. Maaaybe Knights of Macragge. Again, haven't read Volpone so maybe that might be the first and we'll see how The Iron Kingdom turns out.

[Bobss]

 

So the biggest 'problem' I have with TE&TDV1, and this isn't even a problem, just a necessary consequence of what people have decided to include in their finale-series, is that even though each of the 'mortal plots' i.e. the Oll, Sindermann, Keeler etc. groups are broadly interesting in their own right, when you add them all up they take a considerable amount of focus and outweigh all of the 'better' stuff. Once again, despite the moaning, I thought John French balanced Mersadie against not-Mersadie well

 

Err yeah so Black Legion 3 is coming this year, I guess

It could be called End of Empires for obvious reasons

It's set during the First Black Crusade

K-On! fights against Grey Knights and stuff in realspace

There's a group of possessed Black Legionaries who are a thing

One guy might have a demon spear that contains a demon born from Rome's burning

^ stalking ADB's Twitter from 2018 through to his soc-media break

Edited February 23, 2023 by Bobss

[DukeLeto69]

3 hours ago, theSpirea said:

I haven't read Volpone Glory but the latest Kyme's book I've read is Sepulturum and so far it's the worst addition to the Horror imprint. I struggled to finish that. Especially overuse of "sh**" and "f***". He's the type of author that throws in it to make characters sound wanna-be cool/edgy/badass but it doesn't work like that, it reads like fan fiction.

 

Going through his full BL catalog, I don't think there's even a single book I would recommend to my friends. Maaaybe Knights of Macragge. Again, haven't read Volpone so maybe that might be the first and we'll see how The Iron Kingdom turns out.

Folks and strokes but I really enjoyed Sepulturum, a lot! Volpone Glory is also very good. I did struggle with his HH entries. But for me his best work is the WH Crime novella he wrote in the first anthology. But hey, that’s me!

[skylerboodie]

5 hours ago, Nagashsnee said:

Kyme has 2 major things going against him.

 

1) The hh salamander books are bad, like properly bad, worse then that they are a surprising amount of them.  [...]

 

2) The heavy heavy cloud of inner BL nepotism [...]

 

I completely agree with your reasons Nagashnee; the Salamanders had three novels plus three novellas (comprising a fourth tHH volume), whereas the likes of Iron Hands in the Horus Heresy got shafted, with them abandoning the intended dedicated Iron Tenth novel as 'no time/space' for it.

 

Deathfire was the most unnecessary book I've ever read, a whole volume in the series just to move Vulkan from A to B with the most telegraphed 'revival' that I can't imagine any reader went into it without an accurate expectation of how the book would end. Plus I just find Nick's Salamander so vanilla and boring; okay, they have more 'humanity', but is that it? If they're going to be so one-dimensional, why do you need four books to display that. The Primarch himself isn't so bad, but the individual marines for me are so hard to distinguish even after so many words, I could barely remember the difference as to which Salamander was which, from scene to scene unless their dialogue was clearly identified, let alone book to book.

 

I've not read Nick's 40K Salamanders books but they apparently were good/popular (?) enough to warrant not one trilogy but a second one too (that was started at least, and he has in the past indicated he intends to continue the series). I feel the multiplicity of Nick's Salamanders books (in both settings) whilst other series are mercilessly cancelled may fall under the 'nepotism' category. Perhaps we will see the follow-up to Rebirth published once the Heresy is over (see, on topic !).

Edited February 23, 2023 by skylerboodie
clarification

[Sothalor]

I personally can't recommend Kyme's 40k Salamander series. To me, they were basically on the level of Vulkan Lives and Deathfire, to the extent I dropped it after the second novel and never got around to the third.

[Vazzy]

Has anyone’s LE copy of End and the Death shipped in the US yet? 

[chevalierdulys]

I've got The End and the Death (Not LE, that one is coming) and it has almost 700 pages and the next one concludes. It says on the last page. 

Btw, really enjoyed First Founding. Basically it's a 300 pages hardcover with plently of photos and explains each individual chapter. Each Chapter was written by an author (I believe four of them) and it gives information on history and special stuff. Pretty good as a coffee table kind of book. Probably they will release a chaos as well because it makes perfect sense. They only have to write the story/lore and with all images laying around (that's one thing I notice, I knew most of them from other novels and from GW website) it's easy 60€ for them.

Not a preorder but I would like your opinion, someone offered (well to me to pay) Khârn, Sistes of Battle box set, storm of iron & Triump of Saint Katharine for around 400€ Is this a good deal? Bear in mind that I will not resell so it's for my collection