EdT Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Sorry for the lack of update; having done Salathiel in a breeze and being rather happy with him, the Angels that accompany him are turning into hard work, for some reason. I'll get there in the end and if not then it'll just be a Moritat on his lonesome. In the meantime, inspired by KrautScientist I picked up some of the new Petrid Blightkings with a purpose in mind, and I''m busily de-nurglifying. Here's my workspace at the moment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokkorex Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Holy... Are really doing what i think you're doing? Are you Gonna make thunder warriors?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argent aquila Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Are you Gonna make thunder warriors?! that, would, be, INSANE! Unless, of course, it's something even better?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malika666 Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Hmm, it's pretty hard to outdo Thunder Warriors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Ohhh, this should be interesting! Holy...Are really doing what i think you're doing?Are you Gonna make thunder warriors?! Whatever the original plan might have been: I guess you'll have to build Thunder Warriors now, because that is just an awesome idea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Ha, it's a good job that it is Thunder Warriors, otherwise I'd be obliged to change my plans! Yeah, I felt that the Putrid Blightkings would potentially provide the techno-barbarian look quite well; they're broadly the same size as Astartes but look a hell of a lot less refined and considerably more brutal, which seemed to fit nicely with the background. I really liked the idea of them storming across the battlefield with obscenely large chain-weapons and crude proto-bolters, their backpacks belching out thick black smoke; I've also put together some background that I'm quite happy with that makes them very distinct from Astartes. With all that said, I've encountered a few practical issues. The first is that the Blightkings are bloody difficult to convert! They're lovely models with lots of detail, but de-nurglifying is a long and hard job; every time you think you're done you'll see a bloated diseased foot that you've missed and need to find a replacement for. A bit of decrepitude fits my background quite well- these are Heresy-era Thunder Warriors, not their young and vigorous selves from the Unification period- but it's quite tough sourcing appropriate bits while keeping the theme.I'm finding the arms a particular trial too- I'd like to have at least one guy holding a proto-bolter across his chest but that's proving rather tough, mostly because of their massive gut! I'll need to give that a bit more thought... The other issue is the head. It's really difficult to find heads that work with the blightking torsos, mainly because they're so bloated that most things I've tried look a little on the small side. I think the Thunder Warrior helmet is quite an iconic part of the design too, so that adds to the complication. While I have found some bare heads that look good and definitely fit the techno-barbarian theme, I haven't been able to come up with a hemleted version that works yet. The obvious solution of cut down Cadians don't quite seem to cut it, sadly; and my other ideas have been a tad lacking as well. Size is definitely the main issue here. I did wonder about these, but the Anvil Industries heads I've previously bought (while lovely) are too small for Marines, let alone such a bulky torso. Any ideas? I could make them all bare-headed and include an empty helmet on their belt, as I have for my proof of concept model, but it seems a shame to do that for the whole group... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well, it may be hard work, but I am definitely looking forward to the results! As I've found out while working with the Blightkings, some of the bodies will work better with a weapon held across the chest than others: The body with the bandaged left foot is one that works, btw, which is why I used it for my heavy bolter guy. As for the arms, I'd probably go for Terminator arms. Regarding the heads, did you try regular Cadian heads? if so, was it a size issue? Personally speaking, at least from the general look, the Cadian head with glasses from the heavy weapon team seems to work rather well: http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2013/7/24/520114-Adeptus%20Custodes%2C%20Conversion%2C%20Legio%20Custodes%2C%20Power%20Armour%2C%20Pre-heresy.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malika666 Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 What about these heads? http://maxmini.eu/conversion-bits/head-swaps/junkers-heads-bits http://maxmini.eu/conversion-bits/head-swaps/police-helmets-bits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well, it may be hard work, but I am definitely looking forward to the results! As I've found out while working with the Blightkings, some of the bodies will work better with a weapon held across the chest than others: The body with the bandaged left foot is one that works, btw, which is why I used it for my heavy bolter guy. As for the arms, I'd probably go for Terminator arms. Regarding the heads, did you try regular Cadian heads? if so, was it a size issue? Personally speaking, at least from the general look, the Cadian head with glasses from the heavy weapon team seems to work rather well: Thanks! I've got one already made but I'm not happy with his head (or more accurately, his neck), so I need to either keep squinting at it until I'm happy, or work out a way of improving things without damaging the rest of the model. Thanks re the advice re the best torso, I'd been pootling around with that one for a bit and managed to come up with something that looks ok; see below... As for the Cadian heads, I initially thought it was a size issue but perhaps it's actually a neck issue? I completely agree that in terms of look they'd be the best choice, and I have a couple of the heavy weapon ones on order, so we'll see... What about these heads? http://maxmini.eu/conversion-bits/head-swaps/junkers-heads-bits http://maxmini.eu/conversion-bits/head-swaps/police-helmets-bits I don't have the junkers but I did get some of the police ones a while back and had the same thought as you; sadly they're pretty tiny and only work with genuine (rather than 'heroic scale') 28mm models. They're perfect for weedy baseline humans to contrast with Astartes, but less so for anything bigger. Anyhow, enough talk, more progress... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Those first mockups are looking VERY promising! Love the pose of the right model, and the old skool Ork bolter is a brilliant touch! Personally speaking, I'd get rid of the dangling head trophy on the left model, both because it seems a bit too barbaric (even for a Thunder Warrior) and because that head would also make a splendid head for a cultist, renegade psyker or something of the like. As for the heads: I think you're spot on about the necks being the actual problem: Don't be afraid to cut them back quite a bit -- when in doubt, you can always "cushion" the head by adding a bit of GS. Anyway, great job so far! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 Thanks- I wondered about moving the clip to the front of the bolter (a la this classic) to add another nod to the originals, but that would leave nowhere for the other hand to grip, and tbh I'd also feel a bit guilty about chopping up such a venerable part. Plus I always think guns done that way look a little silly... That one's basically done now in any case, save for the head; when that's sorted I'll do a group photo with my test model, which has undergone some emergency neck surgery. Eventually I should have a little squad (or Vasht) of five... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 So I've tried and failed to finish painting my IX Destroyers, and they're properly irritating me now so I'm going to come back to them later. In the meantime, here's Salathiel and two of his squadmates; I'll add the other two later... 8- The Saphadic Choir of Salathiel“On Kobol, my father wept as he slaughtered the foe; my hearts bleed as we char them to radioactive ash. We bear this curse in order to spare our brothers from the same burden; dishonour and anguish is rightful price of failure, and have I not failed utterly in my duties? At the Ice Palace of Kerostasia, my negligence caused my father’s precious blood to be shed. I cannot accept his forgiveness; the shame is mine, and I lament my fate as I lament the fate of those we destroy.”- Kerus Erza, known as Salathiel, formerly of the Sanguinary Guard, IX Legion From the very formation of the Legiones Astartes, the employment of Destroyer cadres was the subject of intense controversy. While none could deny the military utility of the terrible weapons such forces employed, the massive collateral damage and lingering taint caused by their use on the battlefield meant that a number of Legions either discontinued their use entirely, or deployed them with great reluctance. [Pict Capture TC/872-15P-154] - Kerus Erza, known as Salathiel, formerly of the Sanguinary Guard, IX Legion. Rembrancer’s note: Subject bears the “Tears of Shenlong” (Ref:Gamma/3/Lantern, the), paired archaeotech energy weapons.In the case of the IX Legion, alongside the usual concerns there were also deep cultural taboos. The moons of Baal, where the IX drew the majority of their recruits after reunification with the Primarch, still bore the scars of the terrible radiological and chemical warfare which had destroyed the cultures that flourished there prior to the Old Night. The concept of perpetrating such a horror on other worlds appalled the Great Angel and his sons; their mission was to restore human civilisation to the galaxy, not to consign other societies to the same fate that which had befallen their forefathers. Ever dutiful, the IX Legion nonetheless maintained a Destroyer cadre; indeed, while Destroyers in many Legions were shunned by their fellows, the IX paradoxically raised them to a position of honour.The tribes of Baal’s moons have always emphasised mourning of the dead; life on the irradiated satellites is so harsh that often an individual must offer up their life for the survival of their community, and when this happens the ritual grief is both elaborate and sincere. On Baal Secondus, mourners might show solidarity by blackening their faces and so temporarily joining the ‘company of death’; on Baal Primus, friends and family of the deceased generally don a chequered scarf symbolising the good and bad deeds they have done in life. These traditions were continued in the post-reunification IX Legion.The IX Legion did not maintain a permanent Destroyer cadre as such, but instead created ad hoc formations equipped with the forbidden weapons held in the Legion’s armoury. These units were organised into Choirs of Saphadae, an old Baalite term for those who lament at funerals. The Saphadae were volunteers, generally legionaries of the IX who had adopted the role as a self-imposed punishment for whatever transgression they felt they had committed. Employing the Legion’s most transgressive weapons to save their comrades from the shame of their use, they sang laments for the societies they destroyed, weeping at the painful necessity of replicating Baal’s ruin on other worlds across the galaxy. [Pict Capture TC/872-15P-156] – Escalus Acaste and Bassanio Palamon, known as Nuriel, formerly of the 7th Company, IX Legion.One typical Choir of Saphadae immediately before and after the Great Betrayal centred around Salathiel, a senior member of the Sanguinary Guard whose decision to make penance remains obscure, but was presumably as a result failing the Primarch in some manner. Its other members were equally shamed, including several legionaries under censure and several others who had elected to become Saphadae for reasons of honour, including a former member of the Legion’s disbanded Librarius.After serving together during the campaigns on Eligabulus, the Hannbeck Reach and Parsifal V, the unit stayed together as the Legion assembled for the Signus campaign. Records of all participants save two terminate at this point, leading to the assumption that all other members of the Choir fell during the bloody horror of the IX’s first engagement of the Great Betrayal; what is known, however, is that Legionary Baraqiel was reinstated as an Lexicanum, while Salathiel returned to his role within the Sanguinary Guard. Both were present at the Siege of Terra, where they fell defending the Eternity Gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokkorex Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Beautiful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argent aquila Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 great backstory, and magnificent painting on Salathiel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 2, 2014 Author Share Posted November 2, 2014 Glad people like them- I know that on one level the Angels are an obvious candidate not to employ Destroyers, but I liked the Lamenter link. I'll get round to finishing the team off at some point; hopefully inspiration will strike at some point... Anyhow I've made some progress on the Thunder Warriors; I just need the heads really to finish them off; hopefully thay'll come along on Monday. For the last member of the squad, I thought I'd go for something a little different; I've been feeling a little guilty about not having a homage to the gun toted by the old metal miniature, so I came up with this as a support weapon... FInally, I've been thinking about the way I might paint these guys and I'd be interested in people's thoughts. I have a broad idea of the style- I want the armour to have been roughly sprayed a base colour when it was issued along with unit markings, and then having been through an awful lot since with all sorts of scratches and dents scraping the paint off. This fits the theme but also gives me a chance to try out a pot of masking fluid I've got my hands on. The question is, what should the base and unit marking colour be? As I'm going to have my Thunder Warriors being quite Subcontinental in culture as opposed to the Romanesque post-unification Imperium, a light saffron colour with white or red insignia might be a potential goer. I also wondered about a nice military green with white markings, but that seems a bit close to the Nurgly colours the base models would normally be painted, and that might make them a bit too similar. Maybe the solution is a good Indian Khaki? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 Quick update; now that the Thunder Warriors are modelled, I'm beginning to start painting. Because my plan uses several techniques I haven't tried before including chipping, I'm doing a test Rhino door to see if things work out. Here's where I've got so far; the next step once the matte varnish is dry is to add the masking liquid, then the rust layer to chip and finally a wash to tie it all together. As you can see, I went for khaki and blue, inspired by this (and yes I know that's khaki and green!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackDaw Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Well damn. Those Angels are lovely. Nice justification for the Ninth using Destroyers as well, it's definitely something I could see myself doing at some point if Seraph weren't all dead. Fingers crossed inspiration kicks your door in soon and we get to see the rest of the Kill team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 I really like your work on the Thunder Warriors so far, but I have one gripe with the models: So far, the armour based on the Blightkings presents quite a departure from the regular Astartes look -- and rightly so, as Thunder Warriors should be wearing an older, proto-design of the later Astartes plate. But I do think you should go for more Astartes-like shoulder pads to have the models slightly more reminiscent of their successors. These wouldn't even need to look recognisably like established Astartes patterns, plus you could add some suitably feral and/or ostentatious decoration to them, but I think the models do need something to tie them together with the general Astartes look. The John Blanche artwork for the Thunder Warriors would probably be a pretty cool inspiration (it appears in this article, for instance). In any case, keep up the amazing work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 6, 2014 Author Share Posted November 6, 2014 Thought I'd post an update on my colour scheme trial; here's the rust layer on the Rhino door... ...and here's the finished article! I was fairly happy with it, but felt it was too muddy and wanted to preserve a bit more of the khaki colour. This was probably down to impatience on my part- removing the mask involves dampening the surface and I suspect things weren't entirely dry when I started the process- but also I think deciding to do the rust over the paintjob, rather than the reverse, played a factor. I did this because I was worried about putting too many layers of paint over the mask. Anyhow I had another go, but this time putting the rust under the paintjob, and the result is the door on the right. This is pretty much what I was going for, although I think I'll be a bit more subtle when it comes to the Thunder Warriors themselves. Every time I do this I get a better sense of how to get good chips, so hopefully I should have it off to a fine art! On the right-hand door you can also see the symbol I'm using for my Thunder Warriors- it's the Vajra, the indestructible thunderbolt. This seems to fit the Thunder Warriors quite well... Oh, and while I'm here, have a quick photo of the tattered remains of their regimental banner; it's a bit more blue in real life! Well damn. Those Angels are lovely. Nice justification for the Ninth using Destroyers as well, it's definitely something I could see myself doing at some point if Seraph weren't all dead. Fingers crossed inspiration kicks your door in soon and we get to see the rest of the Kill team. Thanks, glad you like them! Seraph were a big influence. I will finish them off eventually; one of my problems is that I'll find something extremely interesting and feel very motivated to work on it, but then that motivation will ebb very quickly without much warning in favour of something else, particularly if I encouranter a setback. I wasn't very happy with the paintjob on one of the Destroyers and so that sapped my interest; it'll come back the second I cock up something else! I really like your work on the Thunder Warriors so far, but I have one gripe with the models: So far, the armour based on the Blightkings presents quite a departure from the regular Astartes look -- and rightly so, as Thunder Warriors should be wearing an older, proto-design of the later Astartes plate. But I do think you should go for more Astartes-like shoulder pads to have the models slightly more reminiscent of their successors. These wouldn't even need to look recognisably like established Astartes patterns, plus you could add some suitably feral and/or ostentatious decoration to them, but I think the models do need something to tie them together with the general Astartes look. The John Blanche artwork for the Thunder Warriors would probably be a pretty cool inspiration (it appears in this article, for instance). In any case, keep up the amazing work! I take your point, although I suspect when it comes to proto-astartes you may be coming a little further towards the Astartes end of things than I am! As I've been building these guys the way I've done the shoulders has evolved; I started off going for Cataphracti-style pauldrons using the Chaos Knight bits with chain links hanging down, but increasingly I ended up using larger and more rounded pads on their left. These are the Blightking pauldrons with their iconography shaved off, which seem broadly the same size and shape as Terminator ones. I think they look similar enough to broadly recall astartes, just in a far cruder form, much as the proto-bolters do; I also think it makes practical sense for them to have more protection on that side of their body. I'd take a photo but the models are undercoated and so all you'd get is a black blob at the moment- what this space. I have to say that the Blanche Thunder Warrior concepts have always fallen a bit short for me (a very rare miss)- I think they suffer from being a bit too similar to Astartes, while at the same time losing some of the features that the old miniatures had to make them distinctive, like the helmets (I have to say, I like Blanche's helmets, but they aren't what I think of when it comes to Thunder Warriors). I really want to push the idea of the Thunder Warriors as techno-barbarians, with the emphasis on barbarian; very practical, non-standarsied and brutal, with little ornamentation. And also, as you say, remeniscent of astartes, but as a very crude first draft; these guys don't even have the advantage of Martian technology. It's probably also worth mentioning that in background terms these guys are heresy-era, have been in (sort of) hiding ever since the Cerberus debacle and were some of the first Thunder Warriors to start with; so they are very old, hard-bitten and slightly tattered holdovers of a long past era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Hey mate, I get what you're saying -- and I am pretty confident that the finished models will look great. However, I will stand by my assessment that you will need something on these models to recall Astartes armour, lest they end up looking like Warhammer Knights with 40k weapons. For instance, with my own Blightking conversions (True scale Plague Marines), it's pretty much instantly recognisable what they are supposed to be, and I still received a LOT of feedback stating they didn't seem futuristic enough. For Tunder Warriors, you don't get all the characteristic elements Plague Marines have, because there's only two (?) very old Thunder Warrior models and a very limited amount of artwork, so it feels like you'll have to help people recognise what these are supposed to be. The guy with the old skook bolter is looking amazing, and I can imagine him looking perfect with a Thunder Warriors-esque helmet. The guy with the hammer, however, doesn't work quite as well for me -- he's not quite proto-Space Marine-y enough, if you know what I mean. But maybe that's just my personal take on things, and I will of course reserve judgement until I've seen the finished conversions. Sorry for being such a nuisance! Oh, and that banner is looking amazing, btw! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 7, 2014 Author Share Posted November 7, 2014 Hey mate, I get what you're saying -- and I am pretty confident that the finished models will look great. However, I will stand by my assessment that you will need something on these models to recall Astartes armour, lest they end up looking like Warhammer Knights with 40k weapons. For instance, with my own Blightking conversions (True scale Plague Marines), it's pretty much instantly recognisable what they are supposed to be, and I still received a LOT of feedback stating they didn't seem futuristic enough. For Tunder Warriors, you don't get all the characteristic elements Plague Marines have, because there's only two (?) very old Thunder Warrior models and a very limited amount of artwork, so it feels like you'll have to help people recognise what these are supposed to be. The guy with the old skook bolter is looking amazing, and I can imagine him looking perfect with a Thunder Warriors-esque helmet. The guy with the hammer, however, doesn't work quite as well for me -- he's not quite proto-Space Marine-y enough, if you know what I mean. But maybe that's just my personal take on things, and I will of course reserve judgement until I've seen the finished conversions. Sorry for being such a nuisance! Oh, and that banner is looking amazing, btw! Oh, I completely get what you're saying; like you say, work is definitely needed to 40k-ify the Blightkings, and I know you added quite a lot of tubes and vents etc to your plaguemarines (blightmarines?) to avoid them looking too Fantasy. Of the five Thunder Warriors I've done I'm particularly happy with three of them, and I think the thing they have in common are big guns. The other two will fit in ok with the others, but the look isn't quite as clear, somehow. I wish I'd had a couple more of the Cadian heads, which really help in that field. One of the other issues with making things up as you go along is that you can hit on a brilliant idea at precisely the wrong time; the last Thunder Warrior I did is my favourite because of his proto-storm bolter, and if I make any more I'll definitely pattern them after him. It'll cost a fortune in bits though! I think the other thing that makes a big difference is the paintjob and the base. I've now finished two of them, and giving them a camo-drab look really helps push the 'techno' side of the techno-barbarian thing. After experimenting with a rather dull ash waste base, I decided that I'd base them up in the setting which the accompanying bit of fluff has them, which is on a semi-derelict space ship; this has somehow made them much more Thunder-Warriorish... Anyhow, here's a (very) WIP of the proto-bolter guy. At this point I was a bit worried he'd end up being a bit of a mess, but once the details were painted up I think it works fairly well. Having decided to base the team on using a spaceship theme rather than my original plan, I then discovered that I only had three resin bases rather than the five I needed, so I needed to make a couple more. Here's the first one; thank god for pressmoulds! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miteyheroes Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Every time I see a Blightking conversion my heart sinks, and I know I'm one step closer to buying some! These look amazing, and the painted guy definitely has a strong futuristic techno-barbarian vibe that I love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malika666 Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Don't forget to add some thunderbolts on the figure! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kizzdougs Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Really great conversions with the Blightkings! Nice base too :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted November 8, 2014 Author Share Posted November 8, 2014 Thanks all- converting these guys is bloody hard work but I'm pleased with the end result. I've just finished number three- the banner bearer- so just two to go now before I can show them off! I painted up that base btw- here it is with the other home-made one. They should hopefully be pretty indistinguishable from the ones I bought, which is handy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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