++ The Brotherhood of Dust - A Thousand Sons Community ++

[Paladin777]

Maybe a bucket of tzaangors with tzaangor blades charging would be the best against the knights. none of their attributes would be wasted so it would be hyper efficient for the points.

 

AP only -1: check

No appreciable armor save to be ignored: check

Good ws and str: check

Reasonable invulnerable: check

Cheap enough to field in good numbers: check

[Zodd1888]

Tzangors in their 8th Ed incarnation appear to be nearly essential, and hugely valuable, in all-comers lists. 5++ at 7 pts w/ RR 1's potential is massive defensively. Their improved charge helps to force fallback actions so I can see running two 10 man units easily in any composition.

[1000 Sons]

Remember that smite for rubrics and scarab occult is just one mortal wound, and on a roll of 10+ it is d3.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Just wish the models were cheaper :P
How do people think we will deal with tanks ect now heretech and psychic powers that are good bar prescience are gone and whilst boltguns can hurt them, I'm skeptical of how effiecient that would be and gw decided to strip all options such as bike or havoks from us?
 

[Paladin777]

You mean besides charge them with Magnus?

 

In all reality though, I plan on using probably at least one auto/las pred per 1000 points or so. I think others might use the dakkafiend.

Alternatively, the land raider looks like it would be crazy beastly, if a bit expensive.

[MoGuy]

The Mauler/Forgefiends seem good at taking on vehicles. The Maulerfiend finally has 4 attacks and with ini gone it can swing before the enemy Dreadnought etc realises what hit him.

 

Otherwise Laspreds are always an option. And since we now can take more of the vanilla stuff, I would suggest CSM termis with fists and combi melters. They won't have the <Thousand Sons> keyword but you can just drop them wherever you want and watch that Vindicator shake in his boots tracks.

[MoGuy]

I just painted up my first Tzaangor that I had lying around from my Silver Tower box. I'm thinking about investing in some more goats as they seem great. S4, T4, CC weapons with -1AP, a 5++ and the ability to take an instrument/icon of chaos is neat.

 

Can someone who already played 8th edition give some feedback on our herds of goats? How do they hold up on the battlefield? To be fair I think one would have to scoot them up the board in a Rhino, otherwise I don't see them getting to the enemy lines in one piece...

[Archaeinox]

Since the Rubric Marines became better, I have been too busy running a few units of them to worry about Tzaangors. I might even get rid of the Protgoats

[Skerr]

I was just reviewing the rules to see if a 40 point investment in 4 icon for lets say 2 squads of Rubrics and 2 squads of SOT, might help accumulate mortal wound output for aspiring and SOT sorcerers.  I see that it is only on 6's for the closest model in 12''.   A couple of lucky 6s combined with a 1 or 1-3 mortal wound output on 4 units; is it worth a 40 point investment in bigger point games?  Until artifacts come out they do make for some easy filler for 10 points.  I've always like the idea of an icon of flame and think the bitz from the Rubric sprue are awesome (I got six extra from bitz sellers a couple months back) though soul blaze never seemed to amount to much.  Thoughts on icon effectiveness?

[Anon]

 

Game went.....very badly the first few turns, but this is due to Ap -2 bolters not really making a difference against 3++ invulnerable save models, and that my friend has a habit of making a ludicrous amount of invulnerable saves.  He lands a unit of knights and makes the charge on an 8 so my one unit of rubrics is put directly into combat top of turn 1. (The case for flamers right bloody here)  

 

If I understand correctly he shocked and then attacked with a diceroll of 8? This is not possible with the new rules. When shocking you have to be more than 9 inches away so you need to roll a 9 to sucessfully charge. An 8 is not enough.

And if he succeeds the charge roll you can't shoot your flamers in overwatch because the flamers are more then 9 inch away. Weapons you shoot in overwatch have to be in range before the attacker moves. 

 

This was nice to read! Thanks for your write up.

[Sonoftherubric21]

 

 

Game went.....very badly the first few turns, but this is due to Ap -2 bolters not really making a difference against 3++ invulnerable save models, and that my friend has a habit of making a ludicrous amount of invulnerable saves.  He lands a unit of knights and makes the charge on an 8 so my one unit of rubrics is put directly into combat top of turn 1. (The case for flamers right bloody here)  

 

If I understand correctly he shocked and then attacked with a diceroll of 8? This is not possible with the new rules. When shocking you have to be more than 9 inches away so you need to roll a 9 to sucessfully charge. An 8 is not enough.

And if he succeeds the charge roll you can't shoot your flamers in overwatch because the flamers are more then 9 inch away. Weapons you shoot in overwatch have to be in range before the attacker moves. 

 

This was nice to read! Thanks for your write up.

 

 

Really? a flamer that is getting assaulted cant fire from beyond 8? I didnt actually know that; incredibly stupid if true. 

 

I also didnt know about about the "more then 9 away" i assumed that meant someone could place AT nine inchs flat, so you would be able to make it on an 8 (1 inch reach) 

[Prot]

Yes I always read it as meaning you will always need 10" on a charge from reserves and therefore a flamer will never overwatch that. At least that's how I understood it.

[Skallagoose]

Yes I always read it as meaning you will always need 10" on a charge from reserves and therefore a flamer will never overwatch that. At least that's how I understood it.

Ditto. 9.01 inches away is still a roll of a 9 (10-1inch reach). I like it, as it makes it a little more random for that first turn charge.

[Skerr]

Anyone catch the batrep on YT last night of 1k sons vs Imperium?   The 1k sons players flew Magnus out into the center right of the board like old times at the start of round 1, shot off his 3 spells, left the rest of his army in the DUST behind him and proceeded to take 14 wounds turn 1 from Imperial Assassins, a super heavy and a vanguard attachment with the chicken walkers that literally surrounded him. Magnus was dead by turn 2 I think.  I skimmed through the rest to see 1k sons getting mopped and the player conceding.

 

the 1k army was spread very thin while the Imperium kept his force consolidated.  It was pretty predictable seeing Maggie fly out that it was going to happen that way.

 

Too bad he did not keep his force consolidated, trying to protect Maggie and making use of his Primarch of the 1000 sons ability.  They played it that Maggie, Ari and the EX benefited from their own auras though I still see debate online if characters benefit from their own aura.  I went back the Character focus article to see if it was clarified in the comments and did not see.  Hope we see and FAQ on that quick.

 

Anyway the obvious take away for me was to not fly Magnus out into the open b@ll$ to the wall on his lonesome like you might have in 7th.  Mortal wound put a serious hurt on him.

 

Nothing against the player I make unsound decisions too sometimes though it was interesting to see.

[RapatoR]

Ok so can actually someone confrim how they played All Is Dust rule? Did they add to all saves or to armour saves only?

[Skerr]

Good question, I did not watch the whole thing and cannot watch it now.

 

[Sonoftherubric21]

Anyone catch the batrep on YT last night of 1k sons vs Imperium?   The 1k sons players flew Magnus out into the center right of the board like old times at the start of round 1, shot off his 3 spells, left the rest of his army in the DUST behind him and proceeded to take 14 wounds turn 1 from Imperial Assassins, a super heavy and a vanguard attachment with the chicken walkers that literally surrounded him. Magnus was dead by turn 2 I think.  I skimmed through the rest to see 1k sons getting mopped and the player conceding.

 

the 1k army was spread very thin while the Imperium kept his force consolidated.  It was pretty predictable seeing Maggie fly out that it was going to happen that way.

 

Too bad he did not keep his force consolidated, trying to protect Maggie and making use of his Primarch of the 1000 sons ability.  They played it that Maggie, Ari and the EX benefited from their own auras though I still see debate online if characters benefit from their own aura.  I went back the Character focus article to see if it was clarified in the comments and did not see.  Hope we see and FAQ on that quick.

 

Anyway the obvious take away for me was to not fly Magnus out into the open b@ll$ to the wall on his lonesome like you might have in 7th.  Mortal wound put a serious hurt on him.

 

Nothing against the player I make unsound decisions too sometimes though it was interesting to see.

 

That is....such an odd strategy.  He is strong, and not awfully costed in 8th, but he CANNOT solo an army. 

 

He is designed to be a solid core to build a list around, he is far to good to throw out like that in the open to get shot to death immediately. Give him a core of rubrics / Scarab Occult to surround and protect him and fire away at the buggers. At some point they gotta re-focus on the rubricae or they are going to have major issues mid to late game. 

 

-random side note; can basic chaos take Tzaangors or poxwalkers as troops? or are those locked to "only detachments as deathguard/thousand sons respectively?  Like if i played a black legion list are they still take-able? 

[Heliomanes]

Nothing is locked to a specific detachment. You can take death guard poxwalkers as troops while keeping the rest of your army thousand sons, for instance.

[Paladin777]

I personally think I will likely field him with the intent of running him up near a couple of rhinos with 10 rubrics inside advancing, exalteds/Ahriman on discs also likely advancing, and teleporting a couple of squads of SOTs on Turn one. Has anyone else tried this approach?

[Heliomanes]

Magnus is very likely to get a turn 1 charge going with his massive mobility and a quick cast of Warp time. With every flyer you add (Magnus, daemon princes etc) you get a unit starting on the table, but still able to get in and apply pressure early on and spread out some buffing abilities. This also opens up another Scarab occult unit for deep striking. It could be very effective and has some nice synergy. Fun to think that Ksons can now be played as a brutally mobile strike force, but it fits well, I think. "Wreathed in lightning, they rend the veil" and so on.

[Scammel]

 

Too bad he did not keep his force consolidated, trying to protect Maggie and making use of his Primarch of the 1000 sons ability.  They played it that Maggie, Ari and the EX benefited from their own auras though I still see debate online if characters benefit from their own aura.  I went back the Character focus article to see if it was clarified in the comments and did not see.  Hope we see and FAQ on that quick

This is actually covered in the main rules - characters do indeed benefit from their own buffs.

[Prot]

Yea, I think I read that in the rules a while ago. I think the example they use is a Deathguard lord. It seemed straight forward to me at the time.

[Paladin777]

I don't think that the rules specify if a character benefits from his buff if he has the wrong unit type to receive that buff. Our most notable example is if we put an exalted sorcerer or ahriman on a disc, they are no longer infantry. Their auras specify that they effect infantry so I'm not sure if they would benefit or not.

 

Magnus would benefit from his aura as it effects everything with the Thousand Sons <Legion> Keyword which he has.

Also, the death guard lord has all the appropriate keywords that would apply to his aura.

[Zodd1888]

Magnus to me is the optimal HQ option if you intend to use vehicles or fast moving units. His aura effects anything with the TSons tag so you can boost Daemon Engines, Predators, etc. Given his board speed you can allow your spawn/goats to charge forward and Magnus follows up the next turn.

 

If you're going the heavy troop route (ie. Rubrics and Occults) Ahriman and a Lord to me seem pretty optimal. Their special rules effect infantry specifically, and they are able to hide out among the troops. The extra points and ability to split your HQs will allow greater mobility when splitting the army is needed.

 

That said, it seems like there is a lot of versatility within our limitations. I don't know what a bad list would look like yet, which may be that it's bad play that'll matter most finally!

[Sonoftherubric21]

Magnus to me is the optimal HQ option if you intend to use vehicles or fast moving units. His aura effects anything with the TSons tag so you can boost Daemon Engines, Predators, etc. Given his board speed you can allow your spawn/goats to charge forward and Magnus follows up the next turn.

 

If you're going the heavy troop route (ie. Rubrics and Occults) Ahriman and a Lord to me seem pretty optimal. Their special rules effect infantry specifically, and they are able to hide out among the troops. The extra points and ability to split your HQs will allow greater mobility when splitting the army is needed.

 

That said, it seems like there is a lot of versatility within our limitations. I don't know what a bad list would look like yet, which may be that it's bad play that'll matter most finally!

 

Our unique aura of "re-roll invulnerable of a 1" really does benefit daemon engines. 

 

Forgefiends, defilers, and maulerfiends all love that buff and I find it incredibly useful in crunch with our already tough daemon engines.  Statistically I want to say a 5++ re rolling 1's is slightly better then a 4++, but not as good as a 3++. something like that: regardless it does give us a great direction to go in. 

 

Added bonus; when we get Contemptor and Leviathan access (assuming contemptor is a given, leviathan is a probably), They also have substantial invulnerable saves.... something to keep in mind over a regular dreadnought!  Who ever guessed that Thousand Sons would be the "daemon engine" faction.... go figure... Not that I object mind...