++ The Brotherhood of Dust - A Thousand Sons Community ++

[Prot]

Well as far as the points I don't have anyone in my play groups that are going to care to be honest.

 

As far as spawn, the have been in almost all my Thousand Sons lists since the index hit. I use them for speedy tie up units against shooty opponents and a sand bag against an assaulty army.

[TheMelancholic]

Wishlist: Tsons Legion Tactic is add -1 AP to a maximum of -3. Or Strategem?

 

Would this make SO and Rubrics big enough threats?

 

Could see this as a stratagem but it would be borderline OP as a tactic.

 

I feel like TS are generally much better than they were in previous editions for a couple of reasons.

 

First of all, AP3 bolters were a bit lackluster in 6-7th. Plasma spam was the name of the game and TS were shoehorned into an odd role as a dedicated MEQ killer in an edition with shedloads of AP2 being thrown around. Now that AP isn't an all or nothing thing, AP-2 is genuinely more useful against a wider variety of targets in a wider range of situations.

 

Rubrics also have a number of options now that make them more flexible. Though hideously expensive, a warpflamer or two goes a long way to dissuading potential chargers while the Soulreaper provides you essentially a stronger, more mobile heavy bolter platform.

 

Furthermore one of the Rubrics key weaknesses in previous editions was their vulnerability to things like massed bolter fire. As an expensive elites choice, they had the same likelihood of dying to a bolt round as a run of the mill tactical or CSM. Now things like Sternguard and Chosen also fitted into this category of "glass cannon" elite troopers but unlike TS they fulfilled the cannon part a bit better with gobs of AP2 firepower and so on. With the addition of "All is Dust" and the re-work to AP, TS are now far tankier than they were before and present an annoying conundrum to your opponent. Use multi-damage attacks on single wound models to negate the bonus or struggle to punch through the modified saves weight of fire alone?

 

I don't have enough experience with TOS to really pass judgement on them, but I've generally heard mixed things. Power swords are better now and AP2 combi-bolters are mean as all get out. That being said, regular Terminators with Combi-Plasma and MoS are arguably more cost effective and shootier.

 

Also here's a protip: RAW you can use the chaos familiar stratagem to change a TS aspiring sorcerer's power from smite to something more useful (*cough* prescience). Also, always buy that flamer pistol since you can shoot it in melee now.

[Archaeinox]

Not interested in getting additional AP from any source.

 

The trait should be for something they are known for in the fiction, which is tough Rubricae and sorcery. In ALL the 40k BL novels with Rubrics in them, including the Ahriman series by John French, their bolters are no more effective than the basic Space Marine's. Both bolt rounds will cause suitably painful deaths in any space marine themed book you read. Sure, the Rubricae in the Ahriman books have fiery bolts that melt the souls blahblahblah but bolters are sick as heck and they are only AP 0 lollll.

 

Honestly I don't know why the AP3 bolters was even a thing in 2007 and it started a bad trend of "meh, you dont need super powerful guys and troops because youre bolters are sick bruh"

 

We need powerful psykers and I don't care which Imperial gets sad. They can take scouts or deep strike terminators in or something to execute our guys. We can't stop SM stratagems....

[Prot]

I gotta admit as someone who has a lot of armies at his disposal, it's a real eye opener playing a 'codex' army and an 'index' army.

 

I haven't even cracked out the GK's, and Utlra's have been decent. I don't say this to mean 'having a codex is so powerful!'. It's more a feeling like you really get to play your army. The 'feel' of playing Ultra's (for example) Index vs Codex is night and day. Power wise it feels a slight bump but a lot of those power-perks are inconsequential to me because every codex is obviously going to get a decent sprinkling of those goodies.

 

For me the powerlevel didn't go up a ton... certainly not in the long term, but the feel of the army is what I personally miss the most about the Thousand Sons. 

 

Don't get me wrong I think GW did a truly amazing job with the indexes. I am missing the feel of the Thousand Sons. I can't wait to play them as a Codex army regardless of 'awesomeness'. It just feels like the flavour is missing for me right now. 

[Panzer]

Yeah I get it by just reading already. You just get so many options with all those Stratagems, Warlord Traits, Relics and Psychic Powers...it feels way more like a proper army than the temporary stuff the Index represents.

[WarriorFish]

I might even have my Sons ready for the table by the codex rolls by The difference between a full codex and an index list is large, but as we knew the index sets were stripped down "get by" flavour light versions the difference isn't a huge surprise there. The various point drops are the icing on the cake (though I will lament that chainfists stayed the same). Unfortunately I'm not sure how GW thinks/feels about Sons currently (other than ham fisted narratives, but Sons are far from alone there) so I can't even hedge my bets on what may come.

 

I'm thinking of another squad of Rubrics (because I have a plastic addiction?), but would really like to add more Scarabs one day. Terminators are cool, but even with the improvements to more normal ones they need higher points to be effective I feel so I'm not sure if there's room for lots in an army that's a bit pricey to start with? Anyone got some tips on Scarabs?

[Prot]

Fish. I agree the direction they go with Tsons has me guessing as well ( I'm preying we don't become a single phase army again).

 

Scarabs is a touchy subject with me. I finished painting 15 in a ridiculous, mad effort for a late 7th edition ITC event with Magnus and Sehkmet.

 

Then the edition changes and I struggle to find merit for a single squad. I always find better use for the points. The cannon is just not a great upgrade but the missiles are still mandatory yet I find myself in cc against nasty shoots stuff too often.

 

I push one squad Two squads if with the appropriate amount of chaff I n the list.

 

Maybe it's my meta but Astra is typically dealing such high damage ( Tau too) that they fall easily. They are fantastic against chaff though. If it weren't for the points I'd seriously consider the flamer.

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

I find that when used with a rubric base marching up the field that scarabs are good to tighten the noose around an opponents army

[Prot]

Another FW question:

 

I bought a Decimator, I don't think I can magnetize the arms. Should I go with one Soulburner + one Claw/ Heavy flamer? Or 2 Soulburners?

 

I am considering a Leviathan too... I have no idea if the Flux Bombard is worth taking two? Or does this guy really rock in CC?

[Raven1]

Well as far as the points I don't have anyone in my play groups that are going to care to be honest.

 

As far as spawn, the have been in almost all my Thousand Sons lists since the index hit. I use them for speedy tie up units against shooty opponents and a sand bag against an assaulty army.

 

Really?  I want to like them but havent used them as I think the what 7" movement just isn't fast enough.  as far as the Decimator goes...may be one claw one soulburner they are fairly expensive being like 60 points a weapon.  The leviathan I would do dual grav flux bombard.  Its going to be a huge fire magnet and expensive already so I suggest go for broke on it and kill as much as possible while its still alive.  Maybe a babysitter (sorcerer) for warptime and Tzaangors as a meatshield?

[Paladin777]

So going back to codex wish lists, I think it would be very cool and fluffy to have two psychic power charts. One for the exalted sorcerers/Ahriman, and one for squad leaders. The one for the exalted's would be similar to the dark hereticus discipline, and the one for the squad leaders would be more for buffing/manipulating the squad they were attached to.

[TheMelancholic]

So going back to codex wish lists, I think it would be very cool and fluffy to have two psychic power charts. One for the exalted sorcerers/Ahriman, and one for squad leaders. The one for the exalted's would be similar to the dark hereticus discipline, and the one for the squad leaders would be more for buffing the squad they were attached to.

 

Something makes me doubt that squad leader sorcerers will get much in the way in powers unfortunately, simply due to the fact that they won't be much different from their CSM Codex iteration. The only way I see them getting another power is if the TS get a trait like "Every THOUSAND SONS psyker knows one more power of their choice from the Dark Hereticus discipline".

 

Only time will tell, but i just have a gut feeling that the main difference between Codex CSM/Index Chaos TS and TS in their own codex will be from things like stratagems, relics, warlord traits e.c.t. and maybe a legion trait if GW is feeling generous enough.

 

Death Guard is due to release in September so I guess we'll know how "mechanically different" GW is willing to let a certain legion be from generic CSM. Besides DG getting their own unique units, look out for:

• A legion trait (if DG get one I'd say there is a very strong chance that TS will get one too)
• Unique stratagems (I'm sure they'll be a few, but we'll see the extent to which GW will push them in DG)
• Relics (again I'm sure there will be a few, but as to how many and how good)
• Psychic powers (DG already had their own unique discipline teased with the Blightcaster. I reckon that unique powers will be limited to blightcaster and you'll get normal dark hereticus stuff from regular sorcerers which is probably what they'll do for TS too)

[Raven1]

how "mechanically different" GW is willing to let a certain legion be from generic CSM.

I would put money on basically a carbon copy with a handful of changes to make it more nurgely.

 

Back to wishlisting for us...if you want to say that Rubrics aren't agile enough for bikes or raptors or go for the demonhood/possession for warptalons, possessed etc why not Havocs? It seems perfectly reasonable for rubrics to be havocs.

[Zodd1888]

I'd like Havocs on Disc.

 

I also see TS getting something specific involving their squad leader. Some type of orders alternative that may be cult specific or something Psychic.

[Souljet]

 

Really?  I want to like them but havent used them as I think the what 7" movement just isn't fast enough.  as far as the Decimator goes...may be one claw one soulburner they are fairly expensive being like 60 points a weapon.  The leviathan I would do dual grav flux bombard.  Its going to be a huge fire magnet and expensive already so I suggest go for broke on it and kill as much as possible while its still alive.  Maybe a babysitter (sorcerer) for warptime and Tzaangors as a meatshield?

Re: Spawn, that's what I thought initially and then used them in the daemon prince bubble and warptimed them up the table. If they make it in they are devastating. Give them a go and see what you think. They're definitely a main stay in my army now.

[Souljet]

 

how "mechanically different" GW is willing to let a certain legion be from generic CSM.

I would put money on basically a carbon copy with a handful of changes to make it more nurgely.

Back to wishlisting for us...if you want to say that Rubrics aren't agile enough for bikes or raptors or go for the demonhood/possession for warptalons, possessed etc why not Havocs? It seems perfectly reasonable for rubrics to be havocs.

Totally agree. I comically picture in my head thousand sons heavy weapon teams just inexplicably dumping their heavy weapons once they were made rubrics thinking "well we can't use them any more so I guess it's bolters, flamers, or soulreapers from now on".

[Archaeinox]

Eh, I don't want any different charts for Aspirings. Keep them simple. Leave the big powers to the exalteds/Ahriman. Less book-keeping. Just make the powers easier to cast and have perils mitigation and that'd be a fine legion trait.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Just got a copy of the FW Chaos index, what do people think would be best for supporting TS?
At the moment I'm debating betweeen a naked sicaran, venator with either sponsons, deredro with either the Saker or butcher cannons, a Xiphon or a decimator.
I like all the models, I admit the Venator slightly more but it suffers from proberbly the worst rules, the "chaos is random lol" rules writing school meaning I'm not sure how good it will be when it;s main gun will struggle to wound with it's one shot a turn, especially in a all rounders list against say necrons whilst the normal one has more shots and can target fliers without penalty.
 

[The Yncarne]

I've run a heavy bolter Sicaran in 6th and 7th and it was always a star. I looked in the Chaos index to see if it changed and noticed it is an elite.  I believe everything else in that section is a heavy support option. I also was drawn to the leviathan with dual flux bombards, but put it on hold for now.

 

I opted for decimators and a contemptor. The decimators don't degrade with wounds so i think they're the stronger option in most of my games.

 

Looks like my army core will be troops and elites until the Codex comes out.

[Prot]

Yea, I still definitely like the Decimator on paper. It's just arming it that's hard to decide.

 

I think a goal is something that takes out tanks. I'm never going to have a bunch of Havoks, and there's little reason for me to take a lot of predators (I doubt we'll see the same Strategems that Astartes got... even  Chaos got...)

 

The ability to have CC is also good. 

 

I'm not too keen on anti flyer at the moment. It was all the rage until GW double nerfed it in the tournie scene. BUT a Fire Raptor is a very capable machine.

[The Yncarne]

Fire Raptors are awesome. One day I'll have one in Ahriman's livery. Its a winning model in terms of looks and capability.

 

My current list needs long range firepower and a counter assault unit. Thats what my decimators are for. I did buy and paint a predator and land raider this week for the long range support. I think the land raider is expensive just for the guns, so i need to get the terminators done before i likely use it much.

 

I play friendly games so not sure how good these FW models are in a competition environment, but its where I've invested my cash for the summer.

[Raven1]

Honestly I'm thinking of holding off buying too much before the codex drops. So spawn which will probably AoS Spirit hosts and I dont know what for heavy support. I really want to try a Defiler but I think it would be a wasted in points and money, so maybe a land raider.

 

I would invest in Helbrutes or Predators but I dont know what our trait or stragems will be.

[The Yncarne]

Yep, without a proper codex, I'm hesitant to buy too much. However, I needed at least 2k to play now.

[Raven1]

Yep, without a proper codex, I'm hesitant to buy too much. However, I needed at least 2k to play now.

 

Im torn between Defiler or Landraider.  I think the Landraider is the better of the two I just cant get away from the wanting the Defiler to work.

 

I have a start collecting helbrute waiting to be assembled; am I right in thinking the las cannon missile launcher combo is good? Or should I go auto cannon and scourge?

 

Also, do we have any input on the defiler? I love the model but would like to know if anyone is having any success with it.

 

If you have the magnets why not both?  From what I have heard and seen the Defiler continues to disappoint but with the points drop in C:CSM it might make the difference. 

[The Yncarne]

I prefer the clean lines of a Land Raider.  I also prefer the rule of cool to the rule of one.