IL V - The Halcyon Wardens

[Kelborn]

Please help me out, what was the Screaming Fist again?

[bluntblade]

A military operation that went horribly wrong in the war before the events of Neuromancer. What was the army guy's name? It screwed him up big time Edited September 6, 2016 by bluntblade

[Kelborn]

Ah ok.

 

Could be the name of a specific strategy instead of an units name.

 

After weakining enemy lines, they send in their bike squads, making as much noise as possible to intimidate the remaining enemy forces.

 

Called the screaming fist, the Predators breacher and assault bikes break through the enemies defence lines like the namesaking fist. Irritated by the sheer brutality and further the incredible noise of that attack, no mortal force can withstand this simple but yet effectiv strategy.

[Doctor Perils]

Ok. Then some alternative anti-marine weapons.

• Lascannons
• Plasma Cannons
• Plasma Guns
• Meltaguns
• Multi-meltas
• Cyclone Missile Launchers
• Mini Battle Cannon (Questoris Battle Cannon stats, but single shot & maybe smaller blast)
• Mini Accelaerator Cannon
• Some kind of Archaeotech weapon (~S5-6, AP3, possibly multi-shot)

It should be pretty easy to make a list from the options above. All of them have good enough AP to deal with marines. The issue is that they are all going to be relatively expensive so the base tank cost will likely be higher. Also by the time you get to AP3 the weapons are normally in the anti-tank range anyway, so the tank will be more multi-role than dedicated to anti-vehicle/infantry in particular.

I believe you are missing the obvious: lascannon with co-axial twin-linked plasma guns ;)

 

I have no idea if they are still useful in 40k on razors, but as units of cheap fast vehicles? Could be pretty devastating. Also, its a lascannon with twin-linked plasma gun: 'nuff said.

 

Ah ok.

 

Could be the name of a specific strategy instead of an units name.

 

After weakining enemy lines, they send in their bike squads, making as much noise as possible to intimidate the remaining enemy forces.

 

Called the screaming fist, the Predators breacher and assault bikes break through the enemies defence lines like the namesaking fist. Irritated by the sheer brutality and further the incredible noise of that attack, no mortal force can withstand this simple but yet effectiv strategy.

Pssst, wrong thread ;)

[simison]

Adding it to the list, Thorn:

 

• Lascannons
• Plasma Cannons
• Plasma Guns
• Meltaguns
• Multi-meltas
• Cyclone Missile Launchers
• Mini Battle Cannon (Questoris Battle Cannon stats, but single shot & maybe smaller blast)
• Mini Accelaerator Cannon
• Some kind of Archaeotech weapon (~S5-6, AP3, possibly multi-shot)
• Lascannon with twin-linked Plasma Rifles

 

I'm going through the current options for the Predator Strike, to see what's too complicated or doesn't fit in a fluff perspective.

 

• Heavy Conversion Beamer (While I love the different profiles used, the Firing Calibration rule makes it clear that it doesn't belong.)
• Magna-Melta (A little advanced, but the fluff doesn't sound too ill-fitting for the Gaja.)
• Executioner Plasma Cannon (Too advanced, unfortunately, even if it's relatively common for the age.)
• Flamestrom Cannon (Passes. Fire for the win.)

So, only the Flamestrom and the Magna-Melta pass with the latter slightly debatable. 

[Nomus Sardauk]

I like the idea of a Leman Russ-esque Battle Cannon, Space Marines have never had that kind of punch before on their tanks as the Predator's Autocannon could never really compare with the Russ's balance of anti-tank & anti-heavy infantry punch, and the TL-Lascannon just couldn't kill infantry quickly enough by itself. Edited September 9, 2016 by SanguiniusReborn

[Grifftofer]

I have a question simison. How do you envision the Gaja? Is it a single turret with paired weapon systems (not twin-linked); a single turret with potentially asymmetric weapons (each upgraded separately); or some kind of dual turret system (kinda like the Stalker AA tank)?

 

I ask because adding a pair of either the Magna-melta or Flamestorm cannon would be pretty expensive (and debate-ably a little OP). A solution might be that you trade both weapons for one of the two above and a combi-bolter or something else lightweight?

[simison]

Oh, I had forgotten about the Stalker. I was thinking of having both actually. No pairs of Flamestorms or Magna-Meltas, but as a single turret option. While, say, if I went with the meltagun armament, I was thinking that it'd be two twin-linked melta guns for the turret weapon. 

 

So, depending on what was the weapon type, I would go back and forth between the different kinds of turrets.

[Grifftofer]

Thought I'd throw some of my thoughts together. Take or leave as much as you like.

 

Gaja Light Assault Squadron                           90 points/model

 

               BS        Front     Side     Rear      HP

Gaja         4           12         11         11         3

 

Unit Composition

• 2-4 Gaja Assault Tanks

Unit Type

• Vehicle (Tank, Fast)

Wargear

• Two turret-mounted twin-linked Plasma Guns
• Searchlight
• Smoke Launcher

Special Rules

• ?Outflank?

 

Options

Any model may exchange either twin-linked Plasma Gun for one of the following:

• Twin-linked Meltagun ................................................ free
• Multi-melta .............................................................. +5pts
• Cyclone Missile Launcher ....................................... +5pts
• Plasma Cannon .................................................... +10pts
• Archaeotech Devestator ....................................... +10pts
• Lascannon ............................................................ +15pts
• Questoris Conquerer Cannon .............................. +15pts
• Gaja Accelerator Cannon ..................................... +20pts

Any model may exchange one of it's twin-linked Plasma Guns for one of the following:

• Flamestorm Cannon ........................................... +20pts
• Magna-Melta ...................................................... +50pts

Any model in the squadron may take the following:

• Hunter-killer Missile ........................................... +5pts
• Dozer Blade ...................................................... +5pts
• Extra Armour ..................................................... +5pts
• Auxiliary Drive................................................... +10pts

One model may be upgraded to a Squadron Command Tank for +35 points.

 

 

Questoris Conquerer Cannon     24"; S6; AP3; Heavy 1, Blast

Gaja Accelerator Cannon (AE)   36"; S8; AP2; Heavy 1, Sunder

Gaja Accelerator Cannon (HE)   36"; S7; AP4; Heavy 1, Blast

Archaeotech Devestator             24"; S6; AP3; Heavy 3, Master-crafted

Edited September 10, 2016 by Grifftofer

[simison]

It's a good foundation. Not sure why you're against pintle weapons. 

 

So, how much lighter is the battle cannon? I was under the impression a battle cannon was big enough to take up a whole turret. 

 

I'm not sure as to whether we should keep the plasma cannon or the cyclone missile launchers as options. 

 

And wouldn't the accelerator weapon count as the unique 30k weapon as opposed to the Archaeotech?

[Grifftofer]

I'm not against pintle weapons as a rule, but I don't see any need for them. After all any additional weapons will only be snap firing if the vehicle moves quickly. However, the standard list of pintle weapons is easy enough to add.

 

Well the conquerer battle cannon is a lighter version of the battle cannon, designed to be fired on the move. With the strength reduction it would likely be even lighter. And the range has been reduced over either of the above, which could be a barrel length reduction, also reducing its weight. Whether you think that would be enough to make it a weapon that can be paired in a single turret is down to you though.

 

Any reason for those two weapons in particular? Though they are easy enough to take out if you want.

 

I made the Devestator mainly because I made the suggestion for it before. If you'd rather have only the one unique weapon then it's no problem to me. I just figured you would appreciate the options, and I don't believe there is any limitation on '30k' weapon options on vehicles.

[simison]

In case the player only wants to move his tank 6', the fast rule still gives him an advantage as the tank can fire all three weapons.

 

Your logic makes sense. I haven't seen the Questoris battle cannon yet, so I was curious. 

 

The Gaja is a relatively light-weight in terms of defense and weight, so the plasma cannon is more of a threat against its survival. The Cyclone ML, it doesn't have AP3. No real strong arguments against them, just that the Predator Strike only has the 4 turret options, so I'm trying to condense the Gaja's options to an extent. Removing the three weapons, brings the number of dual weapons down to 5, which I think it's fine.

 

Only one question left, the accelerator canon, where did you come up with the stats for it? 

[Grifftofer]

The only Questoris Battle Cannon so far is in the Knights list, where it gets an extra shot in return for the lower strength. It makes sense to me though that if you don't increase the firing rate then the overall weight of the weapon could be reduced.

 

The Cyclone does have AP3. It's basically 2 missile launchers strapped together, so it has both Frag and Krak fire options.

 

I tried to use the Fellblade Accelerator as a base and then downgrade somewhat it in all areas. I also swapped the Armourbane for Sunder because I thought it would be a bit much to have two armourbane shots at a relatively high strength every turn per Gaja.

[simison]

Ah, that's right. Alright, the Cyclone stays. 

 

Read up on the battle cannon. The only change I'd like to do is make the range 36', half the range of the original. That should reduce the size and weight of the barrel to the point that the Gaja can run with it. 

 

Looked at the accelerator too. The only change I'd suggest is that the HE shells have large blast, instead of blast.

 

How does that sound?

[Grifftofer]

The only thing I would be concerned about is the Large Blast on the Accelerator Cannon HE round. As in effect you will be able to put down two large blast autocannons each turn or 2 AP2, Sunder Krak missiles should a vehicle target become available. That is a lot of firepower to put in one package.

[simison]

Alright. I can see that. I'll do a proper point check later.

[simison]

Going to game today, I'm considering another revision to the Legion Tactics. I feel like the Shield initiative bonus should be reserved for a RoW as that would be a better reflection overall since the Order of the Shield isn't synonymous with the entire legion. 

 

In which case, I'd drop that from the tactics, keep the no Go To Ground hindrance, but reduce the other hindrance from D3 VP loss to just 1 VP loss.

[bluntblade]

Finished these halycon wardens, just as promised:

Maybe the front shot should go on the thread's first post? Edited October 7, 2016 by bluntblade

[simison]

They should. 

 

Also, now that Malis will become an Insurgo, that opens up a character slot. I figured that this would be a good chance to slide in Vasilio, was it? 

[bluntblade]

Vasilios. I was after Greek names that weren't just from ancient Greece, as I'd used that so much for Scions' names, and ended up drawing on Byzantine Greek.

 

So he has his las-cannon. What are you thinking for his rules? Anti-personnel, or anti-vehicle?

[simison]

Vasilios. I was after Greek names that weren't just from ancient Greece, as I'd used that so much for Scions' names, and ended up drawing on Byzantine Greek.

 

So he has his las-cannon. What are you thinking for his rules? Anti-personnel, or anti-vehicle?

 

Let's see...

 

Irvin Ruel with his AP3 Reaper Claws, jump pack, and Child of Terra Warlord Trait is made to slice through space marines like no tomorrow, bounding across the battlefield.

 

Mahtva is supposed to be the pyromaniac burning the hordes of light infantry.

 

We really haven't come up with rules for Tannhauser yet, but he's supposed to represent the Prefects. So, a heavy tank commander who buffs other heavy tanks. 

 

So, I have anti-infantry, anti-light infantry, I need anti-elite and armour. Or I need army buffers. Maybe a spectrum from beatstick to buffmander. 

 

Beatstick - Mahtva - Irvin Ruel - Tannhauser - Vasilios - buffmander

 

Originally, Pyrrhicles was supposed to be the one who could give boosts to gunlines. I think that's where I'll place Vasilios. He'll have his unique lascannon, but his biggest purpose is the buffs he provides to the Wardens. 

[simison]

The warrior took another sip of the bubbly liquid as he pored over the dataslate in his hand. He ignored the the noises behind him, the chatter of soldiers and space marines and the cheers coming from the challenge course. He set the cup down as he studied the weapon schematics. After a moment, he switched to a different weapon and tried to pinpoint the differences. He felt someone approach.

 

"How goes your studying, Aadarsh?" 

 

Recognizing the voice, Aadarsh fought the instinct to stand up and come to a position of attention. Within the Acciptris' lodge, rank held no power here, only experience and wisdom. Even then, it was difficult not to show some physical sign of respect for the Master of the Lodge. Aadarsh pushed his seat away from the desk so he could turn himself toward Zahkar. He nodded towards the older Warden, "Chaplain, it goes well."

[simison]

Legion Tactics

 

• [Preeminent Defenders]: Models with the Legiones Astartes (Halcyon Warden) special rule, if caught by a Sweeping Advance, are not destroyed but remain locked in combat instead.
• Burden of the Warmaster's Own: Units with this special rule may not voluntarily Go To Ground. Furthermore, in any mission where secondary objectives are being used, and a Halcyon Warden army is your army's primary detachment, the opposing force gains +1 Victory Point if the Halcyon Warden army has suffered more units destroyed than the opposing force.

 

There's the revised legion tactics, but I'm struggling to come up with a good name for the benefit.

[simison]

I definitely want to evoke 'discipline' when it comes to rule. Both rules should emphasize the high standard the Wardens place upon themselves with the Warmaster elevation. Burden emphasizes the downside, but I think discipline can emphasize the upside. 

 

Maybe 'Paragons of Discipline'?

[Nomus Sardauk]

I have a few ideas regarding Captain Vasilios, mainly regarding the Stinger and what buffs he could bring to the army.

 

First up, if I recall correctly Vasilios is an artillery specialist, correct? Therefore, perhaps Vasilios bears a specially-made Signum-Nuncio Vox hybrid device that allows him to personally direct and co-ordinate artillery barrages so that any artillery piece in his force that fires on an enemy unit Vasilios has direct LOS to can half the distance the shot scatters.

 

Secondly, to represent the men under Vasilios' command being well-trained and equipped for his firepower-focussed modus operandii, why not have his grant any unit he joins the Relentless USR, specifically the idea being he can join, say, a squad of Devastators packing four Heavy Bolters and they can stroll across the battlefield raking down an Orkish horde or bring the hurt against the Traitor Legions with Autocannon barrages.

 

As for Vasilios' prized pew-pew provider, the Stinger, I was thinking maybe she could be an experimental design or a unique gift from, say, the Auretian Technocracy or someone technologically-inclined like that. Regardless I envision her having alternate firing modes (and I freely admit I'm ripping on the Eldar Fire Prism here but hey, if it works...) with a focused shot (standard anti-tank sniper beam) and a dispersed shot that, while weaker than the focused shot, has a small blast template as the beam hits a broader area, allowing Vasilios some flexibility when it comes to taking out different target types. Focused shot for sniping vehicles, monsterous creatures and lone characters, dispersed shot for blasting chunks out of squads.

 

Your thoughts brothers?