9th edition incoming

[C0deb1ue]

Suppressors won't stop a Riptide from firing overwatch.

They may stop a few Fire Warriors, but that isn't really the ideal target for Autocannons.

3 Suppressors have about 57% chance of killing a single Crisis Suit, so if he has no drones around, maybe you can stop their overwatch.

It feels like Suppressors are supposed to be the answer, but I don't think they are.

 

I also have difficulties with the T'au matchup. I'm not sure that'll change much in the new edition.

Suppressors don’t really cut it at all. They would probably be crazy overpowered if they just stopped Overwatch on hit but there must be a better way of doing it. Maybe inquisitors?

Edited June 26, 2020 by C0deb1ue

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I think, versus Tau, the vehicle charge will be a critical tactic for overwatch absorbing.

 

Fortunately though it's not as critical of a tactic for most other armies unless your target has overwatch worth CP for.

 

I am, on the whole, optimistic for our 9th edition close combat. I do wish they would hurry up and drop the edition though...

[GrFlur]

 

I think, versus Tau, the vehicle charge will be a critical tactic for overwatch absorbing.

 

Fortunately though it's not as critical of a tactic for most other armies unless your target has overwatch worth CP for.

 

I am, on the whole, optimistic for our 9th edition close combat. I do wish they would hurry up and drop the edition though...

I just want some point costs so I can decide what else to paint. I've been painting Murderfang and some wulfen but I'm not so sure i'll be taking Murderfang depending on the new point adjustments making everything more expensive. Wulfen will always win over Murderfang in terms of priority.

 

 

https://youtu.be/gIs-05zQdqg

[Karhedron]

I just want some point costs so I can decide what else to paint. I've been painting Murderfang and some wulfen but I'm not so sure i'll be taking Murderfang depending on the new point adjustments making everything more expensive. Wulfen will always win over Murderfang in terms of priority.

I think for many gamers the point size of games will simply increase to adjust for the change. For example, if you were used to playing 1750 point games, you will probably fit the same size of army into about 2000(ish) points.

 

Everything I have read leads me to suspect that 9th edition will see another increase in lethality. Blast weapons will get more shots, particularly vs hordes. Charges will be easier to pull off. Attrition from morale looks like it will increase slightly.

Edited June 26, 2020 by Karhedron

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

It might be the case that people go up with points but I kind of doubt it for a few reasons.

 

1) Tournaments have basically said they are sticking with 2000 pts.

 

2) GW intentionally resized everything in the game around 2k points to make the game a bit smaller. Increasing points to work around the intentional rebalance goes somewhat against the design philosophy of 9th.

 

3) a 2k point army will be cheaper financially to aquire, encouraging people to branch out and join up or rejoin the hobby.

 

And 4) 2k is a nice, round, number that people have been comfortable with for about 7-10 years and people like consistency when they can have it.

 

Of course your mileage may vary depending on your group, but I suspect the community at large will stick with 2k for regular game play.

[Valerian]

Assault Intercessors confirmed to be Troops, as I've been telling folks for the past month.

[Lord Blackwood]

That would certainly be interesting especially if they behave like our blood claws do on the table top. I have a feeling that they will be points competitive against intercessors for not having a bolt rifle. The real question now is if they will get Sargent options. If that happens then I can certainly see us using them. Dream situation is that they mirror blood claws rules and get sarge options while maintaining a points competitive status against intercessors. If that happens then running impulsors with them would be a no brainer for primaris focused wolf lists

[Lord Blackwood]

Amusingly enough If I give an intercessor sarge a melee weapon I just don't model em with a rifle so I cannot share your pain though I certainly can imagine it.

 

I personally think sargent models are a linchpin of making these guys worthwhile. If the best they have are chain swords then ill take the 3 auto bolt rifle shots over them unless they are criminally undercosted.

 

Having something in the unit that can hit hard feels really important to how we currently employ intercessors.

[TiguriusX]

The way we use intercessors reminds me of the imperial guard tank commander meme "drive me closer!"

 

Cawl: We upgraded the guns on these guys. All versions are better than the original bolters.

 

Wolf Lord: Yes yes that is very fine indeed...now help me send them in closer so we can hit the enemy in the face!

 

Cawl: ...

[Wolf Guard Dan]

 

Amusingly enough If I give an intercessor sarge a melee weapon I just don't model em with a rifle so I cannot share your pain though I certainly can imagine it.

I personally think sargent models are a linchpin of making these guys worthwhile. If the best they have are chain swords then ill take the 3 auto bolt rifle shots over them unless they are criminally undercosted.

Having something in the unit that can hit hard feels really important to how we currently employ intercessors.

Apparently the astartes chainswords available to assault intercessors will be -1AP

So thats 4 attacks on the charge hitting with -1AP, that's pretty useful to be fair.

I plan to run 4 intercessor squads (points permitting), i'll probably swap out 1 or 2 of those squads for an assault intercessor squad.

How are we going to beat White Scars? It’s something that I’ve been worrying about for a bit. And this is solidifying that concern.

[TiguriusX]

 

 

Amusingly enough If I give an intercessor sarge a melee weapon I just don't model em with a rifle so I cannot share your pain though I certainly can imagine it.

I personally think sargent models are a linchpin of making these guys worthwhile. If the best they have are chain swords then ill take the 3 auto bolt rifle shots over them unless they are criminally undercosted.

Having something in the unit that can hit hard feels really important to how we currently employ intercessors.

Apparently the astartes chainswords available to assault intercessors will be -1AP

So thats 4 attacks on the charge hitting with -1AP, that's pretty useful to be fair.

I plan to run 4 intercessor squads (points permitting), i'll probably swap out 1 or 2 of those squads for an assault intercessor squad.

How are we going to beat White Scars? It’s something that I’ve been worrying about for a bit. And this is solidifying that concern.

Armor of russ + 6" intervention (dont forget counter charge)...chooser of the slain...better shooting

[Valerian]

If Assault Intercessor pack leaders don’t get melee weapons upgrade options, they’ll be dead on arrival. Even AP-1 Chainswords won’t make them overcome regular Intercessors with a Thunder Hammer on the PL.

 

Kraigen, don’t sweat the fact that you’ve already put Hammers on your regular Intercessor PLs; I’ve been play testing with 2 Assault Intercessor Packs and 4 regular Intercessor Packs, with the PLs for all 6 Packs having Hammers for the past several weeks; they’re still worth having in all of those units.

[Valerian]

A little bit of information about Aircraft in the Dark Eldar faction focus. Basically, Aircraft can’t lock regular units in close combat, and vice versa. You can move out of the Engagement range without having to Fall Back.

 

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/26/faction-focus-drukharigw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-4/

[Bulwyf]

 

The Tau matchup is going to hinge on if they can ( still?) ignore cover with markerlights.

 

All the new terrain rules being erased would be problematic , in the same breath if that is not (still?) the case then using terrain and reserves effectively will probably be the way to go. Not only that but slamming impulsors into their lines to lock them up before charging in.

I hate tau with a passion. They have always been the least fun match up, with a list of cheese riptide and drone spam. I don't get how people can run those lists and not feel embarassed putting them on the table knowing it's going to be no fun for anybody.

 

I am soooooo happy about the fly keyword change. This really messes with riptides and drones.

 

 

This right here. I hate castle armies. Just sit back, relax, shoot everyone off the board, never move, grab objectives late in the game after shooting the other army off the table. Rinse, repeat. So utterly boring and just unfun to both play and play against.

[Valerian]

Well worth watching today’s FLG vid, from two of the Playtesters. After the admin time up front, the spend some time talking about Morale, but then transition to Melee. Since Space Wolves are melee-focused, you might pick up some early insight.

 

https://youtu.be/mxIN_cjSNSA

[C0deb1ue]

Well worth watching today’s FLG vid, from two of the Playtesters. After the admin time up front, the spend some time talking about Morale, but then transition to Melee. Since Space Wolves are melee-focused, you might pick up some early insight.

 

Seems interesting! Not sure it was particularly positive for CC orientated armies, Just that melee will be different.

 

They have made all the combat jank very hard to do but that was also making CC more viable.

 

Will be interesting to see if anything is done to balance the loss alongside clear buffs to ranged with Blast/heavy weapons/vehicles, and escape strats.

 

Plus mentioning how few characters armies tended to have was also a bit alarming and how they are now easy to assassinate. They did hint there was another major change coming...

Edited June 27, 2020 by C0deb1ue

[Gherrick]

With a guaranteed minimum of one model fleeing on a failed morale check, can we use the lone wolf strategem before the morale phase to avoid the check completely? It's been a bit, so I forget the timing.

[Valerian]

With a guaranteed minimum of one model fleeing on a failed morale check, can we use the lone wolf strategem before the morale phase to avoid the check completely? It's been a bit, so I forget the timing.

 

Yes and no.  You can use the Lone Wolf stratagem at the end of any phase.  However, I think I recall a FAQ that said the model still has to take the morale test when you hit the Morale phase, even if you've already made that last model a character, so they mentioned that you might want to wait until the end of the Morale phase before using the stratagem, so you don't waste it.

 

Here it is.  From the SW FAQ:

 

[C0deb1ue]

Looks like it’s going to cost minimum 2CP for a supreme command (if it still exists) as that was the new patrol cost And it won’t be cheaper.... maybe even 3.

 

Defo character tax but I guess Bjorn offsets that slightly as long as his New point cost isn’t prohibitive

[Maouw]

Ok, i have been a little bit lost with all those news (especially i still have to digest DG ones ><)

So, assaut intercessor are troops but, if i understand well, if the sergeant can't get a hammer, better take intercessor for close instead ?

Any update about how the reaver maybe be or no be back in 9th ?

Did we know anything new about the utility of bladesguards so far ?

[Valerian]

Ok, i have been a little bit lost with all those news (especially i still have to digest DG ones ><)

So, assaut intercessor are troops but, if i understand well, if the sergeant can't get a hammer, better take intercessor for close instead ?

Any update about how the reaver maybe be or no be back in 9th ?

Did we know anything new about the utility of bladesguards so far ?

1. Yeah, if the Assault Intercessor pack leader can’t take a Hammer then you’re probably better off sticking with tactical Intercessors, who can.

2. No news yet on Reivers yet, to see if they’ll be improved and worth taking. The only known factor in their favor is that we no longer need to spam 6 Troops units for CP, so their Elite slot is less of a big deal. They need more than just that, though.

3. Still waiting to learn if Bladeguard Vets get a bodyguard ability. As they are, they’ll still be decent, with 3++ Invulnerable saves and D2 weapons. But a bodyguard rule would elevate them from decent to must-have.

[Vassakov]

 

Ok, i have been a little bit lost with all those news (especially i still have to digest DG ones ><)

So, assaut intercessor are troops but, if i understand well, if the sergeant can't get a hammer, better take intercessor for close instead ?

Any update about how the reaver maybe be or no be back in 9th ?

Did we know anything new about the utility of bladesguards so far ?

1. Yeah, if the Assault Intercessor pack leader can’t take a Hammer then you’re probably better off sticking with tactical Intercessors, who can.

2. No news yet on Reivers yet, to see if they’ll be improved and worth taking. The only known factor in their favor is that we no longer need to spam 6 Troops units for CP, so their Elite slot is less of a big deal. They need more than just that, though.

3. Still waiting to learn if Bladeguard Vets get a bodyguard ability. As they are, they’ll still be decent, with 3++ Invulnerable saves and D2 weapons. But a bodyguard rule would elevate them from decent to must-have.

 

 

I'm currently working on the assumption that the initial round of datasheets for Assault Intercessors will be as they are in Indomitus, so the pack leader will just get a plasma pistol upgrade only. Then I'd expect a full multi-part kit in perhaps November or January (anticipating Necrons getting the first multi-part kit waves) which I would hope would be compatible with the existing Chapter upgrade sprues and therefore have the full complement of options.

 

This is pretty much the way GW has operated recently unfortunately. My current plan is to assemble 9 of them to ride in a Repulsor and set one aside to convert when we get the "full" unit.

 

More cautious on the Outriders. I'd love them to have weapon options but we'll have to see what GW's plan for them is.

[Gherrick]

 

With a guaranteed minimum of one model fleeing on a failed morale check, can we use the lone wolf strategem before the morale phase to avoid the check completely? It's been a bit, so I forget the timing.

 

Yes and no.  You can use the Lone Wolf stratagem at the end of any phase.  However, I think I recall a FAQ that said the model still has to take the morale test when you hit the Morale phase, even if you've already made that last model a character, so they mentioned that you might want to wait until the end of the Morale phase before using the stratagem, so you don't waste it.

 

Here it is.  From the SW FAQ:

 

 

To my knowledge, all characters are their own unit, so why would they make any morale checks, ever? If you convert the last model into a lone wolf (and thus a character), isn't it a new unit?

[Vassakov]

 

 

With a guaranteed minimum of one model fleeing on a failed morale check, can we use the lone wolf strategem before the morale phase to avoid the check completely? It's been a bit, so I forget the timing.

 

 

Yes and no.  You can use the Lone Wolf stratagem at the end of any phase.  However, I think I recall a FAQ that said the model still has to take the morale test when you hit the Morale phase, even if you've already made that last model a character, so they mentioned that you might want to wait until the end of the Morale phase before using the stratagem, so you don't waste it.

 

Here it is.  From the SW FAQ:

 

To my knowledge, all characters are their own unit, so why would they make any morale checks, ever? If you convert the last model into a lone wolf (and thus a character), isn't it a new unit?

It's not a new unit - it's the old unit and the last remaining model gets buffed by Lone Wolf. Unfortunately you do still have to take a morake check, so doing it at the end of the morale phase is best.

[Valerian]

I think there is supposed to be a 9th edition game with the Indomitus boxed set this next Saturday at 1:45 on Twitch. That’s local GW time (BST). We’ll probably learn a lot about the unit stats and abilities for the new Primaris units, as well as more 9e core rules changes, then.