9th edition incoming

[Triszin]

 

 

Looks like stormshields no longer give invuln save, only a +1 to armor save...

 

:(

They still give a 4+ invuln and add 1 to save

 

Though still a nerf!

So a storm shield terminator has a 1+/4++?

 

With any type of cover they get a 0+ base armor save? (Hello storm caller)

 

That is real nice. Unless you pound them with AP3/4 guns the new shield mechanic is better for them against AP1/2.

1 is always failure.

 

I think it means it makes ap-1 weapons ap 0?

[Valerian]

Yes, Terminators with Storm Shield will still get 2+ saves versus Bolt Rifles and Astartes Chainswords. If they’re in Light Cover, they’ll even still get a 2+ save versus a Bolt Rifle in the Tactical Doctrine (AP-2).

[TiguriusX]

Yes a terminator has 2+/5++ base

 

Aff a storm shield and it has 1+/4++

 

That means anything AP1 or less is passed on a 2+

 

Anything AP2 or less is passed on a 3+ (like old storm shield)

 

Find a way to add cover...drop base armor to 0+ (1s always fail)

 

Now AP2 or less is still a 2+ armor save

AP3 (plasma) is a 3+ armor save (same as having old storm shield)

 

Not a bad change....and I think comes out ahead because many D2 weapons had AP1 or 2

[Valerian]

Full leak: https://m.imgur.com/a/J4Bygoq

[Lord Blackwood]

Things I take away from this. 

Judicator can potentially be extremely good for us. 

Stormshield Nerf keeps non stormshield Wolf Lords Viable ( Sup Malik ) 

Plasma Pistols Overheat on  an unmodified 1 so they are safer 

Assault intercessors in my personal opinion dont beat out  standard ones. 

 

[Valerian]

 

Assault intercessors in my personal opinion dont beat out  standard ones. 

 

 

 

They'll probably get the expanded Sergeant/Pack Leader options later.  But for now, you're right.

[Dark Shepherd]

Crozius is S+2

Chaplain on bike with 7A on charge...damn

 

If our Bladeguard replace bladeguard with wolfguard...then the ancient is still duff. Worth stealing the banner for kitbashes though

[Valerian]

Full leak: https://m.imgur.com/a/J4Bygoq

 

1.  One big thing that we hadn't seen yet is that Wound rolls are also capped at max of +1/-1 modifiers (just like Hit rolls, that we already knew about).  

 

2.  Another slight change:  If a model in target unit (for either ranged or melee attack) has already lost any wounds, or has already had attacks allocated to it this phase, the attack must be allocated to that model.  In the past you had to allocate attacks to models in a unit that had already been wounded, but now you also have to keep allocating to a specific model, even if that model already made saves; it is a small change, but super easy to miss.

 

3.  Each model in the unit must finish its pile-in move closer to the closest enemy model (I believe this is a change from just the first model moved.  Now they all have to finish closer).  This could force you to move into Engagement range of a unit that you haven't Charged, too.  Same requirement for the Consolidate movement - each model has to finish its Consolidation move closer to the closest enemy.

 

4.  A model can fight if it is in Engagement Range of an enemy unit, or if it is within 1/2" of another model from their own unit that is within 1/2" of an enemy unit.

 

5. Whether from shooting or close combat, all attacks you have declared are always resolved against the target unit even if, when you come to resolve an individual attack, no models in the target unit remain in range.  In other words, you can't pull models in such a way as to keep part of an attacking unit that hasn't gone yet from getting their attacks.

 

6.  Big Change - you can now target models that performed a Heroic Intervention, even if you didn't declare a charge on them.  No more Characters getting to attack with no risk.

 

7.  Players alternate taking Morale tests for any units that have suffered casualties this turn.  Once all units have taken Morale tests, conduct Unit Coherency Checks.

 

8.  Objective Markers recommended to be 40mm in diameter, and you measure to and from the closest part of the marker (instead of from the center).  You're in range of an objective marker if you're within 3" horizontally and 5" vertically.

 

9.  Looks like no more Seize the Initiative.

 

10.  Battle fixed to 5 Battle Rounds (n more random chance to keep going).

 

11.  Limit of 3 Detachments for a Strike Force sized game (1001 to 2000 points).

 

12.  Vanguard, Spearhead, and Outrider detachments all cost 3 CP (same as a Battalion, before you get your Warlord Refund).

 

13.  Infantry, Beasts, and Swarm units can move through the walls, etc., of 'Breachable' terrain.

 

14.  Infantry, Beasts, and Swarm units receive the benefits of Cover from Area Terrain features (Ruins, Woods, Craters, etc.) while they are within it.

 

15.  Infantry, Beasts, and Swarm units receive the benefits of Cover from an Obstacle (Barricades, Ruined Walls, other Debris), while models are within 3" unless there is unobstructed LOS from attacking model.

 

16.  Exposed Position - models can gain benefit of Cover when behind a piece of Terrain with this trait, but not while on top of it (for example, those big Containers).

 

17.  Scalable - only  Infantry, Beasts, and Swarm models and models that can Fly can be set up or end a move on top of an a terrain feature with this trait, or on upper floors of Area Terrain with this trait.  Other models (such as Cavalry) can be set up or end their move on the ground floor only.

 

18.  Command Re-Roll limited to: Hit, Wound, Damage, Save, Advance, Charge, Psychic Test, Deny the Witch Test, or roll for number of Weapon attacks.  Can no longer be used to keep a Vehicle from Exploding, or Morale, etc.

 

 

Otherwise, so far, I haven't run into any changes that hadn't already been discussed or published by the Warhammer Community folks.  

[Hellrender]

Rules things aside.. how will you guys be adjusting the indomitus models to be more space wolfey?

 

Trying to decide if i will be painting them as the ultra's or space wolves (i want a pure primaris force)

[TiguriusX]

Crozius is S+2

Chaplain on bike with 7A on charge...damn

 

If our Bladeguard replace bladeguard with wolfguard...then the ancient is still duff. Worth stealing the banner for kitbashes though

A single biker chaplain from a custom white scar successor chapter will be an insane ally

 

Make 1 trait hungry for battle (+1 charge)

 

WL trait imperium sword (a+1 s+1 reroll any charge dice)

 

WS stratagem for 3d6 charge...combination with WL trait rerolling any dice you choose and +1 on charge is basically guaranteed charge after outflanking

 

Turn 2 chant yourself some canticle of hate (*edit mantra of strength sorry) and tear more stuff up

 

Mantra of strength is s+1 a+1 and d+1

 

You have a s8 2 damage biker chaplain with 9 attacks

Edited July 1, 2020 by TiguriusX

[Wolf Guard Dan]

@Hellrender, I actually don't know if I will be getting the starter set. Outside of the Assault intercessors and chaplain everything else that I would use may be better scratch built. I've got a ton of bits from SW pack boxes so I will continue to use that stuff. The Justicar's I may convert from scratch, maybe a Rune Priest in training throwing frost around to slow enemies. That would be cool.

 

@ Tigurius, White scars are going to be the hotness moving forward. All of their chapter traits work so well with the new edition and models. I am green with envy.

 

TWC may be cool again. 2+ armor with the shield and 4++. I think I actually prefer that that a 3++. Unsure though. A lot to process.

[Wolf Guard Dan]

Wulfen take a hit. Give them access to an Impulsor and I’m less mad. But I’m sure we won’t get that.

 

Tigurius you’re in charge of figuring out TDAWG and these combi plasma got a nerf that unmodified ones explode. Please tell us what to do. Are we just going to bring Lords for the reroll ones or are we switching the weapons???

[Valerian]

 

 

Another word on the grapevine is Stormshields have been nerfed to 4+ unfortunately!

Where did that one come from? That’ll really hurt a lot of builds. Also wouldn’t make sense for the new Primaris Captain with a Shield, as he already has a 4++ Invulnerable from his Iron Halo.

This is accurate

 

Stormshields are now a 4++ invuln and +1 to save.

 

Full rules are floating around on the Internet and datasheets for indomitus. I've seen photos of the data sheets and core rules on 4chan and can confirm they're 100% accurate.

 

Kinda bummed out about the stormshield change, my wulfen will probably drop down to one squad now unless Stormshields drop in pts.

Yes, we’ve learned a lot in the 9 hours since I posted that this morning. Check out my other post about 4 posts up from yours

[Karack Blackstone]

I personally think pre ed-drop TH / SS TDAWG are going to be good enough, just expensive to either deliver or if DS’ing, the PL Reserves needs are going to be iffy.

 

We need either a better LRC or just pack 8 TDA models into a Stormwolf.

 

Again, neither ride is that cheap yet, unless points change in our favor.

[The Saint Ragnar]

Wounds roll are capped to +1/-1 as well, seems like that meant all modifiers when they said modifiers.

[NightHowler]

I feel like that’s the nail in the coffin for TWC unless there is some huge hidden buff somewhere for them (I’m only holding out hope that they can swing at units on the second floor of ruins due to their height).

 

Also a huge hit to wulfen survivability with stormshield change.

 

So far i am less than excited.

 

Still hoping for some good news.

[TiguriusX]

Wulfen take a hit. Give them access to an Impulsor and I’m less mad. But I’m sure we won’t get that.

 

Tigurius you’re in charge of figuring out TDAWG and these combi plasma got a nerf that unmodified ones explode. Please tell us what to do. Are we just going to bring Lords for the reroll ones or are we switching the weapons???

Depends on how much risk you want. I say keep the plasma and rely on wolf lord rerolls to over charge hard critical targets

[Wolf Guard Dan]

Just saw on Facebook, we have to write down on our army lists our second and third relics if we so choose. So not tailoring for an opponent.

[Karhedron]

Overall, 9th edition is looking a little rough for us. Stormshield nerf hits Wulfen harder than other units due to their 4+ base save. The ability for all armies to put units in Reserve dilutes "On the Hunt". Other Chapters can now pull the trick that usred to be unique to the Armour of Russ (although I guess we can double-up on it). Changes to Detachments make it that little bit harder to pack in our tasty HQs.

 

The only positive so far is that the changes to aircraft might make the Stormwolf a more reliable delivery system for Wulfen but it depends on a lot of "ifs" at the moment.

[The Saint Ragnar]

Also, in movement they don't say infantry only can climb over obstacles higher than 1". So as long as the object doesn't have the scalable keyword TWC can cross it now as it just says models. So that could be a huge change as instead of having to go all the way around they can go up and over.

[Vassakov]

I'll apologise for the nerf to Wulfen via Stormshields. I knew it was a mistake to finally paint them during lockdown. 

[The Saint Ragnar]

The character slot is important, but I think I already see an easy way for us to fill out a Brigade. They changed the way understrength units work. You pay the PL for the minimum unit but only the points for what you have including wargear. So we can get 3-5 characters and then fill the roles we don't want to fill with understrength units point wise. I think this was a mistake on their end which will likely get an FAQ so I wouldn't plan a list around it but it exists right now

[Dark Shepherd]

I think brigades are a bad idea for us as theyre too much filler

 

We just have to spend on another detachment for more characters. Pretty easy to take 3 elites

[Karhedron]

I don't think Brigades are too hard for us. Cyberwolves give us FA slots for 15 points each. Elites are rarely hard for us to fill but 20-point squads of Servitors are a thing if you want to keep the points down. We are spoiled for choice with Heavy units. Eliminators and Eradicators look like they are going to be pretty cheap. We can fill our Elite, FA and Heavy requirements for under 400 points if we need to. 6 packs of MSU Primaris will be ~600 points in the new world order and we can cut that down if we wish using our Firstborn options. That means in a 2000 point game we can spend 1000 points on our Brigade minimums which leaves 1000 points to spend on HQs and beefing up our Elites into something scary.

[Valerian]

The character slot is important, but I think I already see an easy way for us to fill out a Brigade. They changed the way understrength units work. You pay the PL for the minimum unit but only the points for what you have including wargear. So we can get 3-5 characters and then fill the roles we don't want to fill with understrength units point wise. I think this was a mistake on their end which will likely get an FAQ so I wouldn't plan a list around it but it exists right now

 

Patrol, Battalion and Brigade cannot include Understrength units.