Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Well, I am back, barely moved in, and weeks behind schedule. Unfortunately this is the only guy I have been able to complete but since he is the test mini I hope that is acceptable. The Chapter Symbol is uneven because of the weird molding of the AoBR Marines. I hope its up too standard :unsure: . The army is being built as quickly as possible, but my hobby space hasn't been built yet so I can't work on them painting wise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839226 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Show us a front-on picture! :unsure: (EDIT: And a better picture of the Chapter badge!) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839228 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Show us a front-on picture! :unsure: (EDIT: And a better picture of the Chapter badge!) Side View Side View Front View Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839234 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 ok, looking at the timeline. Lycidius dies during the truth war dated after 701.m37. Then first captain Janos becomes the new chapter master in 205.m38 . So where did captain Janos come from? He became first captain after Lycidius, so was captain Janos the second company captain after Lycidius's promotion to first captain? If so, then Caphius became captain around 205.m38. Am i making sense? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839235 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Ah, nice. I wondered what was on his right knee. I couldn't see that it was a tactical badge, so I wondered if it was a crusade badge or the like. A nicely free-handed Company marking on his left knee, also. I also like the markings on his bolter. His eyes are very well done - I've never really been able to do those lenses to my satisfaction. Â How'd you do the red? What's next on your painting block now you're in Hawaii? Â A good job overall - I think you can improve the Chapter badge by focusing on the elbow first - I think that's probably the key. Then again, freehand's certainly never been my strong point! Â EDIT: Â Sorry, Varen - didn't catch you post before I posted. Â ok, looking at the timeline. Lycidius dies during the truth war dated after 701.m37. Then first captain Janos becomes the new chapter master in 205.m38 . So where did captain Janos come from? He became first captain after Lycidius, so was captain Janos the second company captain after Lycidius's promotion to first captain? If so, then Caphius became captain around 205.m38. Am i making sense? Â Don't rely on most of the timelines - they're very patchy. Â Thing with your suggestion is that it'd mean Caphius has been Captain from the year 37,205 to the year 40,999. That's almost four thousand years! Depending on your viewpoint Space Marines from the Ultramarines gene-seed top out somewhere between 400 and 600 years old. Then you can add warp dilation onto that and they can be around for a fair bit longer - though obviously the life of a Space Marine tends to entail a fair bit of risk! It's possible for Caphius to be 700 years old, say, but for his birthdate to have been 1000 years ago. Does that give you more of an insight into my thought processes? Â We know Caphius was passed over for First-Captain when Avitus died and Quntilius became Master in 899.M41 - that means Caphius has been Captain of the Second for at least 100 years. I'm imagining that Caphius could've been Captain for four centuries, perhaps even more. If he became Captain when he was 150, he could've been Captain for... over five centuries! It depends how drastic we want to be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839238 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I think your right the Elbow would begin a natural 'V' shape to work off of, thanks Mol that does help.  The Red is: -Chaos Black Base -Mechrite Red -1:1 Scab Red:Chaos Black shade in the recesses -2:1 Blood Red: Scab Red Highlight -Blood Red Highlight  Eyes: -Chaos Black -Regal Blue on the Front Half of the Lense in a Cresent Shape -Ultramarines Blues Highlight -Ice Blue Highlight -White Dot in the corners  I want to finish this Squad first, then I will begin work on the Terminators. As of Right Now for the Castigators it looks up like this -2nd Squad -Terminators -1st Squad -9th Squad -Dreadnaught -7th Squad -3rd Squad -Sirius  The Sirius conversion is Sicarius with the Dark Angels Company Champion Sword (sans teardrop) in his left hand, and the Master of the Watch's Storm Sheild in the right. His head will be the Chaos Lord smirking face with a GS mowhawk. On his shoulder he will have a disc with the Chapter Symbol where the 'U' was. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839252 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 The Sirius conversion sounds interesting! It's a shame he's down the far end of your production line. :( I look forward to seeing what you do with him. Truth be told, I look forward to seeing anything! :) Â EDIT: Â Here's the highest-res version of the Chapter Badge I've got: Â http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Castigators/castigatorbadge9yf-1.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839254 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Would you have any objections to having Caphius's first mission as 2nd company captain to search for Black Cousel survivors in 455.m41? The only problem is this would make him 544 years old as captain and not as a Castigator. But this would help mold his beliefs in purity and vigilance, with what he percieves as the down fall of the Black Cousels. Â I would like to make Caphius inbetween 400 to 600 years old. His detremination and purity-mindedness carrying him through to win the battle. That is why i chose 455.m41, to help develop his now developing responsibilities as a captain of the Castigators. We need a event that shakes the core values of Caphius to mold him to his current beliefs and the Black Consuls are the answer. Now the question is: Do you agree or Disagree? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839293 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 I'm curious as to how you think he views the Consuls. Nash Trickster made an interesting argument earlier in the thread that some of the most ardent zealots might even have made the argument that the Consuls were 'lax' and that they paid the price for it. (You can see that post here.) Such a viewpoint would likely only be shared in private conversation - it could cause a great deal of anger if it were openly voiced - but I'm just curious if you think Caphius is that extreme. My first opinion would be that he isn't - but I'd be interested in knowing what you think. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839300 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I have a Sicarius Model but I am not sure if the other Codex Marine Army I am going to build will be Ultramarines or not :) . If I come up with a good Codex Army that doesn't require Sicarius I will definitely Kit bash him into the above model. Once I get a Chaos Lord head of course... THis is a rough draft of what Sirius' back banner will look like. The White Castigator symbol within a dark cirlce, haloed by white light. Surrounded by a lighter blues that blend back into the the same dark blue as the circle. It is a direct translation of the Legio Astorum symbol, but with the imposed Castigator Heraldry. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839302 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I see Caphius viewing his parent chapter with a certain distain for their use of psykers, that the Castigator belief system is against. The Castigators belief that once all mutants/psykers are eradicated from their homeworld the Emperor would come back to them. I believe that is what you said. So, for the Black Consuls to use psykers would only push them away from the Emperor's light and go to the darkness. This would be Caphius's veiw, as i see it. Caphius's veiw would be right or wrong/ black and white, with no gray areas, no room for misunderstanding. This would how he would pick and train his men in his company, all having the same like-mindedness. Â "Vigilance and purity are the way to the Emperor's light, not the dark sorcerories of psykers, who share powers with the warp!" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839332 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 THis is a rough draft of what Sirius' back banner will look like. The White Castigator symbol within a dark cirlce, haloed by white light. Surrounded by a lighter blues that blend back into the the same dark blue as the circle. It is a direct translation of the Legio Astorum symbol, but with the imposed Castigator Heraldry.  Certainly interesting. The idea of the haloed sun is particularly interesting because the moon of Losanco is, of course, the Castigators' fortress-world and home of the 'furious angels' of Losancan myth. It works very well, actually!  I see Caphius viewing his parent chapter with a certain distain for their use of psykers, that the Castigator belief system is against. The Castigators belief that once all mutants/psykers are eradicated from their homeworld the Emperor would come back to them. I believe that is what you said. So, for the Black Consuls to use psykers would only push them away from the Emperor's light and go to the darkness. This would be Caphius's veiw, as i see it. Caphius's veiw would be right or wrong/ black and white, with no gray areas, no room for misunderstanding. This would how he would pick and train his men in his company, all having the same like-mindedness.  "Vigilance and purity are the way to the Emperor's light, not the dark sorcerories of psykers, who share powers with the warp!"  Interesting. So the younger Caphius was hardened by the sheer destruction that befell the Consuls. It interests me that he would likely harbour a somewhat similar opinion towards the Ultramarines, who suffered so badly at Macragge. He really is self-righteous! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Caphius was made Captain of the 2nd company in 455.m41 . His first mission was to search for Black Consul surviviors. This is when Caphius's started taking the Castigator belief system with zealotry. Â Caphius was enducted into the Castigators in 367.m41 . Caphius was elavated to full battle brother in 420.m41 . Was made captain of the 2nd company in 455.m41 . Caphius still serves as the 2nd company captain to this day. Â I know this exceeds my 600 years, but giving time differences within the warp i think it fits. What say you, brother? Does this meet your ideas for Caphius? Â I see Caphius as a hard as nails character that walks on a knife-edge of beliefs, with little room for differences in thought. This is why he picks the marines who are like-minded from the reserve companies to fill his ranks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839356 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Well, the 5th edition rulebook states that in 801, the Astronomican flickered, sending thousands of ships across the Imperium off-course. Perhaps we can have Caphius waylaid for a while. I have had ideas for a Castigator being 'becalmed' within the warp-squalls of the Howling Stars. It might figure into my calculations. Â I think Goddeth Hive would've had a severe impact on Caphius, but it's likely he had zealous tendencies beforehand. My only problem is that he was apparently a marine for only thirty years before becoming Captain... What I'd suggest is that you eliminate the 420.M41 date and just say he was inducted into the Chapter in 367.M41 before becoming a Captain on or around 455.M41 (A slightly more respectable 88 years). Ironically, that means he was a precocious and young Captain - just like Anteas, whom he gives a rough time! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 That works, maybe Caphius's sees Anteas as a mirrior reflection of himself or of what he could have been? Â We could have Caphius reflecting within a chapel, when he found himself looking at a staue of Lycidius and took it as a sign from the Emperor, before becoming captain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839377 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Which in itself raises another interesting issue - his obsession with Lycidius. I'd always assumed that Caphius formulated his obsession whilst he undertook his year's service in the Librarium. I'm not quite sure how he would've gotten the Hero's Mantle, though... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839383 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Well, the 5th edition rulebook states that in 801, the Astronomican flickered, sending thousands of ships across the Imperium off-course. Perhaps we can have Caphius waylaid for a while. I have had ideas for a Castigator being 'becalmed' within the warp-squalls of the Howling Stars. It might figure into my calculations. Â The Doldrums scene from Master and Commander comes to mind. Â ... What I'd suggest is that you eliminate the 420.M41 date and just say he was inducted into the Chapter in 367.M41 before becoming a Captain on or around 455.M41 (A slightly more respectable 88 years). Ironically, that means he was a precocious and young Captain - just like Anteas, whom he gives a rough time! Â Â As people often do when they see alot of themselves in someone younger ;) . Â Â Â Now that I have all of my resources (minus Codexes) I will try to resume work on the third company fluff. Specifcally Sirius' actions against the Tyranids. To start I have one question: Have we come up with a name for the Tyranid Menace in the Howling Stars? I was thinking Hive Fleet Ammit, the Egyptian personification of Divine Retribution. Or since I belive it was decided to be a Kraken Splinter, Hive Fleet Hydra impliing again multiple tendrils but instead of them being led by lesser creatures they are led by Hive Tyrants, again alluding to the fact the each of the Hydra's head was intelligent and independent. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrannicide Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Now that I have all of my resources (minus Codexes) I will try to resume work on the third company fluff. Specifcally Sirius' actions against the Tyranids. To start I have one question: Have we come up with a name for the Tyranid Menace in the Howling Stars? I was thinking Hive Fleet Ammit, the Egyptian personification of Divine Retribution. Or since I belive it was decided to be a Kraken Splinter, Hive Fleet Hydra impliing again multiple tendrils but instead of them being led by lesser creatures they are led by Hive Tyrants, again alluding to the fact the each of the Hydra's head was intelligent and independent. I especially like your second idea of naming the bulk of the Tyranid splinter fleet, though the name 'Hydra' seems a bit basic. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839427 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Is there another name thats more Latinized? I would go with something like that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839462 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrannicide Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I'm not too sure, I'd have to look into it further. That said I had an idea playing off of the Hydra route of the Hive fleet's name, that it is a tendril of the original fleet. We could always use the idea of Cerberus, the multi-headed dog which guarded the gates of Hades, to prevent those who crossed the river Styx from ever escaping. (Taken from Greek and Roman mythology) We could somehow replace the river Styx with a counterpart in the 40k galaxy. Perhaps the Castigators themselves and other defenders of the Howling Stars could be seen as a Cerberus-like figure, guarding the Imperium against the Tyranid menace and the hive mind. Â Therefore Imperial scholars have named the fleet 'Cerberus' in recognition of the hive fleet's identity and threat to the Imperium. The one thing I do like more about Hydra is that it seems to be a more vile and offensive creature, when compared to the three-headed watchdog. Either way it isn't too much of a problem. ^_^ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839478 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophets-of-Dread Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 eh mate that the symbol for starcrafts own sons of korhal can't you find a differen't symboleif you don't belive me fallow link http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Sons_of_Korhal Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839600 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luku Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Oddly enough, after 34 pages of replies, If he hadn't planned to use that symbol all along...he probably knows about that by now.... Â (And I'd change you're signature sharpish too...) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839780 Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother varen Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 After Caphius's first mission to search for survivors from the Black Consuls. He began to question the actions of his parent chapter and his homeworld beliefs. He went to the chapel to reflect and found himself standing before a statue of Lycidius. His reflection took him back to the time of his service with the Librarium. That his when his path and obsession with Lycidius started. He might have asked the chaplains for the Hero's Mantle and was told that he could only have it when Lycidius himself found Caphius worthy. So Caphius takes the 2nd on a crusade to prove his worthiness, while studying on info on Lycidius molding himself to try to become Lycidius's heir. Maybe taking the crusade along the path of worlds that Lycidius himself went. Â What do you think? Â Have you played any games with your gaming group lately? How have the 5th company faired in battle? I see that now you might want to map the Howling Stars? Â Darth and Marshal2, What about using the name of the mother of all monsters? I can't remember the name, but it was the creature that gave birth to all monsters that plagued mankind. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839951 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argon Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 This is one of the best IA's on the B&C, the only one that's better would have to be SCC's Brazen Claws. And they're a GW chapter, so they have SOME pre-established fluff. I really want my DIY renegades to reach this level. The Liber Traitoris is somewhat lacking. ^_^ Â You've also taught me this: Drawing Space Marines is one thing. Drawing them well is something entirely different. Did you draw Ancient Rhetoricus and the Chaplain or did somebody else? 'Cos if you did, they're both amazing ;) . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1839954 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrus Manus Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 You've also taught me this: Drawing Space Marines is one thing. Drawing them well is something entirely different. Did you draw Ancient Rhetoricus and the Chaplain or did somebody else? 'Cos if you did, they're both amazing I'm not sure who drew the Chaplain but I believe that Rhetoricus was drawn by Cpt. Tiberius. Â Darth and Marshal2, What about using the name of the mother of all monsters? I can't remember the name, but it was the creature that gave birth to all monsters that plagued mankind. Well according to Greek myth, it was the folly of a women named Pandora (who opened her box) that resulted in all the disease and hurt being set free on the world. So maybe Splinter Fleet Pandora (or a variation of it?) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/80277-the-castigators/page/33/#findComment-1840040 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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