The Castigators

[Tyrannicide]

Whew! This thread took off when I was away. So I'll start at the top of the questions and work my way down.

 

Would Sirius hold/push his unit to higher standards than the rest of his Chapter? Would the Third Company have a higher proportion of older suits of armor (an excuse to use the Forge World Mark IV's)? I like the Third Company a great deal, but I cant think of how I could represent him in the rules. Just some of the positives and negatives I have been thinking that would justify using one character or the other.

 

Would this be an adequate representation of the 3rd Company Captain? It sounds like they like plasma weaponry so I thought I couldn't go far wrong with a plasma pistol. Are Digital Weapons AND an Auxillary Grenade Launcher too much, should I use one or the other? Please tell me how you envisioned Captain Sirius.

 

You ask a lot of questions, don't you Marshal? I like you already. :)

 

Now I do think Sirius would push the Marines under his command far beyond the standard limits as any good Space Marine Captain would, though I envision the Captain becoming more lackadaisical than his peers in recent years. As Mol said, I wouldn't picture the third Company having an overabundance of older power armor, but certainly equipped for any role. As far as the good Captain's wargear, Sirius wields the sword Lux Videbis, a blade crafted by the Chapter's Techmarines many years before. I haven't decided what firearm Sirius takes into battle, though I was considering a combi-flamer with hellfire rounds.

 

I would be interested to see what you and Darth Potato think Captain Sirius' response to fighting alongside Templars would be.

 

On the Company banner what does the Starburst look like?

 

I really don't have too much control over who the Castigators fight alongside with, but I wouldn't be opposed to the Castigators fighting in conjunction with the Black Templars, it's just a matter of reason. Why exactly would they be present, and why wouldn't the Templars be able to commit enough strength into the campaign in the first place? Sirius's starburst is interesting, I don't have the slightest idea of how it looks though I was thinking something similar to this.

 

 

If you have any further questions, I will gladly throw in my own opinion. :)

[Marshal Rohr]

You ask a lot of questions, don't you Marshal? I like you already. :)

 

Now I do think Sirius would push the Marines under his command far beyond the standard limits as any good Space Marine Captain would, though I envision the Captain becoming more lackadaisical than his peers in recent years. As Mol said, I wouldn't picture the third Company having an overabundance of older power armor, but certainly equipped for any role. As far as the good Captain's wargear, Sirius wields the sword Lux Videbis, a blade crafted by the Chapter's Techmarines many years before. I haven't decided what firearm Sirius takes into battle, though I was considering a combi-flamer with hellfire rounds.

 

I can smell the burning Xenos already :). Is there any particular history behind the Combo-Flamer with Hellfire rounds? Was Sirius attached to the Deathwatch at any point? Is Lux Videbis a large two-hander or a smaller single handed sword? Or perhaps is it gladius like?

 

I really don't have too much control over who the Castigators fight alongside with, but I wouldn't be opposed to the Castigators fighting in conjunction with the Black Templars, it's just a matter of reason. Why exactly would they be present, and why wouldn't the Templars be able to commit enough strength into the campaign in the first place? Sirius's starburst is interesting, I don't have the slightest idea of how it looks though I was thinking something similar to this.

 

 

If you have any further questions, I will gladly throw in my own opinion. :)

 

I wasnt talking about any specific campaign, but something more akin to did they fight on Armageddon and so on.

 

The Starburst looks cool, I will definitly give that one a shot when the Command Squad gets here.

 

About Castigators appearances: do they wear cloaks, tabards, loinclothes, and such? For each individual brother would he be allowed to adorn his armor with script and text? Do they Castigators artifice their weapons with gold and silver?

[Tyrannicide]

I can smell the burning Xenos already :). Is there any particular history behind the Combo-Flamer with Hellfire rounds? Was Sirius attached to the Deathwatch at any point? Is Lux Videbis a large two-hander or a smaller single handed sword? Or perhaps is it gladius like?

 

About Castigators appearances: do they wear cloaks, tabards, loinclothes, and such? For each individual brother would he be allowed to adorn his armor with script and text? Do they Castigators artifice their weapons with gold and silver?

 

I hadn't thought of any reason behind the combi-weapon, though it seems very Castigator to choose a flamer weapon from the armory. I hadn't planned for Sirius to be attached to the Deathwatch at any time, no. I will be using this sword to represent Lux Videbis, and the title of the blade will be painted on the sides in some particular fashion.

 

I see the Castigators adorning themselves in a very baroque way, though silver and gold casted bolters seem over the top. I see each Battle-Brother being allowed the freedom to paint proper scriptures and litanies on their armor, though not as fanatically as the Pre-Heresy era Word Bearers.

[Marshal Rohr]

I can smell the burning Xenos already :). Is there any particular history behind the Combo-Flamer with Hellfire rounds? Was Sirius attached to the Deathwatch at any point? Is Lux Videbis a large two-hander or a smaller single handed sword? Or perhaps is it gladius like?

 

About Castigators appearances: do they wear cloaks, tabards, loinclothes, and such? For each individual brother would he be allowed to adorn his armor with script and text? Do they Castigators artifice their weapons with gold and silver?

 

I hadn't thought of any reason behind the combi-weapon, though it seems very Castigator to choose a flamer weapon from the armory. I hadn't planned for Sirius to be attached to the Deathwatch at any time, no. I will be using this sword to represent Lux Videbis, and the title of the blade will be painted on the sides in some particular fashion.

 

I see the Castigators adorning themselves in a very baroque way, though silver and gold casted bolters seem over the top. I see each Battle-Brother being allowed the freedom to paint proper scriptures and litanies on their armor, though not as fanatically as the Pre-Heresy era Word Bearers.

 

So something along the lines of the scripture and litanies on the Ultramarines models then.

 

What type of armor does Sirius wear? Is it heavily ornamented? Does he use skulls as any kind of honor badge? What does Sirius look like?

[Tyrannicide]

What type of armor does Sirius wear? Is it heavily ornamented? Does he use skulls as any kind of honor badge? What does Sirius look like?

 

I plan on using this model as a base for Sirius, but with a different head. I'm not certain on what head exactly but it will be a different one.

[Marshal Rohr]

Good Choice, I used that model for my Templars Apothecary. Do the Castigatoes have any Imperial Rivals? Like the Hereticus has it out for the Templars and Flesh Tearers, the Malleus has it in for the Relictors.

[Commissar Molotov]

I wasnt talking about any specific campaign, but something more akin to did they fight on Armageddon and so on.

 

The Starburst looks cool, I will definitly give that one a shot when the Command Squad gets here.

 

About Castigators appearances: do they wear cloaks, tabards, loinclothes, and such? For each individual brother would he be allowed to adorn his armor with script and text? Do they Castigators artifice their weapons with gold and silver?

 

The Castigators weren't at Armageddon. Armageddon's in the Segmentum Solar - too far away for the Castigators to send forces! Especially not with their commitment to the Hell Stars and the surrounding areas. Equally, the Castigators did not participate in the Thirteenth Black Crusade, though I like to think a squad of Castigators formed part of the Ultramarines Honour Company that boarded Abaddon's Planet Killer.

 

They also weren't at Medusa V (before you ask :D) - I think it's ridiculous that GW shoehorned so many races and so many Chapters into one insignificant campaign.

 

The Castigators do indeed wear cloaks, tabards, loincloths and the like. They're comparable to the Ultramarines, though I've tried to make the Castigators 'darker' and more gothic. For example, whilst the Ultramarines have the laurel wreath, the Castigators have the wreath of thorns. I would think that gold and silver would likely be reserved for Master-Crafted weaponry and the like.

 

Good Choice, I used that model for my Templars Apothecary. Do the Castigatoes have any Imperial Rivals? Like the Hereticus has it out for the Templars and Flesh Tearers, the Malleus has it in for the Relictors.

 

I've not worked especially hard on giving them rivals within the Imperium. Certainly they've attracted the ire of a number of more libertarian (I don't want to say 'radical') Inquisitors - the Castigators have a lot of good will with the more puritan elements of the Inquisition, which have allowed them to weather many storms. The Castigators' intolerance towards mutation and heresy have in the past tended towards frosty relationships with the Navis Nobilite, Adeptus Astra Telepathica and the Adeptus Mechanicus. It's one of the duties of the Chapter Master to try to maintain those ancient ties, because without the Navigators, Astropaths and Techmarines, the Chapter would cease to function. It's one of the great ironies that the Castigators depend on mutants to function! ;)

[brother varen]

sorry for being away, but life has thrown a wrench into my plans. I've nearly lost everything i have due to hurricane Fay due to major flooding. I apologize for my absence in the 2nd company development.

 

The 2nd company will come but slowly i fear. I've already have the following:

 

Command squad (5)

Tactical squad (10) x 4

Assualt squad (5)

Devastator squad (5)

Scout squad (5) x 2

 

Ravenwing box set

Dark Angels Veteran box set (5) x 2

Dark Angels bikers x 9

Black Templar upgrade spruces x 3

 

All of this is still unbuilt due to me fixing my house. but it will be done. Do you see anything else to add, Mol? My plan is for a whole company. I have been thinking for gettting Forgeworld Red Scorpion products to include, when the funds are there. In your eyes Mol, what would the 2nd company ratio of armour marks be? (Mk 4, Mk 6, Mk 7, and Mk 8?)

 

I have been waiting to get the new space marine codex before trying to assemble the minis.

[Marshal Rohr]

They also weren't at Medusa V (before you ask ;)) - I think it's ridiculous that GW shoehorned so many races and so many Chapters into one insignificant campaign.

 

Dont worry, I hated that campaign so much that I stopped after one battle. I dont know of a single week when the Marines wern''t dominating. But that is neither here nor there.

 

The Castigators do indeed wear cloaks, tabards, loincloths and the like. They're comparable to the Ultramarines, though I've tried to make the Castigators 'darker' and more gothic. For example, whilst the Ultramarines have the laurel wreath, the Castigators have the wreath of thorns. I would think that gold and silver would likely be reserved for Master-Crafted weaponry and the like.

 

Ok Im beginning to form a mental picture. So going with a darker theme would the Red Scorpions Dreadnaught from Forge wOrld be an appropriately styled Venerable Dreadnaught? With the Scorpions filed off of course.

Do the Castigatoes have any Imperial Rivals? Like the Hereticus has it

 

.... out for the Templars and Flesh Tearers, the Malleus has it in for the Relictors.

 

I've not worked especially hard on giving them rivals within the Imperium. Certainly they've attracted the ire of a number of more libertarian (I don't want to say 'radical') Inquisitors - the Castigators have a lot of good will with the more puritan elements of the Inquisition, which have allowed them to weather many storms. The Castigators' intolerance towards mutation and heresy have in the past tended towards frosty relationships with the Navis Nobilite, Adeptus Astra Telepathica and the Adeptus Mechanicus. It's one of the duties of the Chapter Master to try to maintain those ancient ties, because without the Navigators, Astropaths and Techmarines, the Chapter would cease to function. It's one of the great ironies that the Castigators depend on mutants to function! ;)

 

 

The irony is funny. I should have a test model done by tomorrow. It wont be converted or anything, its the Mark II Veteran with Bolter. If I can get my Camera to work I will take some Pictures and post them.

[Ferrus Manus]

I've nearly lost everything i have due to hurricane Fay due to major flooding. I apologize for my absence in the 2nd company development.

Sorry to hear that, mate real can be a bitch sometimes.

what would the 2nd company ratio of armour marks be? (Mk 4, Mk 6, Mk 7, and Mk 8?)

Ok, the question isn't directed at me but i'll try and answer it. To be honest I would think that MK 7 would be the main armour used, its new. Then the Mk8 are generally reserved for officers but some chapter enshew (sp?) its use. Then you could have the occassional older mark. But like I said Mk7 would be the main type used.

So going with a darker theme would the Red Scorpions Dreadnaught from Forge wOrld be an appropriately styled Venerable Dreadnaught? With the Scorpions filed off of course.

Funny you should mention that particular model. I myself considered the same idea the other day when I saw it.

The irony is funny. I should have a test model done by tomorrow. It wont be converted or anything, its the Mark II Veteran with Bolter. If I can get my Camera to work I will take some Pictures and post them.

Looking forward to seeing them.

[Nash Trickster]

Been in no-internet-land for a week so I'll have to make a little "flashback"...

The Consuls and the Castigators have (or I should say 'had', now...) a good relationship with each other. The Consuls were depicted as being 'zealous', even if that zealotry was channeled towads the Codex Astartes. Baraquiel was simply particularly pious and zealous.

Since Baraquiel was particularly so for a Black Consul, and since I can't help but imagine the Zealots among the Castigators going even further in their zealotry than Baraquiel would have, it seems to me that the Zealots, regardless of the good relations between the 2 chapters, would consider the Consuls to be (a bit) "lax".

 

Hence my point still stands: the different factions among the Castigators would take the "death" of the Consuls differently. The Moderates would genuinely mourn their fallen brethren, probably petitionning the Chapter Master for a retaliative action of some kind, while the Zealots would, when in "chosen" company, say that the Consuls' demise was of their own making, that their laxity was probably the cause of their destruction...

 

Of course that's yet another thing that would not have a place in the IA itself, but could be interesting to explore in the more "in depth" articles on the Castigators' website. I really think the Zealots/Moderates dicothomy is an interesting aspect of the chapter and that it would bring a lot to dwelve upon this a little more. For example, showing how the 2 factions interpret differently the same events, and how they come to common grounds about some others, while for very different reasons.

[Marshal Rohr]

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

[Heru]

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

The Moderates are a sword, the Zealots a Hammer.

[Heru]

Sirius's starburst is interesting, I don't have the slightest idea of how it looks though I was thinking something similar to this.

Or this:

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

Seeing as it promotes the raging power of a sun rather than a distant star.

[Marshal Rohr]

Hmmm.... Darth Potato does that look cool to you? I looks like the Thousand sons symbol and on a red field it may draw some looks, but i think if it is done in the gold that Heru suggests then it would be very striking!

[Commissar Molotov]

Also on the topic of Caphius not being a Captain around the time of the Siege of Goddeth, maybe he was a newly inducted scout...

 

I like that idea. If the dates line up, I'll likely consider that. Of course, Goddeth Hive was 540 years ago, but with warp dilation it's potentially possible he could've served for that length of time.

 

 

sorry for being away, but life has thrown a wrench into my plans. I've nearly lost everything i have due to hurricane Fay due to major flooding. I apologize for my absence in the 2nd company development.

 

The 2nd company will come but slowly i fear. I've already have the following:

 

Command squad (5)

Tactical squad (10) x 4

Assualt squad (5)

Devastator squad (5)

Scout squad (5) x 2

 

Ravenwing box set

Dark Angels Veteran box set (5) x 2

Dark Angels bikers x 9

Black Templar upgrade spruces x 3

 

All of this is still unbuilt due to me fixing my house. but it will be done. Do you see anything else to add, Mol? My plan is for a whole company. I have been thinking for gettting Forgeworld Red Scorpion products to include, when the funds are there. In your eyes Mol, what would the 2nd company ratio of armour marks be? (Mk 4, Mk 6, Mk 7, and Mk 8?)

 

I have been waiting to get the new space marine codex before trying to assemble the minis.

 

Nice to hear from you once more, Varen. And I'm very sorry to hear about the hurricane. Hope that all is well. If you've seen the Assault on Black Reach boxed set, I think it's perfect for making Caphius. It's going to be the basis for my Caphius conversion. It's almost identical to Seer Brun's drawing.

 

I don't think you can go wrong including some MkIV armour (it's certainly very nice) but I think Ferrus is right when he says that MkVII would be the predominant armour type. Of course, most Space Marines will not wear a full suit of one particular type - they might have a MkIII helmet with a MkV breastplate, for example. So don't worry too much. I certainly don't with my Castigators! ;)

 

Ok Im beginning to form a mental picture. So going with a darker theme would the Red Scorpions Dreadnaught from Forge wOrld be an appropriately styled Venerable Dreadnaught? With the Scorpions filed off of course.

 

I don't see why not; I've certainly considered it for myself! I like the vaulted, cathedralesque front. Though I think the Scorpions would be a pig to get off neatly.

 

I should have a test model done by tomorrow. It wont be converted or anything, its the Mark II Veteran with Bolter. If I can get my Camera to work I will take some Pictures and post them.

 

Looking forward to it!

 

 

 

Since Baraquiel was particularly so for a Black Consul, and since I can't help but imagine the Zealots among the Castigators going even further in their zealotry than Baraquiel would have, it seems to me that the Zealots, regardless of the good relations between the 2 chapters, would consider the Consuls to be (a bit) "lax".

 

Hence my point still stands: the different factions among the Castigators would take the "death" of the Consuls differently. The Moderates would genuinely mourn their fallen brethren, probably petitionning the Chapter Master for a retaliative action of some kind, while the Zealots would, when in "chosen" company, say that the Consuls' demise was of their own making, that their laxity was probably the cause of their destruction...

 

Of course that's yet another thing that would not have a place in the IA itself, but could be interesting to explore in the more "in depth" articles on the Castigators' website. I really think the Zealots/Moderates dicothomy is an interesting aspect of the chapter and that it would bring a lot to dwelve upon this a little more. For example, showing how the 2 factions interpret differently the same events, and how they come to common grounds about some others, while for very different reasons.

 

Flashbacks always welcome, Nash! You know I value your insights. I liked the sentence about "... when in 'chosen' Company" expressing their darkest sentiments. It's certainly something to consider. I'm definitely going to have to think about it. I do like that idea that some in the Chapter might be a little discontent, might point towards the end of the millennium as a time where only the 'pure' can be saved by the Emperor.

 

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

 

It's a little difficult to explain. I'll see if I can work up something that defines the difference. In a way, it's like Christianity - there are many sub-sects, and whilst there are some people who might subscribe to a particular doctrine, say Methodism or the like, there are others who are harder to categorise. In that sense, it's difficult to point to Castigators and say "zealot" or "moderate". They're abstract labels that broadly group the Castigators, and the vast bulk of the Castigators would never say "I am a zealot" or "I am a moderate." If anything, they would be terms of derision. "He's such a zealot" or "He's too moderate."

 

In general, the 'zealots' are those that take the beliefs of the Castigators to extremes - they would advocate wiping out the Navigators, the Astropaths, refusing to work alongside other Chapters whom they believe are 'mutated', refusing to work alongside abhumans. People for whom genetic purity means a great deal. The moderates aren't fluffy bunny huggy people - they hate many of the things the zealots do, but they tolerate them. They might believe that the Emperor has a plan for the Castigators, and in order to fulfil that plan, they have to work alongside the Navigators, etc - people for whom the Emperor also has a plan. I don't quite think I'm explaining it. I did detai it earlier in the thread - I'll see if I can dig up specific posts for you to read.

 

 

 

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

 

Is that from Magic?

[Hasoroth]

It would be indeed sir! I'll send you some opinions on the recent going ons through MSN.

[Marshal Rohr]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

[Commissar Molotov]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

 

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

[Ferrus Manus]

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

Afraid so, check the link you'll find a 'Hell Stars of the Caron Nebula' which isn't quite the same, just depends on how similar you mind the names being. But to be honest, I'd be more worried about the Hive Fleet than the Ork presence.

link

[Commissar Molotov]

I refuse to ever pay attention to that map, I'm afraid. It's not even oriented properly - the Segmentum Pacificus should be in the west, and the Eastern fringes should be... east. I'm always going to stick with this. I'm after canon references where possible, in order to know if we're safe or not.

 

EDIT: I found this reference in UKWD303:

 

Every world in the Imperium is home to a culture unique to itself, and the people of each world worship the Emperor in a manner informed by its own characteristics. For the Helio-Cultists of Limnus Epsilon, for example, the Emperor resides in their sun, his warriors coming every century to claim the best of the world's youth to fight at his side within the fiery heart of their star. To the Apocalites of the worlds bordering the Hell-Stars of the Garon Nebula, he is the bringer of merciful death, deliverance from the evil that stalks their worlds by night.

 

And apparently in Codex: Black Templars, it apparently mentions that the Garon Crusade had 132 Battle-Brothers. The internet says the Crusade was "ill-fated", but doesn't say why.

Edited September 15, 2008 by Commissar Molotov

[Ferrus Manus]

Found the reference:

One such crusade was led by Castellan Raimer, master of the strike cruiser Ophidium Gulf, and survivor of the ill-fated Garon crusade.

 

EDIT: and this :

"I saw the scene of massacre where the dead lay on the ground like fallen leaves in a forest. The settlers had not died as soldiers in the heat of battle, fired with adour and courage, with weapons in their hands and exchanging blow for blow. Theyhad died as helpless must, with their hearts filled with horror worse than death." - Excerpted from Inquisitor Barzano's investigation into the Garon Nebula Crusade

Now the word 'settlers' suggest to me that the Templars were purging worlds for them to be settled but something counter attacked and wiped them out. Maybe.

Edited September 15, 2008 by Ferrus Manus

[Heru]

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

 

Is that from Magic?

Aye I was doing the Magic "What colour are you test" and I noticed the symbol (seeing as I got the White result), and instantly thought about the starburst you keep going on about for one of your Captains who uses imagery of the sun.

 

 

 

I refuse to ever pay attention to that map, I'm afraid. It's not even oriented properly - the Segmentum Pacificus should be in the west, and the Eastern fringes should be... east.

They are look at the compass!

Edited September 15, 2008 by Heru Talon

[Commissar Molotov]

Yes, but I'm old-fashioned. I like my north to face north. ;)

[Marshal Rohr]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

 

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

 

 

 

The Garon Nebula is a region in the Segmentum Tempestus, close to the Ork empire of Octavius and the advance path of Hive Fleet Leviathan.

 

In the back of the Black Templars Codex there is a reference to the Garon Crusade which leads into the Garon Nebula.

 

The Hell Stars are a group of closely packed Stars in the Garon Nebula. The Garon Nebula resides close to two Ork Home Worlds, V'Run and Jurn.

I found this in Lexicanum, 40k wiki, and other sites.