The Castigators

[Ferrus Manus]

I've nearly lost everything i have due to hurricane Fay due to major flooding. I apologize for my absence in the 2nd company development.

Sorry to hear that, mate real can be a bitch sometimes.

what would the 2nd company ratio of armour marks be? (Mk 4, Mk 6, Mk 7, and Mk 8?)

Ok, the question isn't directed at me but i'll try and answer it. To be honest I would think that MK 7 would be the main armour used, its new. Then the Mk8 are generally reserved for officers but some chapter enshew (sp?) its use. Then you could have the occassional older mark. But like I said Mk7 would be the main type used.

So going with a darker theme would the Red Scorpions Dreadnaught from Forge wOrld be an appropriately styled Venerable Dreadnaught? With the Scorpions filed off of course.

Funny you should mention that particular model. I myself considered the same idea the other day when I saw it.

The irony is funny. I should have a test model done by tomorrow. It wont be converted or anything, its the Mark II Veteran with Bolter. If I can get my Camera to work I will take some Pictures and post them.

Looking forward to seeing them.

[Nash Trickster]

Been in no-internet-land for a week so I'll have to make a little "flashback"...

The Consuls and the Castigators have (or I should say 'had', now...) a good relationship with each other. The Consuls were depicted as being 'zealous', even if that zealotry was channeled towads the Codex Astartes. Baraquiel was simply particularly pious and zealous.

Since Baraquiel was particularly so for a Black Consul, and since I can't help but imagine the Zealots among the Castigators going even further in their zealotry than Baraquiel would have, it seems to me that the Zealots, regardless of the good relations between the 2 chapters, would consider the Consuls to be (a bit) "lax".

 

Hence my point still stands: the different factions among the Castigators would take the "death" of the Consuls differently. The Moderates would genuinely mourn their fallen brethren, probably petitionning the Chapter Master for a retaliative action of some kind, while the Zealots would, when in "chosen" company, say that the Consuls' demise was of their own making, that their laxity was probably the cause of their destruction...

 

Of course that's yet another thing that would not have a place in the IA itself, but could be interesting to explore in the more "in depth" articles on the Castigators' website. I really think the Zealots/Moderates dicothomy is an interesting aspect of the chapter and that it would bring a lot to dwelve upon this a little more. For example, showing how the 2 factions interpret differently the same events, and how they come to common grounds about some others, while for very different reasons.

[Marshal Rohr]

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

[Heru]

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

The Moderates are a sword, the Zealots a Hammer.

[Heru]

Sirius's starburst is interesting, I don't have the slightest idea of how it looks though I was thinking something similar to this.

Or this:

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

Seeing as it promotes the raging power of a sun rather than a distant star.

[Marshal Rohr]

Hmmm.... Darth Potato does that look cool to you? I looks like the Thousand sons symbol and on a red field it may draw some looks, but i think if it is done in the gold that Heru suggests then it would be very striking!

[Commissar Molotov]

Also on the topic of Caphius not being a Captain around the time of the Siege of Goddeth, maybe he was a newly inducted scout...

 

I like that idea. If the dates line up, I'll likely consider that. Of course, Goddeth Hive was 540 years ago, but with warp dilation it's potentially possible he could've served for that length of time.

 

 

sorry for being away, but life has thrown a wrench into my plans. I've nearly lost everything i have due to hurricane Fay due to major flooding. I apologize for my absence in the 2nd company development.

 

The 2nd company will come but slowly i fear. I've already have the following:

 

Command squad (5)

Tactical squad (10) x 4

Assualt squad (5)

Devastator squad (5)

Scout squad (5) x 2

 

Ravenwing box set

Dark Angels Veteran box set (5) x 2

Dark Angels bikers x 9

Black Templar upgrade spruces x 3

 

All of this is still unbuilt due to me fixing my house. but it will be done. Do you see anything else to add, Mol? My plan is for a whole company. I have been thinking for gettting Forgeworld Red Scorpion products to include, when the funds are there. In your eyes Mol, what would the 2nd company ratio of armour marks be? (Mk 4, Mk 6, Mk 7, and Mk 8?)

 

I have been waiting to get the new space marine codex before trying to assemble the minis.

 

Nice to hear from you once more, Varen. And I'm very sorry to hear about the hurricane. Hope that all is well. If you've seen the Assault on Black Reach boxed set, I think it's perfect for making Caphius. It's going to be the basis for my Caphius conversion. It's almost identical to Seer Brun's drawing.

 

I don't think you can go wrong including some MkIV armour (it's certainly very nice) but I think Ferrus is right when he says that MkVII would be the predominant armour type. Of course, most Space Marines will not wear a full suit of one particular type - they might have a MkIII helmet with a MkV breastplate, for example. So don't worry too much. I certainly don't with my Castigators! ;)

 

Ok Im beginning to form a mental picture. So going with a darker theme would the Red Scorpions Dreadnaught from Forge wOrld be an appropriately styled Venerable Dreadnaught? With the Scorpions filed off of course.

 

I don't see why not; I've certainly considered it for myself! I like the vaulted, cathedralesque front. Though I think the Scorpions would be a pig to get off neatly.

 

I should have a test model done by tomorrow. It wont be converted or anything, its the Mark II Veteran with Bolter. If I can get my Camera to work I will take some Pictures and post them.

 

Looking forward to it!

 

 

 

Since Baraquiel was particularly so for a Black Consul, and since I can't help but imagine the Zealots among the Castigators going even further in their zealotry than Baraquiel would have, it seems to me that the Zealots, regardless of the good relations between the 2 chapters, would consider the Consuls to be (a bit) "lax".

 

Hence my point still stands: the different factions among the Castigators would take the "death" of the Consuls differently. The Moderates would genuinely mourn their fallen brethren, probably petitionning the Chapter Master for a retaliative action of some kind, while the Zealots would, when in "chosen" company, say that the Consuls' demise was of their own making, that their laxity was probably the cause of their destruction...

 

Of course that's yet another thing that would not have a place in the IA itself, but could be interesting to explore in the more "in depth" articles on the Castigators' website. I really think the Zealots/Moderates dicothomy is an interesting aspect of the chapter and that it would bring a lot to dwelve upon this a little more. For example, showing how the 2 factions interpret differently the same events, and how they come to common grounds about some others, while for very different reasons.

 

Flashbacks always welcome, Nash! You know I value your insights. I liked the sentence about "... when in 'chosen' Company" expressing their darkest sentiments. It's certainly something to consider. I'm definitely going to have to think about it. I do like that idea that some in the Chapter might be a little discontent, might point towards the end of the millennium as a time where only the 'pure' can be saved by the Emperor.

 

The difference between moderates and zealots is an interesting separation, one that I cannot seem to wrap my head around fully. These are Space Marines, so what would a moderate Space Marine be? Are Moderates like the Salamanders who live amongst their population helping them and teaching them? Or is a moderate Space Marine someone who would only kill all of the heretics and their families instead of the entire planetary population? I ran into this same situation when I was trying to develop the Character of my Marshal.

 

It's a little difficult to explain. I'll see if I can work up something that defines the difference. In a way, it's like Christianity - there are many sub-sects, and whilst there are some people who might subscribe to a particular doctrine, say Methodism or the like, there are others who are harder to categorise. In that sense, it's difficult to point to Castigators and say "zealot" or "moderate". They're abstract labels that broadly group the Castigators, and the vast bulk of the Castigators would never say "I am a zealot" or "I am a moderate." If anything, they would be terms of derision. "He's such a zealot" or "He's too moderate."

 

In general, the 'zealots' are those that take the beliefs of the Castigators to extremes - they would advocate wiping out the Navigators, the Astropaths, refusing to work alongside other Chapters whom they believe are 'mutated', refusing to work alongside abhumans. People for whom genetic purity means a great deal. The moderates aren't fluffy bunny huggy people - they hate many of the things the zealots do, but they tolerate them. They might believe that the Emperor has a plan for the Castigators, and in order to fulfil that plan, they have to work alongside the Navigators, etc - people for whom the Emperor also has a plan. I don't quite think I'm explaining it. I did detai it earlier in the thread - I'll see if I can dig up specific posts for you to read.

 

 

 

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

 

Is that from Magic?

[Hasoroth]

It would be indeed sir! I'll send you some opinions on the recent going ons through MSN.

[Marshal Rohr]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

[Commissar Molotov]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

 

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

[Ferrus Manus]

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

Afraid so, check the link you'll find a 'Hell Stars of the Caron Nebula' which isn't quite the same, just depends on how similar you mind the names being. But to be honest, I'd be more worried about the Hive Fleet than the Ork presence.

link

[Commissar Molotov]

I refuse to ever pay attention to that map, I'm afraid. It's not even oriented properly - the Segmentum Pacificus should be in the west, and the Eastern fringes should be... east. I'm always going to stick with this. I'm after canon references where possible, in order to know if we're safe or not.

 

EDIT: I found this reference in UKWD303:

 

Every world in the Imperium is home to a culture unique to itself, and the people of each world worship the Emperor in a manner informed by its own characteristics. For the Helio-Cultists of Limnus Epsilon, for example, the Emperor resides in their sun, his warriors coming every century to claim the best of the world's youth to fight at his side within the fiery heart of their star. To the Apocalites of the worlds bordering the Hell-Stars of the Garon Nebula, he is the bringer of merciful death, deliverance from the evil that stalks their worlds by night.

 

And apparently in Codex: Black Templars, it apparently mentions that the Garon Crusade had 132 Battle-Brothers. The internet says the Crusade was "ill-fated", but doesn't say why.

[Ferrus Manus]

Found the reference:

One such crusade was led by Castellan Raimer, master of the strike cruiser Ophidium Gulf, and survivor of the ill-fated Garon crusade.

 

EDIT: and this :

"I saw the scene of massacre where the dead lay on the ground like fallen leaves in a forest. The settlers had not died as soldiers in the heat of battle, fired with adour and courage, with weapons in their hands and exchanging blow for blow. Theyhad died as helpless must, with their hearts filled with horror worse than death." - Excerpted from Inquisitor Barzano's investigation into the Garon Nebula Crusade

Now the word 'settlers' suggest to me that the Templars were purging worlds for them to be settled but something counter attacked and wiped them out. Maybe.

[Heru]

http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_white.jpg

 

Is that from Magic?

Aye I was doing the Magic "What colour are you test" and I noticed the symbol (seeing as I got the White result), and instantly thought about the starburst you keep going on about for one of your Captains who uses imagery of the sun.

 

 

 

I refuse to ever pay attention to that map, I'm afraid. It's not even oriented properly - the Segmentum Pacificus should be in the west, and the Eastern fringes should be... east.

They are look at the compass!

[Commissar Molotov]

Yes, but I'm old-fashioned. I like my north to face north. ;)

[Marshal Rohr]

Is there any information on what the Castigators are doing currently? Also I did some research on the Hell Stars, and the heavy ork presence makes that place truly vulnerable.

 

What sources have you found regarding the Hell Stars? Nothing I found on the internet is referenced. I didn't know there was a canon region known as the Hell Stars within the 40k universe. If it is, then I'll likely alter the region the Castigators reside within.

 

 

 

The Garon Nebula is a region in the Segmentum Tempestus, close to the Ork empire of Octavius and the advance path of Hive Fleet Leviathan.

 

In the back of the Black Templars Codex there is a reference to the Garon Crusade which leads into the Garon Nebula.

 

The Hell Stars are a group of closely packed Stars in the Garon Nebula. The Garon Nebula resides close to two Ork Home Worlds, V'Run and Jurn.

I found this in Lexicanum, 40k wiki, and other sites.

[Commissar Molotov]

The Garon Nebula is a region in the Segmentum Tempestus, close to the Ork empire of Octavius and the advance path of Hive Fleet Leviathan.

 

In the back of the Black Templars Codex there is a reference to the Garon Crusade which leads into the Garon Nebula.

 

The Hell Stars are a group of closely packed Stars in the Garon Nebula. The Garon Nebula resides close to two Ork Home Worlds, V'Run and Jurn.

I found this in Lexicanum, 40k wiki, and other sites.

 

Is that first paragraph taken from the Tyranid codex? My crack team of operatives have been searching through the various codices and I've discovered the map in the Black Templar Codex... I've definitely got some thinking to do. I've always said the Castigators were located within the Ultima Segmentum, but it seems now I have the choice of either moving them to the Hell-Stars, or changing the name of my Hell-Stars.

 

I'm actually inclined towards the former. It'd certainly be interesting to have them near Leviathan and those Orks...

[Nash Trickster]

Just a thought: the very fact that they are AFAIK always referred to in the official fluff as the "Hell Stars of the Garon Nebula" seem to suggest that there could be other places named "Hell Stars" which wouldn't be in the Garon Nebula...

 

It could even suggest that (at least one of) the "other" Hell-Stars are even more famous than these. A little bit like most of the time people will spontaneously say "Paris, Texas" when speaking about this town, but won't feel the need to make any precision when talking about the capital of France... :D

 

The main problem I'd see with moving the Castigators there is that the place is already crowded with official chapters: the Black Templars have a Crusade there, the Soul Drinkers are in the area too, as well as some Crimson Fists and Howling Griffons (at least according to the Soul Drinkers novels)...

 

Well, that's your decision but, if I were you, I'd rather create my own group of stars (and give yourself the opportunity to devellop your own Imperial Sector one day if you wish to ;) ) than risking that GW one day decides to have a "Hell Stars Summer Campaign" which could have a negative impact on your work...

[Commissar Molotov]

Just a thought: the very fact that they are AFAIK always referred to in the official fluff as the "Hell Stars of the Garon Nebula" seem to suggest that there could be other places named "Hell Stars" which wouldn't be in the Garon Nebula...

 

It could even suggest that (at least one of) the "other" Hell-Stars are even more famous than these. A little bit like most of the time people will spontaneously say "Paris, Texas" when speaking about this town, but won't feel the need to make any precision when talking about the capital of France... ;)

 

You make a good point, but then some of the (unreferenced) quotes I've read on the internet have suggested that the Garon Nebula 'contains the Hell Stars'.

 

The main problem I'd see with moving the Castigators there is that the place is already crowded with official chapters: the Black Templars have a Crusade there, the Soul Drinkers are in the area too, as well as some Crimson Fists and Howling Griffons (at least according to the Soul Drinkers novels)...

 

I didn't know this. I'm not keen to be near the Soul Drinkers! ;)

 

Well, that's your decision but, if I were you, I'd rather create my own group of stars (and give yourself the opportunity to devellop your own Imperial Sector one day if you wish to ;) ) than risking that GW one day decides to have a "Hell Stars Summer Campaign" which could have a negative impact on your work...

 

Well, I thought I had named my own area of space when I came up with the Hell Stars. And I had idly considered moving them across to the official Hell Stars, but it does seem like a bit of a rough area to be in. I'm now leaning towards keeping the Castigators in their own area. I did quite like the 'X Stars' name, though. There are the Halo Stars, the Ghost Stars, the Ghoul Stars and the Grendl Stars. I'll have to think about something that'll work... :sick:

 

Thanks for the heads up, Nash.

[Marshal Rohr]

The main problem I'd see with moving the Castigators there is that the place is already crowded with official chapters: the Black Templars HAD a Crusade there, the Soul Drinkers are in the area too, as well as some Crimson Fists and Howling Griffons (at least according to the Soul Drinkers novels)...

 

 

I have altered the statement to the correct tense, that crusade is over and "ill-fated" the only official Crusade in the area is the Ophidium Gulf, but they have not made their scheduled check with the Eternal Crusader.

 

Whether or not the Soul Drinkers and Howling Griffons are there is really unspectacular, because that tract of space is enormous and the Loki Sector is on the other end away from where the Garon Crusade was operating.

[Nash Trickster]

I didn't know this. I'm not keen to be near the Soul Drinkers! ;)

That's partly why I mentionned it, just to let you know that by moving there you'd get "special" neighbours :cuss

 

I'm now leaning towards keeping the Castigators in their own area. I did quite like the 'X Stars' name, though. There are the Halo Stars, the Ghost Stars, the Ghoul Stars and the Grendl Stars. I'll have to think about something that'll work... :devil:

The name doesn't need to be "dark" though... I quite like how Dan Abnett named the most dangerous tract of space in the Helican Sector "Lucky Space", for one needs to be lucky to ever get out of it.

 

I don't know if this "nickname" exist in english (I guess so but I couldn't find it on Google) but the french sailors call the places located south of the 50th southern parallel "les 50èmes Hurlants" (which I guess would translate as "the 50th Howling")... And I've thus thought about naming a tract of space "The Howling Stars" (named so because there would be very strong Warp currents and/or stellar winds in that region), but, since I haven't used it yet, and if you like the name of course, I'd gladly leave it to you ;)

[Marshal Rohr]

Their was a previous "howling" although that was an event as opposed to a place. It would be interesting if the Castigators homeworld was past a very rough Warp Route, so they are the last line of defense for the worlds past it (this also lends to their belief that they are the guardians of humanity.

 

Another scenario might be to leave them in the actual Hell Stars, this is obscure enough to let you do your thing without GW interference but it also lets everyone else know where the Castigators are situated so they can infer your regular enemies.

[Commissar Molotov]

I have altered the statement to the correct tense, that crusade is over and "ill-fated" the only official Crusade in the area is the Ophidium Gulf, but they have not made their scheduled check with the Eternal Crusader.

 

Whether or not the Soul Drinkers and Howling Griffons are there is really unspectacular, because that tract of space is enormous and the Loki Sector is on the other end away from where the Garon Crusade was operating.

 

Well, I've not seen the Nebula on any (reliable) Galaxy map. It's difficult to make any calls on just how big an area the Hell Stars encompass. Plus, as Nash mentions, it's all-too-easy for GW to make a "Hell Stars summer campaign", and then I'm screwed. Something I've always encouraged is to exist in the cracks of the 40k universe - that way I'm safe®.

 

I don't know if this "nickname" exist in english (I guess so but I couldn't find it on Google) but the french sailors call the places located south of the 50th southern parallel "les 50èmes Hurlants" (which I guess would translate as "the 50th Howling")... And I've thus thought about naming a tract of space "The Howling Stars" (named so because there would be very strong Warp currents and/or stellar winds in that region), but, since I haven't used it yet, and if you like the name of course, I'd gladly leave it to you :tu:

 

I do like "The Howling Stars". It gives an idea of a wild, tempestuous area of space. Based off that name, I had the idea that warp currents are unpredictable or dangerous. The Castigators would be well-placed in such an area, and it would also tie in with the vessel that originally crashed on Losanco Secundus.

 

Barret and I were discussing last night about diverging from the "X Stars" archetype. After all, there are areas like the Damocles Gulf, the Perditus Rift, the something Veil (from Mass Effect). We'd considered the Hades Veil, the Tartarus Gulf... but the Howling Stars... it sounds very interesting indeed.

 

Thank you, Nash... I'll have to think about it.

 

Their was a previous "howling" although that was an event as opposed to a place. It would be interesting if the Castigators homeworld was past a very rough Warp Route, so they are the last line of defense for the worlds past it (this also lends to their belief that they are the guardians of humanity.

 

Another scenario might be to leave them in the actual Hell Stars, this is obscure enough to let you do your thing without GW interference but it also lets everyone else know where the Castigators are situated so they can infer your regular enemies.

 

Good spot on 'the Howling' from the rulebook. I don't think it would impact too much if I used the name. I was also thinking about rough warp routes, so it could well work.

[Marshal Rohr]

I have altered the statement to the correct tense, that crusade is over and "ill-fated" the only official Crusade in the area is the Ophidium Gulf, but they have not made their scheduled check with the Eternal Crusader.

 

Whether or not the Soul Drinkers and Howling Griffons are there is really unspectacular, because that tract of space is enormous and the Loki Sector is on the other end away from where the Garon Crusade was operating.

 

Well, I've not seen the Nebula on any (reliable) Galaxy map. It's difficult to make any calls on just how big an area the Hell Stars encompass. Plus, as Nash mentions, it's all-too-easy for GW to make a "Hell Stars summer campaign", and then I'm screwed. Something I've always encouraged is to exist in the cracks of the 40k universe - that way I'm safe®.

 

I don't know if this "nickname" exist in english (I guess so but I couldn't find it on Google) but the french sailors call the places located south of the 50th southern parallel "les 50èmes Hurlants" (which I guess would translate as "the 50th Howling")... And I've thus thought about naming a tract of space "The Howling Stars" (named so because there would be very strong Warp currents and/or stellar winds in that region), but, since I haven't used it yet, and if you like the name of course, I'd gladly leave it to you :tu:

 

I do like "The Howling Stars". It gives an idea of a wild, tempestuous area of space. Based off that name, I had the idea that warp currents are unpredictable or dangerous. The Castigators would be well-placed in such an area, and it would also tie in with the vessel that originally crashed on Losanco Secundus.

 

Barret and I were discussing last night about diverging from the "X Stars" archetype. After all, there are areas like the Damocles Gulf, the Perditus Rift, the something Veil (from Mass Effect). We'd considered the Hades Veil, the Tartarus Gulf... but the Howling Stars... it sounds very interesting indeed.

 

The Perseus Veil, its the space past those human colonies on the Perseus Arm. Not to jack anything from Mass Effect but you could exist out there, beware rampant Tyranids and the flickering Astronomican though. If you really feel adventurous maybe the Castigators have been purging local worlds of Genestealer infestations that may be summoning a new bigger Hive Fleet. Or maybe the Castigators have already made contact with it and are fighting it unbeknownst the the Imperium.

 

THe Howling Stars does sound tempestuous (is that even a word?). Do you plan on keeping Losanco Secundus in the Ultima Segmentum, or are you going to move it? If you put it in the Segmentum Tempestus you are "fairly" centrally located, and here there is no doubt to be some rough warp currents.

 

Maybe you should put it on one of the Spiral Arms or even close to the Core. Densely packed stars=lots of gravity=tough traveling.

[Commissar Molotov]

The Perseus Veil, its the space past those human colonies on the Perseus Arm. Not to jack anything from Mass Effect but you could exist out there, beware rampant Tyranids and the flickering Astronomican though. If you really feel adventurous maybe the Castigators have been purging local worlds of Genestealer infestations that may be summoning a new bigger Hive Fleet. Or maybe the Castigators have already made contact with it and are fighting it unbeknownst the the Imperium.

 

THe Howling Stars does sound tempestuous (is that even a word?). Do you plan on keeping Losanco Secundus in the Ultima Segmentum, or are you going to move it? If you put it in the Segmentum Tempestus you are "fairly" centrally located, and here there is no doubt to be some rough warp currents.

 

Maybe you should put it on one of the Spiral Arms or even close to the Core. Densely packed stars=lots of gravity=tough traveling.

 

That's the one - Barret mentioned it to me last night but I forgot the name. As for stranding the Castigators out on the edge of known space, I'm not inclined to do so. For two reasons, really. One - most people place their DIYs on the Eastern Fringes. Two - it seems to take away too much from the Redemptors, who are stranded on the edges of known space, fighting where the light of the Astronomicon is weak and they have very little contact with the Imperium.

 

I'm content with leaving Losanco in the Ultima Segmentum, but perhaps relatively central, rather than on the eastern fringe. I did have fluff at one stage that Captain Timon and the Fourth were the only Company to've fought the Tau.