Plastic Legio Custodes Battlegroup + Coronus Grav-Carrier + Venatari + Liber

[Orange Knight]

Getting back to the models.

 

I know GW said that the infantry models are perfect to use in Warhammer 40k, but I really don't trust them when it comes to the vehicles.

 

I have a sinking feeling that these tanks and dreads will be moved to Legends come 11th edition, and they'll be a focus for the 30k force.

 

Unless I see a seperate Warhammer 40k box, I'm not convinced. 

 

 

**Edit**

 

One last thing I simply want to point out regarding the female custodes discussion. This is in response to @Lord_Ikka

 

We all recognise this can be a sensitive issue, but it is also a part of the release and something GW themselves have called attention to.

 

We can't simply avoid all discussion on the subject as it's one of the defining aspects of this updated release.

 

If this discussion is banned, then we also need to ban any further discussion on whether GW was right to introduce the Primaris, and if people like/dislike the change. There is a parallel here, that being a change to existing lore and status quo - although I would argue this is worse because it's a retcon and not a plot development. 

 

 

Edited January 17 by Orange Knight

[Craig]

7 minutes ago, Orange Knight said:

 

I would personally like it if GW released a Grav Landraider to replace the original tracked model.

 

I imagine many people would disagree with this change, and in their eyes, it could damage a venerable design they have admired for decades.

 

Does my personal situation override what the wider community wants?

If GW released something you liked and didn't force everyone else to buy it who is losing out exactly? If the tracked model sits next to the grav model on the shelf why does it hurt the community? I'm an advocate for choice, I don't see how this would hurt you.

[Orange Knight]

3 minutes ago, Craig said:

If GW released something you liked and didn't force everyone else to buy it who is losing out exactly? If the tracked model sits next to the grav model on the shelf why does it hurt the community? I'm an advocate for choice, I don't see how this would hurt you.

 

It doesn't hurt me. I'm just saying that even if something is right for me, on an anecdotal or subjective basis, it might not be right for others for their own reasons.

[hd3]

9 minutes ago, Craig said:

If GW released something you liked and didn't force everyone else to buy it who is losing out exactly? If the tracked model sits next to the grav model on the shelf why does it hurt the community? I'm an advocate for choice, I don't see how this would hurt you.

 

 

I think that's the real disconnect here.  You're treating this as adding an optional product. We are talking about retroactively changing a shared fictional history, and that’s a fundamentally different thing.

 

If they had added a new female faction, none of this discussion would've happened. If they'd been cool, they would've been welcomed with open arms. But instead they retconned an existing faction for reasons which, in the MOST charitable reading remain unclear.

Edited January 17 by hd3

[Craig]

3 minutes ago, Orange Knight said:

 

It doesn't hurt me. I'm just saying that even if something is right for me, on an anecdotal or subjective basis, it might not be right for others for their own reasons.

Then they can choose not to purchase something they don't want or use optional parts on their model.

[Karhedron]

18 minutes ago, Orange Knight said:

I have a sinking feeling that these tanks and dreads will be moved to Legends come 11th edition, and they'll be a focus for the 30k force.

 

Yes, I bought a Spartan for my 40K Wolves that got punted to Legends before it ever actually hit the table. Those sorts of memories linger. 

[Captain Idaho]

Oddly enough, I see the models are amazing in so many ways, an improvement. Except the bare heads are too much... in proportion? Which makes them look small.

 

Go helmets.

[Orange Knight]

I think I would actually have been much more ok with this if it was a plot development and not a retcon.

 

Remember how Malcador once asked if it would have been better to make the Primarchs women instead of men?

There is some precedent here for super-powered, genetically engineered women, which is fine as a concept.

 

"In the dark days of M42, with the Custodes once again engaged in the galaxy, ancient sciences developed by the Emperor, but not utilised prior, are now needed to stem the losses incurred"

 

Something like that

 

 

[hd3]

3 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

 

Yes, I bought a Spartan for my 40K Wolves that got punted to Legends before it ever actually hit the table. Those sorts of memories linger. 

 

I feel you. My friend finished her  Spartan for the 'pez dispenser of evil' strategy of vomiting out khorne berserkers each turn  round the same time. Thankfully nobody in my club really cares if something has the legends key word.

Edited January 17 by hd3

[Orange Knight]

3 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

 

Yes, I bought a Spartan for my 40K Wolves that got punted to Legends before it ever actually hit the table. Those sorts of memories linger. 

 

Literally the same thing happened to me with my Imperial Fists. I hadn't painted the model yet but had just finished building it...

 

In GW, we don't trust lol.

[WARMASTER_]

3 hours ago, Robbienw said:

So you are agreeing with what I said then, they’ve just got bigger and higher profile.

I don’t think you read my response because no, but it’s honestly a nothing argument the scale is still going to be out of whack whoever’s running it 

[Uprising]

Two things real quick:  

1.  Surpised this thread has not been locked yet.  

2.  When are we getting new Mister of Battles (male SOB) GW?  Lore does not matter anymore, so why not?  

 

Overall, These models are okay (Custodes never been my thing), but I really can't tell these models are female?  Should have given different chest plate and leg set like the stormcast range.  GW took the mid of the road and upset both parties at this point.  

[Orange Knight]

Just now, Uprising said:

Two things real quick:  

1.  Surpised this thread has not been locked yet.  

2.  When are we getting new Mister of Battles (male SOB) GW?  Lore does not matter anymore, so why not?  

 

Overall, These models are okay (Custodes never been my thing), but I really can't tell these models are female?  Should have given different chest plate and leg set like the stormcast range.  GW took the mid of the road and upset both parties at this point.  

 

Why should this be locked after we allowed 10 years of debate and discussion, often much more mean-spirited than this, about the changes introduced with the Primaris development?

 

I think people have been very respectful in this topic so far.

[Matcap86]

Gotta say I'm VERY happy with the plastic custodes tanks. The old resin versions were absolute arse to build with endless miscast issues for me. One of the few hobby projects I actually declared "failed". Always sad about that as I love the designs so these are grand. Like the new infantry designs, though I'm happy I got a few of the resin dreads and Venetari as I feel the resin detailing fits the ostentation more. 

[Jings]

13 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

Oddly enough, I see the models are amazing in so many ways, an improvement. Except the bare heads are too much... in proportion? Which makes them look small.

 

Go helmets.

 

I suppose I have the unpopular take on this but the heads being in proportion is a big plus for me. I think Marines (and by extension Custodes) look more hulking when their heads are more normal sized compared to their bodies. It's something I've enjoyed with the new range of Marines, the helmets and heads are smaller although the heads aren't all that much smaller than they should be. 

 

Tbf overall I'm quite a big fan of the refresh. Other than what we're not allowed to discuss anymore, I would have liked broader proportions and the lack of Aquila on the legs are my only grievances (badumtssss). The side by side comparisons really show the older kits age, particularly in the detailing. 

[Marshal Rohr]

1 hour ago, Orange Knight said:

 

Ok, but by the same token, the few women I know that engage in the hobby have no interest in female characters or factions, and instead collect the monstrous Tyranids or the goofy Orks. The only SoB collectors I know are men.

 

So my anecdotal conclusion differs from your anecdotal conclusion. Which is why we can't assign value based on them.

This is actually a sex thing, but that’s neither board appropriate or particularly relevant to Custodes. In several years the faction most closely representing twink hockey players will also be very popular with women gamers. 
 

 

source: wife is a widely read fanfic write

Edited January 17 by Marshal Rohr

[Captain Idaho]

 

9 minutes ago, Jings said:

I suppose I have the unpopular take on this but the heads being in proportion is a big plus for me. I think Marines (and by extension Custodes) look more hulking when their heads are more normal sized compared to their bodies. It's something I've enjoyed with the new range of Marines, the helmets and heads are smaller although the heads aren't all that much smaller than they should be. 

 

I agree to be fair, it's cool. I think here, with Custodes, the heads being the size they are makes them too small for how tall the legs must be.

 

In real world armour, based on science (sorcery if you ask me, just give me a hammer and nails) the height doesn't increase with the bulk of the armour, only the width.

 

So making them taller with those sized heads just makes their legs disproportionately long or they're wearing platforms better suited to an early John Travolta film.

[phandaal]

1 hour ago, Grotsmasha said:

This is all to say, if GW including gendered heads in boxes brins  more people into the hobby, we're all the better for it.

 

It won't, because the women who like wargaming (which is a very very very small percentage of women) were already able to pick female miniatures to play a game with, if that was the one thing that would have kept them from jumping into the hobby. This adds nothing different to what they were already able to do.

 

These femstodes will, by and large, be purchased by men and used in games with other men.

 

Ironically, female users on this very site have expressed their dislike for the change and been dogpiled for it. I assume people don't know they are doing it, and just figure that anyone who does not appreciate the change must be a man.

 

Edited January 17 by phandaal

[Crimson Longinus]

So I think the head size looks good, and I'm glad that there are female heads, but I have to say I don't actually like the details of the faces. I think they tried to give them classical Greek noses to make them look regal, but this has resulted the faces having rather odd proportions. The noses are weirdly long vertically. Why the long face?

[Redcomet]

1 hour ago, Orange Knight said:

Getting back to the models.

 

I know GW said that the infantry models are perfect to use in Warhammer 40k, but I really don't trust them when it comes to the vehicles.

 

I have a sinking feeling that these tanks and dreads will be moved to Legends come 11th edition, and they'll be a focus for the 30k force.

 

Unless I see a seperate Warhammer 40k box, I'm not convinced. 

 

 

**Edit**

 

One last thing I simply want to point out regarding the female custodes discussion. This is in response to @Lord_Ikka

 

We all recognise this can be a sensitive issue, but it is also a part of the release and something GW themselves have called attention to.

 

We can't simply avoid all discussion on the subject as it's one of the defining aspects of this updated release.

 

If this discussion is banned, then we also need to ban any further discussion on whether GW was right to introduce the Primaris, and if people like/dislike the change. There is a parallel here, that being a change to existing lore and status quo - although I would argue this is worse because it's a retcon and not a plot development. 

 

 

They clearly said “if the model has a 40k equivalent you can use it”

 

So the foot sloggers, shield captain is a go. Rest is not.

 

Maybe the 40k contemptor gets the same load outs as the HH, you can use that.
 

But as there are no grav tanks in the 40k codex now, it is a no on using these new ones.

[Casual Heresy]

6 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

So I think the head size looks good, and I'm glad that there are female heads, but I have to say I don't actually like the details of the faces. I think they tried to give them classical Greek noses to make them look regal, but this has resulted the faces having rather odd proportions. The noses are weirdly long vertically. Why the long face?

I feel the face sculpts will look better once we see non-eavy metal painters get ahold of them (as usual). The eavy metal style is usually very unflattering. 
 

 

[Marshal Rohr]

This current generation of Heavy Metal cannot stick the faces. It’s a universal critique of every new release. Everyone thought they added lady space marines and really the painter just used the girl color palette and nothing was feminine about the heads in plastic. 

Edited January 17 by Marshal Rohr

[No Foes Remain]

3 minutes ago, Casual Heresy said:

I feel the face sculpts will look better once we see non-eavy metal painters get ahold of them (as usual). The eavy metal style is usually very unflattering. 
 

 

I think it's the issue that the 'eavy metal painters have to edge highlight the edge highlights which makes them look very off.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Holy 10 pages in less than 24 hours.

 

I remember back in 2016 feeling like the custodes were....a bit off. It was very remarked on then, and people were very lukewarm on the first ever official custodes models. Their weapons were gigantic and their armour was way more bulky than what the art work had ever shown. Missing their capes really made them look like big power armour people. 

 

These absolutely fit the bill. Ya there's the retcon about women. But I wouldn't have helmet less ones either way because the faceless sentinels vibe is essential imo. 

Edited January 17 by SkimaskMohawk

[phandaal]

9 minutes ago, Marshal Rohr said:

This current generation of Heavy Metal cannot stick the faces. It’s a universal critique of every new release. Everyone thought they added lady space marines and really the painter just used the girl color palette and nothing was feminine about the heads in plastic. 

 

Some of that also came down to people not being familiar enough with different races. The heads people picked out as female mainly looked Asian or South American. And now we know from yesterday's Custodes article that those bros are in fact dudes, as we said all along.

 

But yes, something in GW's current painting style churns out some really terrible faces for some reason. Not every time, but when they miss, they miss hard. I say this as someone who doesn't even paint the eyes on my own faces, of course. The helmets are for realism!